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Old 15 February 2010, 21:36   #21
Photon
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Originally Posted by asm1 View Post
LL Didn't your * ever tell you that if you didn't have anything nice to say its best not to say anything at all....

I don't hate the ST its just "different"
(In a low, confidential voice 'It has "SPECIAL NEEDS"...' (making quotes with finger gesture)

Anyway, apart from being a downgrade from C-64 and having an idiotic and plasticky design and a keyboard designed by someone who doesn't type (apparently a design that was a winner in their book, since it was re-used in later models), let's leave the ST.

Instead I compared the number of computer designs, and it struck me that that's at least one of the things C= Amiga did right: A1000, CDTV, A600, CD32 and all the other designs: unique, different, nice to look at, well-designed, and a great feel of quality down to the last keycap.

AWESOME

The only exception is the A2000, but that was ofc the point, ie. look as boring as an industrial PC. Funnily enough, this is also the model where they had keyboard problems.

The four mentioned above are great in their own way, but if I had to pick one it would be A1000 . As beautiful as the Mac, but without the Steve Jobsey 'let's blackboxify it and screw it shut' MASSIVE visual impact at the time (almost as massive as the price tag ).
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Old 15 February 2010, 22:50   #22
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THE WAR IS NOT OVER YET!
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Old 15 February 2010, 22:52   #23
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THE WAR IS NOT OVER YET!
Sadly it is and we all lost. Acorn, Commodore, Sinclair and Atari all gone
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Old 15 February 2010, 23:10   #24
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Nobody won, so the war is still open 8)
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Old 15 February 2010, 23:23   #25
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Yes were all going to lose in the end ha ha ha he he he.
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Old 15 February 2010, 23:38   #26
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Yes frank_b I would be the first to admit the atari later became a fine machine after all professional musicians made music on it and there is a lot of excellent music software made for it but in the early days of the 16 bit war the amiga had an head start and you could not fault it and first impressions count and by the time atari got it right the amiga was to well established to lose the 16 bit war and everybody was going to support the winner and not the loser.
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Old 15 February 2010, 23:42   #27
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Did it REALLY have a Speccy 128 sound chip inside? The Supercars 2 and Xenon 2 intro make me laugh
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Old 15 February 2010, 23:44   #28
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Yes frank_b I would be the first to admit the atari later became a fine machine after all professional musicians made music on it and there is a lot of excellent music software made for it but in the early days of the 16 bit war the amiga had an head start and you could not fault it and first impressions count and by the time atari got it right the amiga was to well established to lose the 16 bit war and everybody was going to support the winner and not the loser.
Yeah then Commodore gave it both feet, both barrels.
Atari limped on for a bit longer before doing the same.

The ST had the head start IMHO with most Amiga games being ST ports till beast came along. I think the real reason both machines died was due to the lack of R&D. Both companies were complacent trying to milk the older hardware for as long as possible. By the time the newer consoles came out they were too far behind. Atari wasted money on the Jaguar and Commodore delayed AAA opting instead for AGA which was nowhere near as elegant as the original chip set. Still we have some classic games so it isn't all bad

Frank
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Old 15 February 2010, 23:46   #29
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Did it REALLY have a Speccy 128 sound chip inside? The Supercars 2 and Xenon 2 intro make me laugh
Nope. Clone of the same though. Really odd choice of sound chip. Can't grumble now with what they're getting out of it today though! SID voice sounds pretty damn cool IMHO.

It's worth mentioning it was in an ST long before the 128k was a gleam in Sir Clive's eye too
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Old 16 February 2010, 00:05   #30
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What did commodore is they took to many risks investing in new ventures anyway as the saying go's nothing lasts forever and the 16 bit era was great when it lasted.
The 1980s & 1990s was the golden era of computing when you got back bedroom programmers making great games now all that is gone and most kids nowadays will never have the joy of making there own games a great shame.
All that we can do for now is that we preserve the games for future generations to come.
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Old 16 February 2010, 00:11   #31
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All that we can do for now is that we preserve the games for future generations to come.
I am preserving as hell!
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Old 16 February 2010, 00:46   #32
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ok moving on, which is the best case design the amiga ever came up with?
Lorraine, well sort of
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Old 16 February 2010, 01:17   #33
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i've literally just come back from work and checked this thread.

oh my..... what have I started.....
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Old 16 February 2010, 02:57   #34
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i've literally just come back from work and checked this thread.

oh my..... what have I started.....

With a thread title and first post like these what in goodness name did you expect ?

Anywhere else it would be called trolling but um I guess its ok cos this is an Amiga board Bashing the ST seems to get you brownie points here


Anyways arguing over long dead systems is moot. Back in the day I had an Acorn Archimedes and loved it, in some ways it crapped on both the Amiga and ST (RISC chip, nicer looking OS). Sadly as Frank said above, all three companies and their systems are gone, so whats the point ?

Sure its all a bit of fun, but its funny that the Atari people on their Forums don't act like trolls regarding the Amiga isn't it? Indeed many have an Amiga or three in addition to their Atari collection... but not many here will admit to having an ST... lol.

Me ? I'm getting a Falcon Does that mean I'm taking sides ? Nope, I just like old kit, and the Falcon intrigues me

Lol @ you worring about how crap the ST is.... Compared to what ? the Amiga ?, The Archimedes ?. Maybe, but really comapred to modern kit our Beloved "Insert retro kit name here" sucks major donkey balls.

Unless you are still living in 1992. "But Old0r is better"! I hear the kiddies scream. Yeah but I'm sure no one, myself included would trade their Dual or Quad core PC/Mac for a 286 PC or a Mac SE as your main machine now would you...... nope thought not

"But We are better than them!"


Please, lol, grow up.

silly people

PS Mine's better than yours! Why ? it just IS end of (another argument you cant win)

Last edited by asm1; 16 February 2010 at 03:02.
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Old 16 February 2010, 04:30   #35
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I used to like my Atari STFM back in the day, it was so much better than a PC would have been for the same money.
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Old 16 February 2010, 11:29   #36
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maybe we should organise an Amiga/Atari bash....
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Old 16 February 2010, 15:54   #37
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Originally Posted by killergorilla View Post
Can't say I think of anything man made as beautiful.
Not even the Aston Martin DB9?

Back on topic. It was my main system between 87 - 89 and I quite liked the Atari ST back in the late 80's.

It's case design wasn't quite as good as the Amiga A500's, but it was still a nice design compared to most of the 8-bit systems that came before.

I would say the ST plastic wasn't as nice as the Amiga and felt a bit flimsy. The internal PSU was also problematic. With my STFM I had to tap the top of the case over the PSU to sometimes make it work as the PSUs PCB had become slightly warped and created dry joint problems.

As for the best designed and best looking Amiga, I would have to say the original A500. Whenever I heard the word Amiga the A500 is the model that instantly comes into my mind. In the UK at least it was the model we all knew and loved.

As someone else said, the A1200 looks OK but is too thin. It definitely needed to be a little bit longer at the back to look perfect.

The second for me would be the A1000, as it had a unique Amiga like design about it that was original and interesting. You can't say the same about the later big box Amigas though. Most were just huge square boxes, especially the A2000. The A3000 was probably the best looking of the bunch. And I hated the design of the towers. They all looked like ugly 80's huge PC systems.

Worst design probably had to be the CD32. They tried too hard to copy the Megadrive, but without any logical reason why. They should have made it look more like the Dreamcast if they wanted to top loading system.
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Old 16 February 2010, 20:26   #38
athiga
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i think if amiga made a come back it would be a A600 as it looks modern and compact
the A1000 looks best and the keyboard garage was origonal but useless

check this out

http://www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk/Mus...hone/index.php
its balls
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Old 16 February 2010, 20:30   #39
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Too bad I haven't seen the original post
Guess I would've said : Naughty lost_lemming

On topic : A500 (maybe the A1200 looked a tad nicer, but I would never admit that )
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Old 17 February 2010, 18:20   #40
athiga
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also staying on topic the st had more games in the early days because
it was less complex to code on 'with out all the custom chips .i never coded
on the st but thats the impression i got. as for its looks' ive seen better
paving slabs. and the thought of it sounding like a speccy didnt apeal to me
at all
alot of st ports didnt add any hardware improvements
such as gold runner ect

good for to you if you like them am not anti atari but lean far to amiga
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