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Old 14 September 2013, 00:30   #341
Retro1234
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I think the Amiga had great independent platformers like Bubble and Squeak

Zool I dont think this did slow down much on basic A500? Think I read the author spent hardly anytime on Amiga and played mostly console games and tried to recreate this - he tried to clone sonic and made a mediocore game.
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Old 14 September 2013, 00:33   #342
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The Sonic clone comparison will for ever haunt it to it's grave thanks to the hype that killed it.
They marketed it like that, stupid enough. I think the music for both games was unfitable too. Don't think that they carefully thought out the whole game concept.

Maybe the guideline was: "We need something as cool as Sonic. So guys, do it!" But then there was even a sequel, but they didn't learned from the first game.

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Old 14 September 2013, 00:44   #343
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Maybe the guideline was: "We need something as cool as Sonic. So guys, do it!" But then there was even a sequel, but they didn't learned from the first game.
It makes your head spin. I think this happened quite a bit once commodore realized the momentum the consoles had in the games market. It makes me wonder if Gremlin was asked to make this for Commodore in order to compete with the consoles? Hmmm.
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Old 14 September 2013, 00:48   #344
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I think Commodore wanted it as a mascot for their new A600. Just like Sonic for Sega. I don't know if they asked Gremlin to create it, but it's seemed to fit their ads.


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Old 14 September 2013, 00:58   #345
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Ah that would make sense, would be interesting to know if there was some pressure directly from commodore on gremlin to make it though, maybe Gremlin wanted to make something else? Interesting.

The poster reminds me of a Terry Gilliam animation in a bizarre way LOL
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Old 14 September 2013, 01:01   #346
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"Against that much action hedgehogs have no chance. Insider play ZOOL now."

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Old 14 September 2013, 01:02   #347
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It is Commodore 16/+4 joystick?
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Old 14 September 2013, 01:15   #348
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"Against that much action hedgehogs have no chance. Insider play ZOOL now."
Oh dear (Shakes head) I wonder what the magazines secretly thought about it?

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It is Commodore 16/+4 joystick?
It does look remarkably similar. The future of gaming right there Oh Commodore, it's a good thing your computer was so great.
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Old 14 September 2013, 09:55   #349
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Because i didn't program them !

Next question !



That was a joke, just in case,
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Old 14 September 2013, 17:12   #350
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So, if the manual had said:
Zool is a gremlin "Ninja of the Nth Dimension" who is forced to land on Earth. In order to gain ninja ranking he has to pass six lands, because a ranked Ninja can marry!

.. then it would have been a much better game?
It's not about what the manual says, it's about the idea that forms the foundation of the game and holds it together as a coherent whole. Zool didn't have that. It just had sweets land, music land etc. Nobody reads the manual anyway but you have to start the design process with an idea of a story and build on that if the end product is to make any sense.

In Zool's case the written story seemed even to contradict the game. It says he landed on Earth, but I don't see any Earth landscapes there. I don't know where in the Earth he landed to find himself on a giant cake. Obviously they just made some different levels and added a "story" as an afterthought because a game ought to have one.

In Super Mario Brothers the princess is in a castle, somewhere, so Mario has to go look in all the castles. And such he does. It's not much of a plot, but it gives a framework. There is an implicit narrative there that gives the game meaning and purpose, and you don't need to read the manual to get it.
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Old 14 September 2013, 17:31   #351
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Because i didn't program them !

Next question !

That was a joke, just in case,
What's stopping you though? Get to it, man!
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Old 14 September 2013, 19:40   #352
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Mrs Beanbag is so right. A complete game should consist of a complete package, including a nice story. Sure, it's not the story that will uplift a game to classic status, especially a simple platformer, but still. Take a look at Shadow Of The Beast. Its poignant story is still remembered today and has done wonders to hide the less than stellar gameplay. Zool would have benefited a lot from a simple, yet consistent story.
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Old 14 September 2013, 20:31   #353
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I think the impact a story has on a game is subjective. I can see why it would make Zool a better game for some, but for me, it would still be a very average platformer.
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Old 15 September 2013, 10:57   #354
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Hi everyone. Old Amiga owner/fan here. Feeling xtra nostalgic today..so here I am!

On the subject: Actually Risky Woods, Jim Power, Turrican II and Superfrog on the Amiga are my favorite platformers independent of system/platform. Ofc as an Amiga fan I may be biased but you can't deny the fact that these are quality productions, right? Nothing mediocre about them imho.

PS: Jim Power was ported to the consoles but the Amiga ver was clearly the best - I never cared about the "vibrant color" palettes of megadrive and snes, if you know what I mean. Plus Paula did wonders for this game..remember the amazing music?!

Oh and before I forget, something irrelevant but just so you'll better understand what kind of guy I am, since this is my 1st post and all:
Breathless > Doom \m/
 
Old 15 September 2013, 14:42   #355
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Can't agree with Risky Woods. It has some nicely drawn graphics, yes. Neverending hordes of enemies, boring level design, jerky scrolling for the main character and some controls/timing issues. Mediocre is the perfect description for any Dinamic game.

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Old 15 September 2013, 15:17   #356
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The problem for Amiga games is cost. To develop for console, it was expensive because of licensing and cartridge cost, and because of that, they generally stuck a load of people on it to get the best effort.

Would presume that the first Sonic on Megadrive was at minimum ten people if not more, Amiga Zool was three people with probably a much smaller brief I.e. "do a game like Sonic for Amiga, you've got five months to get it done, crack on".

The 'design' would have been, "George, you adapt your Switchblade 2 engine, whilst we do a sweet world, cake world, toy world, and then we will do the maps as we go along, tell Patrick what memory size he has to work with for music right at the end of the project."

The problem for the Amiga was because people could self publish without the interference from the likes of Sega and Nintendo, and was significantly cheaper to do so, they could cut corners, the product didn't have to be so polished because the cost of releasing was less.

Look at the likes of Factor 5 that were influenced by early Megadrive titles, and the extra polish in their titles is all too apparent, X-Out and Turrican wouldn't have looked out of place at all on console when they were released, better teamwork, the music was an integral part of the experience, not an after thought.

However, some titles defy the UK developer mentality, Fire n Ice is a highly polished product irrespective of it being developed for Amiga first, but that recall should have been how Amiga platformers were from the start.
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Old 15 September 2013, 15:29   #357
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I think the impact a story has on a game is subjective. I can see why it would make Zool a better game for some, but for me, it would still be a very average platformer.
Oh there are plenty of other things wrong with it, but I think it's all essentially symptomatic of the same attitude, "just make a game, and quickly!" without having an idea first, and taking the time to think it through.

EDIT: or in other words, exactly what Galahad/FLT just said
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Old 15 September 2013, 15:50   #358
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Why are platform games on the Amiga really mediocre?

Yep agreed.

A lot of people hold it up as a platform classic, but I think Sonic is hugely overrated. Gorgeous graphics and technically impressive yes, but it only really works at breakneck speed. Anything slower and it's a sluggish, awkward hassle. Ok, breakneck speed is the point of Sonic, but that doesn't make for a great platform game for me, just a showy speed-fest.

I much prefer some less pretty, less technically impressive purer examples on Amiga.
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Old 20 September 2013, 00:09   #359
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anyone else here read through their own comments sometimes and realise they've basically written a load of rubbish. I do
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Old 20 September 2013, 00:30   #360
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anyone else here read through their own comments sometimes and realise they've basically written a load of rubbish. I do
No, I don't. Maybe it's just you.
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