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Old 09 May 2009, 15:32   #1
Loedown
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What Is SFS?

Greetings,
I've seen many people mention SFS, I know of PFS and I use FFS on my B2000.

Is there a thread that explains the difference and I know that people insist on using SFS for bigger partitions and alike, but I don't know why?

Thanks,

Paul
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Old 09 May 2009, 16:17   #2
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All three are file systems. The method and arrangement of data on the hard drive and in memory. The software for accessing data stored within the file system is kept on the hard drive and run at boot. Before you can use a particular file system this software must be installed on the hard drive (into the RDB?)

As well as the file system the hard disk driver plays an important part in compatibility with larger disks. The hard disk driver is usually store in ROM, either in the Kickstart ROM for Amiga's with integrated hard drive controllers or a separate ROM on the hard disk interface card.

You need both the file system and the hard disk driver to be capable of accessing larger hard drives and using larger partitions.

For a B2000 which has no integrated hard disk controller, the first thing to do is find out which hard disk controller you have. Then determine which version of its hard disk driver is in it's ROM.

If it is early then you may have to replace the ROM in order to access big hard drives.

SFS needs an 020+ CPU and so unless you have an accelerator in your B2000 you cannot use it.

FFS has been upgraded over the years and the latest version (45.13 + patch) will support larger partitions with an appropriate hard disk controller + driver. Dunno if this is 68000 compatible.

PFS3 is the last version of PFS and it has a 68000 version and so can be used with a B2000 and appropriate hard disk controller + driver.

One final word of caution. In order to create partitions of a particular file system (yes you can have different file systems for different partitions on the same physical hard drive) you must use a partitioning tool. Such as HDToolbox. Unfortunately some versions of HDToolbox also suffer from incompatibilities with bigger hard drives. You must use later versions or a 3rd party alternative to successfully create partitions.

Last edited by alexh; 09 May 2009 at 16:39.
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Old 09 May 2009, 16:42   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alexh View Post
All three are file systems. The method and arrangement of data on the hard drive and in memory. The software for accessing data stored within the file system is kept on the hard drive and run at boot. Before you can use a particular file system this software must be installed on the hard drive (into the RDB?)

As well as the file system the hard disk driver plays an important part in compatibility with larger disks. The hard disk driver is usually store in ROM, either in the Kickstart ROM for Amiga's with integrated hard drive controllers or a separate ROM on the hard disk interface card.

You need both the file system and the hard disk driver to be capable of accessing larger hard drives and using larger partitions.

For a B2000 which has no integrated hard disk controller, the first thing to do is find out which hard disk controller you have. Then determine which version of its hard disk driver is in it's ROM.

If it is early then you may have to replace the ROM in order to access big hard drives.

SFS needs an 020+ CPU and so unless you have an accelerator in your B2000 you cannot use it.

FFS has been upgraded over the years and the latest version (45.13 + patch) will support larger partitions with an appropriate hard disk controller + driver. Dunno if this is 68000 compatible.

PFS3 is the last version of PFS and it has a 68000 version and so can be used with a B2000 and appropriate hard disk controller + driver.

One final word of caution. In order to create partitions of a particular file system (yes you can have different file systems for different partitions on the same physical hard drive) you must use a partitioning tool. Such as HDToolbox. Unfortunately some versions of HDToolbox also suffer from incompatibilities with bigger hard drives. You must use later versions or a 3rd party alternative to successfully create partitions.
Accelerator I have, a GVP '030 Combo board, so I should be able to use SFS, now what are the requirements?

I would think that SFS stood for Slow File System, as opposed to Fast File System and Professional File System and whilst I appreciate your answer, could the benefits and detriments of each system be outlayed here?

Paul
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Old 09 May 2009, 17:06   #4
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SFS is the greatest of the 3 file system. But as Alexh said, it is only 020+ machines...
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Old 09 May 2009, 17:18   #5
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Originally Posted by Loedown View Post
Accelerator I have, a GVP '030 Combo board, so I should be able to use SFS
Yes.

You'll still need to find out what version of hard disk driver you have on the SCSI controller to see if you can use big hard drives. v4.15 was the last. Unfortunately I do not know the history of GVP hard disk drivers and so I cannot tell you the minimum version you need.

Open a CLI window and type "version gvpscsi.device"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loedown View Post
now what are the requirements?
?? A method of getting the SFS software from the internet onto your Amiga. A spare hard drive to try it with or a backup of your hard drive & set of working workbench disks in case something goes wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loedown View Post
I would think that SFS stood for Slow File System, as opposed to Fast File System and Professional File System
Thought is not a very good tool, Google however would have revealed : SMART File System

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loedown View Post
could the benefits and detriments of each system be outlayed here?l
Try and find out.

Benefits :
  • The main one is speed, SFS & PFS are usually much MUCH faster than even the last version of FFS using the same disk controller. Speed is achieved by using caches and more intelligent coding.
  • Disk Validation, FFS requires long periods of validation if corruption took place perhaps by a power off during a write. SFS and PFS use something like a journalling file system which means it does not need to validate.
Detriments: Fewer tools such as defragmentation and disk recovery but then who ever uses them these days?

Last edited by alexh; 09 May 2009 at 17:28.
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Old 26 June 2009, 10:55   #6
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Can anyone point me to a guide to setting up SFS? i.e. what software I need, where to install things to etc.. I tried to set up ShapeShifter last night and hard disk access was painfully slow I gather this is due to using an old version of FFS?
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Old 26 June 2009, 11:26   #7
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Ill have to test out sometime unless anyone knows if FAT32 can be used for large HD and maybe works on 68000.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rabbit80 View Post
Can anyone point me to a guide to setting up SFS? i.e. what software I need, where to install things to etc.. I tried to set up ShapeShifter last night and hard disk access was painfully slow I gather this is due to using an old version of FFS?
Mr Killergorilla does a good guide to SFS
http://wiki.abime.net/amiga:killergo...winuae_realhdd

As for Shapeshifter slow harddisk access if you copy your Mac boot/OS hard file over to Ram and point Shapeshifter towards this, it will run a lot faster.
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Old 26 June 2009, 11:50   #8
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Thanks
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Old 26 June 2009, 11:52   #9
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Originally Posted by Boo Boo View Post
As for Shapeshifter slow harddisk access if you copy your Mac boot/OS hard file over to Ram and point Shapeshifter towards this, it will run a lot faster.
I can't - its too big and i only have 32Mb RAM
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Old 26 June 2009, 12:01   #10
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I can't - its too big and i only have 32Mb RAM
My setup is also 32mb - The ShapeShifter HDF in the zone has "Small-Boot" this is the Mac/OS hardfile and is about 3mb - when copying this file over to Ram on my Amiga takes less than a mintute.

If you intend to run a large HD i still recomend having a smaller Boot that can be copied to Ram.
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Old 26 June 2009, 12:04   #11
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My setup is also 32mb - The ShapeShifter HDF in the zone has "Small-Boot" this is the Mac/OS hardfile and is about 3mb - when copying this file over to Ram on my Amiga takes less than a mintute.

If you intend to run a large HD i still recomend having a smaller Boot that can be copied to Ram.
I don't know how to make a small boot - I'm trying to run Mac OS 8.1
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Old 26 June 2009, 12:18   #12
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I don't know how to make a small boot - I'm trying to run Mac OS 8.1
O I see - Let me know if SFS does help with ShapeShifter.
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Old 26 June 2009, 13:03   #13
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SFS has made a HUGE MASSIVE ALMIGHTY difference - where it took 30 mins to boot last night it now takes under 1 min

Also important (I think) is the buffers - see http://www.simon.mooli.org.uk/AF/12.html

Trouble is - I changed screen resolution, and now the screen is corrupt
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Old 26 June 2009, 13:06   #14
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SFS has made a HUGE MASSIVE ALMIGHTY difference - where it took 30 mins to boot last night it now takes under 1 min

Also important (I think) is the buffers - see http://www.simon.mooli.org.uk/AF/12.html

Trouble is - I changed screen resolution, and now the screen is corrupt
Thanks Rabbit80, thats a big difference ill have to check it out
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Old 26 June 2009, 13:08   #15
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Thanks Rabbit80, thats a big difference ill have to check it out
No problem Just make sure your block size is either 2 or 4k when prepping your hard disk and give it 1000 buffers
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