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Old 02 April 2009, 21:28   #21
keropi
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Originally Posted by Yotoxionomai View Post
Im sure Sam glitches will be solved within a few bios updates.
But Keropi, would you prefer Amiga hardware and software ceased to be developed? Even with its few glitches i believe its a good Amiga system. Maybe the internal video chip could be better, im sure they will review its specs in a near future, at least its not a Vapourware project like so many others we know so well.
my main problem is that the SAM does not worth it's money. I said before, it is of laughable specs for 2008-2009. Users are called to pay ~550+ eur for a motherboard, and then ~130 for OS4. You end up with a computer that costs 800-900eur (depending on what case/psu/xyz you choose to use with it) that in reality runs an OS without usable apps that needs UAE to run amiga software (unless it does not use chipset that is). The main "new amiga" concept goes to drain , it is like using windows with winuae. Only windows actually offer something for everyday use and winuae is better.
Ofcourse I want new amiga stuff to be developed, and I activelly support companies like E3B, Individual Computers, etc ... But I do not want to support anymore that "new amiga" craze: it offers next to nothing and costs LOTS without a reason. My hopes lay on Clone-A or Natami (though I fear natami is vapor , still I wish for it to be released)
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Old 02 April 2009, 22:40   #22
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So i hope my friend, Clone-A or Natami could indeed bring some fresh air. Maybe Sam future systems will also include a socket to add an optional 68040 or 60 CPU!
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Old 02 April 2009, 23:14   #23
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Sam440Flex was announced today. Board with 800Mhz CPU for 399EUR. So already cheaper than what Keropi previously listed.

This looks really interesting to me. Especially as you can plug CatWeasel PCI card into motherboard. If someone were to provide working drivers for CatWeasel in OS4.1, you might be able to run Amiga floppies in OS4.1! That and better E-UAE emulation (running Amiga app automatically spawns emulated instance), would make Sam440/OS4.1 a compelling replacement for aging Amigas.
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Old 02 April 2009, 23:14   #24
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Hmmm, after looking over the specs and yes, while the SAM is a lovely Amiga etc, it is pretty damned pricey for what you get. Also, i've got to take into consideration shipping costs down here to sunny New Zealand, where our post IS delivered by hobbits!

So even with all the upgrades, a PPC equipped A1200 could never run OS4.1? Damn.
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Old 02 April 2009, 23:25   #25
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On-topic:
-----------
Hmm... I'd say, go for the cheaper alternative. If a fully tricked out A1200 with graphics accelerator, PPC cpu Accelerator, Soundboard accelerator ( is there such a thing?), USB-stack, Internet-adaptor, and all that stuff is really cheaper, then get that.

I think just a stock A1200 with some better HD and more Ram is cooler and more true to what an A1200 was meant to be tho.


Off-topic:
-------------
Believing that, and aiming for, an Amiga that is equally supreme against current IBM-compatible PC technology as the original A1000 and A500 was, is an utterly unfeasible dream.

Not unless you actually want people to afford the damn thing.

Lots have changed since the 80's, and the fact that the PC is a cutting-edge platform, that moves at a breakneck speed compared to all of it's competitors ( Sony, Nintendo, Microsoft themselves(!)) is one of them.

I think I have a pretty good shot at seeing this with some perspective, since I'm not Amiga-exclusive like so many others on here, and I'm too young to be interested in the Amiga from a purely nostalgic perspective.

What I think really set the Amiga apart, was that it was a fusion of game-console and PC mentality. A nice sort of medium between the two. Using custom chips and esotheric processors coupled with an OS specially attuned to the hardware, allowing you to do more things than play games with it, was the general brilliant idea.

If you wanted it to be a console it was a console. Just load the game straight off the box. If you wanted it to be a Personal Computer, it was a Personal Computer. Boot sequence and all.

Trying to one-up the PC is not a feasible idea, and IMHO, it hasn't been for a long, long time. Even Apple, that still exists, lost that battle. They're actually using PC-processors nowadays, you can run friggin' Windows on a MaC!

That's a failure.

No, I believe a new Amiga should be made with the original mentality, which was that it was a cheap PC that did the job, but was also a great game-console. Being cheaper than the competitors is out of the picture, since the change in manufacturing and capacity, with all of the different manufacturers of PC hardware there is now, has made the basic components as cheap as they can feasibly be. Being AS CHEAP as the competitors, to some degree, might be a feasible goal tho.

Alas, it then boils down the ULTIMATE core of the Amiga, IMO: The fusion between PC and Games-Console.

There's nobody to my knowledge who's doing this right now, and doing it well. NOBODY.

That's the goal, that's the golden egg. Keep the eye on that ball... And you're gonna' hit a home-run.
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Old 02 April 2009, 23:56   #26
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Have you guys seen this:

http://www.acube-systems.biz/index.p...hardware&pid=2

A new SAM board
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Old 03 April 2009, 03:24   #27
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If the SAM can keep selling (and it has been selling well so far) it will probably keep getting better and will eventually become a powerful little sucker. There top-of-the-range PPC CPU is currently running at 1.6ghz and supports 4GB RAM and PCIe. If it's tied to OS4.x then it's reasonable to expect 0S4.x to be expanded to match the more powerful SAM's.
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Old 03 April 2009, 03:37   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Predabot View Post
On-topic:
-----------

I think just a stock A1200 with some better HD and more Ram is cooler and more true to what an A1200 was meant to be tho.
The 1200 was under-spec'd when it was released. It should have had VGA output (IndivisonAGA), a CDROM drive (PCMCIA, SAMBA, etc), a better CPU (eg 030) and some more fast ram.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Predabot View Post
On-topic:
-----------

Off-topic:
-------------
Believing that, and aiming for, an Amiga that is equally supreme against current IBM-compatible PC technology as the original A1000 and A500 was, is an utterly unfeasible dream.
I agree, without a massive amount of investment you would not be able to make a MB as ground breaking as the original A1000 (and of course you'd also need a massive marketing budget). The only 2 options for the Amiga 'market' going forward is a 'reasonably' powerful MB with a resource-light OS (eg what the SAM is becoming) or to just port the OS to 'common HW' and go head-to-head with Linux, Windows and MacOS.
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Old 03 April 2009, 09:31   #29
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Originally Posted by mfletcher View Post
Sam440Flex was announced today. Board with 800Mhz CPU for 399EUR. So already cheaper than what Keropi previously listed. [...]
just wait till the FINAL price is announced... ... you will see....
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Old 03 April 2009, 10:37   #30
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You guys just don't get it do you, until this backwards board changes its name from English Amiga Board to English Emulation Board you will always get pro Amiga ideals...

Some of you need to move on and stop worrying about how over priced Amiga specific hardware is... some of us will buy it anyway because AmigaOS is simply better than what you are using...

Eventually the AmigaOS Hardware will be faster than most of us even need for our AmigaOS experience...

What will your bitter arguement be then?

as for you KeropiI I have no idea what has happened to you over the years but it is not good. You need to stay out of threads like this... what service do you provide? realism? concern?

Just change the name and all of us pro AmigaOS people will leave your board instead
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Old 03 April 2009, 10:49   #31
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Originally Posted by Slayer View Post
You guys just don't get it do you, until this backwards board changes its name from English Amiga Board to English Emulation Board you will always get pro Amiga ideals...

Some of you need to move on and stop worrying about how over priced Amiga specific hardware is... some of us will buy it anyway because AmigaOS is simply better than what you are using...

Eventually the AmigaOS Hardware will be faster than most of us even need for our AmigaOS experience...

What will your bitter arguement be then?

as for you KeropiI I have no idea what has happened to you over the years but it is not good. You need to stay out of threads like this... what service do you provide? realism? concern?

Just change the name and all of us pro AmigaOS people will leave your board instead

realism. PURE realism. and don't forget you are talking with a person that owns 2 CSPPC A4000 , one with G-REX4000D and the other with a fully loaded PicassoIV and 2 DENEB cards.(not to mention the various other hardware lying around, 3 subways, 2 kickflashes, a mp3@64 , an indivision , idefixes etc, ALL RECENT CLASSIC HARDWARE, oh and OS4classic). Also an ex-owner or 2 pegII machines, a G3 and a G4. So take your "amiga support" fairytale elsewhere.
So yeah, excuse me if I fail to see the point of getting a 600eur 533/667/800mhz SAM. And there is NOTHING pro on AmigaOS4.
And in 2009 my friend Slayer, can you tell me what is the "AMIGAOS4 experience" ??? And WHY is it better than what I am using right now? You have a 1999 OS running on 2009 that offers next to nothing.
And since EAB is a "backwards" board, then why bother posting here?
You accuse me in the above post that "I offer nothing" and "that I have to stay away from threads like this" , BUT I dare you to answer my above questions. I DARE YOU. go ahead, enlighten me on the glory of OS4 & SAM.

Last edited by keropi; 03 April 2009 at 11:01.
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Old 03 April 2009, 11:33   #32
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Seriously it's kinda funny for me to check out from time to time reactions about new hardware (that's supposed to be Amiga-ish)... Yeah it's kinda cool that OS 4 can run nowadays in more platform that our beloved hard to get PPC's could... But as I saw it in the first place, OS 4 was only just for testing and supporting, and never saw it as a replacement for my Classic Amiga over 3.9.

Running Classic Amiga software/games through emulation on a named to be NextGen Amiga is kinda silly for me since I can do it from my PC under UAE just fine (if not 100% better). Investing such large amounts of cash for new Mobos that can run 4.1 is a waste of money (at least for my taste). I prefer to invest over new hardware for my classic miggies (hail to Amigakit, Jens and E3B)
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Old 03 April 2009, 11:37   #33
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Originally Posted by keropi View Post
enlighten me on the glory of OS4 & SAM.
It's got a better version of solitaire?
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Old 03 April 2009, 11:58   #34
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It's got a better version of solitaire?
yes, is a ppc build
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Old 05 April 2009, 03:42   #35
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Originally Posted by NovaCoder View Post
The 1200 was under-spec'd when it was released. It should have had VGA output (IndivisonAGA), a CDROM drive (PCMCIA, SAMBA, etc), a better CPU (eg 030) and some more fast ram.
Was it really? I mean yeah, PC's where at higher clock-speeds and had a little bit more Ram out of the box back then, but it did outclass a lot of consoles. ( for some reason, many games don't look quite as good as on the consoles tho... dunno' why.)

And CD-Rom wasn't very common among PC's or Mac back then, at all. And most definitely not on consoles.

Quote:
The only 2 options for the Amiga 'market' going forward is a 'reasonably' powerful MB with a resource-light OS (eg what the SAM is becoming) or to just port the OS to 'common HW' and go head-to-head with Linux, Windows and MacOS.
I like the first option. Keeping it slim, and keeping it green. Passive cooling on everything, even the PSU, and SSD HD's.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slayer View Post
You guys just don't get it do you, until this backwards board changes its name from English Amiga Board to English Emulation Board you will always get pro Amiga ideals...

Some of you need to move on and stop worrying about how over priced Amiga specific hardware is... some of us will buy it anyway because AmigaOS is simply better than what you are using...

Eventually the AmigaOS Hardware will be faster than most of us even need for our AmigaOS experience...

Just change the name and all of us pro AmigaOS people will leave your board instead
Now now, I'm not at all that negative towards the SAM. I think it's a cute little hobby-comp with some unique little things to it.

And for it's intented customers, which can dish out the cash for the unique experience and feel, I think it's pretty good.

So please, remember, there is a few of us grayers that are in-between the haters and the lovers.
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Old 28 April 2009, 23:59   #36
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Stop farting sunshine guys... SAM is a bloody joke. The tech is old, the price is ridiculous and its nothing related to Amiga except it runs the new OS that few people can be arsed to run

IMHO the only "Amiga" worth buying will be Clone-A IF (big IF) Jens gets it finished. That at least might morph into something like a classic Amiga. Maybe better cpu LATER
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Old 29 April 2009, 04:07   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RabidRabbit View Post
Thanks for the replies guys. Much appreciated.

I think i'd like to get the SAM version to be honest with you, maybe get a cheap A1200 too someplace. But if the Winuae runs fine under the SAM, it could be the way to go I reckon.
I'm afraid not. WinUAE requires an Intel-based box running Windows. EUAE will run fine on an Intel-based Mac or Linux box.

The PPC versions of EUAE don't have a JIT compiler yet so they run painfully slow.

Quote:
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IMHO the only "Amiga" worth buying will be Clone-A IF (big IF) Jens gets it finished. That at least might morph into something like a classic Amiga. Maybe better cpu LATER
If the Natami ever comes out it may be better yet because the 68050ec is running ahead of schedule and, if popular, could fund the rest of the SuperAGA research.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xpect View Post
Good God... AmigaOS for the x86 please...
Intel may have better code density than the PowerPC but the 68000 series was better yet. That's why I'm holding out some hope for the Natami team's 68050ec design even if it is only going to be a 133 MHz chip in its first incarnation.

Last edited by Graham Humphrey; 29 April 2009 at 08:49. Reason: Back-to-back posts merged
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Old 30 April 2009, 01:37   #38
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OMFG NatAmi.. thats even more vaporware... at least SAM exists!!
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Old 30 April 2009, 02:24   #39
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OMFG NatAmi.. thats even more vaporware... at least SAM exists!!
I agree, I want to see something first. Simply cause they have hyped it up so much and shown nothing.
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Old 30 April 2009, 08:19   #40
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I have a MicroA1-c that I've hardly even used. It's down in Chicago at DiscreetFX being used to develop Aladdin 4d. It exists too and even has been upgraded to AmigaOS 4.1! That doesn't mean that the Natatmi prototype doesn't exist, it just isn't in production yet.
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