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Old 29 November 2008, 06:00   #1
Supamax
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DISK2FDI and ADFread

Ciao Daniele!

Which program do you use in order to obtain the .adf images from your floppies?
I mean, do you use a PC utility like DISK2FDI (I always use it, it's the best one. Adfread is definitely not reliable - I'll give details if needed but I'm still "investigating") or do you use an Amiga utility?

Massimo
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Old 29 November 2008, 06:01   #2
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By the way, someone knows (since it's not sold any more) where it could be possible to find a full/registered copy of DISK2FDI ??

Only if it's legal, of course :-)
Massimo
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Old 29 November 2008, 10:46   #3
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i know i used ADFread in the past with better results than with a Catweasel :/
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Old 29 November 2008, 11:18   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supamax View Post
By the way, someone knows (since it's not sold any more) where it could be possible to find a full/registered copy of DISK2FDI ??

Only if it's legal, of course :-)
Massimo
Seems like it's still sold : http://disk2fdi.joguin.com/
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Old 29 November 2008, 15:29   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supamax View Post
By the way, someone knows (since it's not sold any more) where it could be possible to find a full/registered copy of DISK2FDI ??

Only if it's legal, of course :-)
Massimo
@Supamax...

I am using EasyADF by "AmigaKit" to dump my floppies and it's really EEAASSYY!

Hope this help!

SEE YA!
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Old 29 November 2008, 17:35   #6
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@ marco pedrana

Hi Marco, I'm from Italy too :-))

Regarding DISK2FDI and ADFread: I tested them thoroughly with lots of floppies and many floppy disk drives (3.5" and 5.25", PC-drives and even Amiga-drives. Teac, Chinon, Epson, Sony, etc., DD and/or HD).
To be sure of the results I always made two dumps of each floppy (I recommend this, even if it can seem senseless) and then compared them byte-by-byte with UltraEdit32.

I found that:
- DISK2FDI is always affordable. Absolutely always. The two dumps are identical, ever.
With _every_ drive I tried, I obtained the same, correct dumps
- ADFread is rarely affordable. The two dumps are rarely equal, and the results depend on the floppy drives used in the process. But, even with the best combination of drives, I rarely obtain two equal dumps.
The strange/dangerous thing is that ADFread reports no read errors. And when it does find errors (on disks read with no problem at all using DISK2FDI) it gives the opportunity to retry, effectively retrying only the problematic tracks. However, at the end of the process, I have the same problem: incorrect dump.

I'm not opening a new topic with this (very severe, I think) problem because I'm discussing it with the author of ADFread (I don't want him to get upset, although he confessed me that he couldn't test ADFread personally, not having a PC with two floppies etc.. !!). I'll send him some dumps, because he would like to see the differences between two or more dumps of the same disk. I think (but hope not) this will come to nothing, because the differences seem random... however I'll make some new dumps and send him.

However, until this thing is cleared out, I recommend to all of you to *not* use ADFread.
Or, if you can't use other dumping methods, at least make two dumps and compare them with a hex editor like UltraEdit+UltraCompare.
In many case the games load fine, but some bytes here and there may cause problems when playing it (or disks can give Read/Write Workbench errors). It could be hard to notice, so... make 2 dumps and compare! :-)

Massimo
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Old 29 November 2008, 17:54   #7
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hello Supamax, but, technically, i'm not italian, i live on the floor

sadly i canno test neither programs anymore, as i have no more 2 floppy disks and windows XP: when i used to, Disk2FDI wasn't around yet.

my token however is that this thread should be splitted, there's no reason to be upset about it: an eventual problem asks for solutions not grinding
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Old 29 November 2008, 20:17   #8
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my token however is that this thread should be splitted, there's no reason to be upset about it: an eventual problem asks for solutions not grinding
Done
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Old 29 November 2008, 23:45   #9
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Oh my God... what have you done, DamienD????
I didn't want to open a thread! Now Toni will see it and will get mad with me!

I didn't even send him the images yet... DAMN!
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Old 30 November 2008, 00:06   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supamax View Post
Which program do you use in order to obtain the .adf images from your floppies?
I mean, do you use a PC utility like DISK2FDI (I always use it, it's the best one. Adfread is definitely not reliable - I'll give details if needed but I'm still "investigating") or do you use an Amiga utility?
Hi Supamax,

I use Amiga Explorer and attach my PC to my Amiga with a null modem cable. This program gives perfect .adf images every time from real floppies in the Amiga's floppy drive, plus it can give .hdf images from the Amiga's hard drive.

I am also a registered user of Disk2FDI, but I find that sometimes it will not read disks properly which the Amiga will. However the registered Disk2FDI program has the advantage that it will read lots of other formats (it's particularly good at reading early Macintosh GCR encoded disks of 400kB and 800kB capacity).

Hope this helps!

(I have not tried ADFRead.)
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Old 30 November 2008, 00:15   #11
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(since it's not sold any more)
As TheCyberDruid says, it is still sold. However, it certainly hasn't been updated in a long while...
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Old 30 November 2008, 00:18   #12
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@ marco pedrana:

I have two PCs: a recent one with XP, which I use for all my needs, and an old one which I use for all my retrocomputing/DOS/etc. needs.
It has:
- AMD K6 3D 450 MHz processor
- ASUS motherboard
- 256 MB RAM
- Windows 2000 (but I boot the PC in pure DOS when I need to use DISK2FDI)
- 2 floppy drives
I leave the PC case open, so I can insert the floppy drives I need at the moment (I have many drives, 3,5" or 5,25", DD or HD, PC and Amiga).

By the way, I could also use with no problems with DISK2FDI a Chinon A500 internal floppy drive, directly connected to the PC. ADFread couldn't use it, no way...
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Old 30 November 2008, 00:24   #13
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Originally Posted by prowler View Post
Hi Supamax,

I use Amiga Explorer and attach my PC to my Amiga with a null modem cable. This program gives perfect .adf images every time from real floppies in the Amiga's floppy drive, plus it can give .hdf images from the Amiga's hard drive.

I am also a registered user of Disk2FDI, but I find that sometimes it will not read disks properly which the Amiga will. However the registered Disk2FDI program has the advantage that it will read lots of other formats (it's particularly good at reading early Macintosh GCR encoded disks of 400kB and 800kB capacity).

Hope this helps!

(I have not tried ADFRead.)
Hi Prowler,
yes, sooner or later I'll try Amiga Explorer. It looks like a great utility!
I noticed that ADFread is not used much... perhaps many users transferred their floppies years ago with DISK2ADF, or they use your method (with a real Amiga)... This could be good news, since the main fear I have/had about ADFread is about many people creating bad .adf files with it.
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Old 30 November 2008, 01:14   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supamax View Post
Hi Prowler,
yes, sooner or later I'll try Amiga Explorer. It looks like a great utility!
I noticed that ADFread is not used much... perhaps many users transferred their floppies years ago with DISK2ADF, or they use your method (with a real Amiga)... This could be good news, since the main fear I have/had about ADFread is about many people creating bad .adf files with it.
Yes, this is good news indeed, because if ADFRead reports no read errors, then your fear was well founded.

Personally, I'm not surprised that Disk2FDI out-performs ADFRead in your tests, because I don't think you can beat a plain DOS-based environment when it comes to low-level antics like disk imaging with a PC.

Amiga Explorer is in a different league, because although it is a Windows application, the low-level trickery is done on the Amiga, where the disk format is fully supported.

Last edited by prowler; 30 November 2008 at 02:41. Reason: Added another footnote!
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Old 30 November 2008, 01:20   #15
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Perhaps I have to specify:
- when ADFRead reports *some* read errors, then there *are* read errors
- when ADFRead reports *no* read errors, you cannot be *sure* (if you didn't make 2 dumps and compared them) it's error-free
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Old 30 November 2008, 01:23   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supamax View Post
Perhaps I have to specify:
- when ADFRead reports *some* read errors, then there *are* read errors
- when ADFRead reports *no* read errors, you cannot be *sure* (if you didn't make 2 dumps and compared them) it's error-free
Yes, I had understood the implications of what you reported, but thanks for the clarification anyway.

Perhaps I should have said that if ADFRead's error reporting is unreliable, then your fear was well founded.

Last edited by prowler; 30 November 2008 at 01:29. Reason: Added footnote (this is becoming a habit!). ;)
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Old 30 November 2008, 03:05   #17
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@Supamax:

In your discussions with Toni, there will be the matter of the Fdrawcmd.sys driver to take into account.

Which version of the driver are you using? The latest version is 1.0.1.10, dated 29 September 2008, available now from:
http://simonowen.com/fdrawcmd/
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Old 30 November 2008, 03:48   #18
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@prowler:

Yes, I know. I tried two versions of fdrawcmd: the latest and the previous one.
Unfortunately I didn't solve the problem.

Massimo
P.S. In case it was a problem of my PC only I would be very glad (so I would be sure that nobody dumped bad images out there); unfortunately I don't think it's the case... for two reasons: a) DISK2FDI has no problems with any drive I tried (under DOS or Windows 9x), and b) other programs using fdrawcmd gave me no problems (SamDisk and RealSpectrum)
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Old 30 November 2008, 03:57   #19
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Wait wait!
I re-read the webpage http://simonowen.com/fdrawcmd/ and what I see???
WinUAE is included (last of the list) between the applications which use the driver???

Is this a new WinUAE feature, or didn't I notice it before?
Does this mean that somehow I can directly read Amiga floppies (having two floppy drives as with ADFread, I suppose) from within WinUAE? If it's true, how? And Wow!
For example, RealSpectrum does the same thing with Disciple/+D formatted floppies.
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Old 30 November 2008, 06:57   #20
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Does this mean that somehow I can directly read Amiga floppies (having two floppy drives as with ADFread, I suppose) from within WinUAE?
No that's not what it's for, fdrawcmd is only used by WinUAE to simulate the disk drive sounds. With fdrawcmd installed start WinUAE and go to Sounds -> Floppy Drive Sound Emulation, you will notice there are two new options in the dropdown list PC floppy drive A/B by using these options the drive head on your real floppy drive will move in time with the emulated disk drive.

Toni may have little patience for stupid questions but he does have a sense of humor
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