English Amiga Board


Go Back   English Amiga Board > Main > Retrogaming General Discussion

 
 
Thread Tools
Old 17 April 2008, 03:15   #21
turrican3
Moon 1969 = amiga 1985

turrican3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: belgium
Age: 41
Posts: 3,157
like it use sdl do you think we could launch it on amiga one day ?
will it be hard to convert it to work with the amiga sdl system for 68k (sdl 1.2.6) ?
i'm not a coder, don't blame me if it's a stupid question.

Last edited by turrican3; 17 April 2008 at 03:26.
turrican3 is offline  
AdSense AdSense  
Old 17 April 2008, 12:46   #22
gimbal
cheeky scoundrel
gimbal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Spijkenisse/Netherlands
Age: 36
Posts: 2,946
The general complaint from people switching from Amiga to PC coding is that on the PC it is way too easy and boring, to get things done on the Amiga you needed a lot more expertise and code optimized for the hardware to get the full power of the machine working for you. So if a port would be done, the game would have to not only be converted from C/C++ to ASM, but also (at least) the blitting code would have to be adapted and optimized for the Amiga hardware. I would say a lot of work yes
gimbal is offline  
Old 17 April 2008, 12:49   #23
jotd
Cat freak
jotd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: FRANCE
Age: 46
Posts: 1,974
Quote:
Originally Posted by turrican3 View Post
like it use sdl do you think we could launch it on amiga one day ?
will it be hard to convert it to work with the amiga sdl system for 68k (sdl 1.2.6) ?
i'm not a coder, don't blame me if it's a stupid question.
Yes SDL would allow to make it run on an amiga. But SDL does not solve all the problems.
The main problem being the graphics mode.

With a good gfx board, I think it should work. No way in native modes (planar/chunky problem, I think SDL does not like planar modes)

I'll try to make a test (the problem will be an outdated gcc more than SDL, but maybe we can cross-compile)
jotd is offline  
Old 17 April 2008, 14:08   #24
turrican3
Moon 1969 = amiga 1985

turrican3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: belgium
Age: 41
Posts: 3,157
jotd, we could try to send an email to the guy who did the last port of sdl to amiga and ask him if he could make a newer one ?
If you say it could help ?
everybody let's go.
ps: i think it's a good way to have new amiga games.
edited: gcc what is that ? cross compiler ?
what is the best gcc for trying to have a new version ? (sending emails)

edited :gcc : that's it jotd ? : GNU C/C++/Objc compiler

Last edited by turrican3; 17 April 2008 at 16:11.
turrican3 is offline  
Old 17 April 2008, 21:52   #25
jotd
Cat freak
jotd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: FRANCE
Age: 46
Posts: 1,974
@gimbal: thanks for thinking that I am cool . BTW I DO reuse stuff from Gods. All icons & map editors have been slightly adapted and it works.
About converting C++ to asm: no way josť. I'd rather try to cross compile with a very good gcc (for t3: gcc is the GNU C compiler) version. A lot of action games are coded in C on the amiga. Ok, they crawl, but I doubt they had gcc. They used that crap Lattice & MANX.
And I understand nothing about the blitter. Planar mode is a nightmare. I do that during my spare time. Why remaking Magic Pockets on the amiga: it's already there. The idea is to use the power of new PCs to enhance resolution, colors, add alpha channel, add MP3 sound. All this cannot be done on amiga classic, and not on PPCs unless some stuff is cut down.

@turrican 3: the limit of the amiga is the CPU power and also GFX power.
680x0 + planar display + chipmem = crawls.
And SDL cannot help for that since it's not designed to optimize, just make it simpler, and not designed with the amiga in mind...

Let's face it: the classic amiga is dead. We can still play the games designed for it and enjoy them very much, but new games? noooo. If you want to play Magic Pockets, use the original !
The amiga spirit (and more generally the 16-bit spirit, ST, Arcade...) , on the other hand, will not die, because people continue to contribute to it on new machines. Check all the remakes, you'll be convinced. Let's move on!
jotd is offline  
Old 17 April 2008, 22:07   #26
frikilokooo
Registered User
frikilokooo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Mallorca,Spain.
Age: 38
Posts: 1,120
Quote:
Originally Posted by jotd View Post
Let's face it: the classic amiga is dead. We can still play the games designed for it and enjoy them very much, but new games? noooo. If you want to play Magic Pockets, use the original !
The amiga spirit (and more generally the 16-bit spirit, ST, Arcade...) , on the other hand, will not die, because people continue to contribute to it on new machines. Check all the remakes, you'll be convinced. Let's move on!
Your words are a little hard I could say that remakes are a stupidity,they don't have sense,I prefer ALWAYS play the original game because it's better.I have not played a remake never.New games are different though and I enjoy them A LOTI have envy of C64 or Spectrum system,they have a lot of new games nowadays,are they systems dead too?
frikilokooo is offline  
Old 17 April 2008, 22:09   #27
Graham Humphrey
Global Moderator
Graham Humphrey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Norwich, Norfolk, UK
Age: 31
Posts: 10,978
Quote:
Originally Posted by jotd View Post
Let's face it: the classic amiga is dead. We can still play the games designed for it and enjoy them very much, but new games? noooo.
All very well but the 8-bit machines tend to get new games on a relatively regular basis, so why not the Amiga? A few of us are trying to do something about it but really I don't know why the older machines tend to get new games but the Amiga (and indeed, the ST) don't tend to very often.
Graham Humphrey is offline  
Old 17 April 2008, 22:24   #28
turrican3
Moon 1969 = amiga 1985

turrican3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: belgium
Age: 41
Posts: 3,157
Quote:
Originally Posted by jotd View Post
@gimbal: thanks for thinking that I am cool . BTW I DO reuse stuff from Gods. All icons & map editors have been slightly adapted and it works.
About converting C++ to asm: no way josť. I'd rather try to cross compile with a very good gcc (for t3: gcc is the GNU C compiler) version. A lot of action games are coded in C on the amiga. Ok, they crawl, but I doubt they had gcc. They used that crap Lattice & MANX.
And I understand nothing about the blitter. Planar mode is a nightmare. I do that during my spare time. Why remaking Magic Pockets on the amiga: it's already there. The idea is to use the power of new PCs to enhance resolution, colors, add alpha channel, add MP3 sound. All this cannot be done on amiga classic, and not on PPCs unless some stuff is cut down.

@turrican 3: the limit of the amiga is the CPU power and also GFX power.
680x0 + planar display + chipmem = crawls.
And SDL cannot help for that since it's not designed to optimize, just make it simpler, and not designed with the amiga in mind...

Let's face it: the classic amiga is dead. We can still play the games designed for it and enjoy them very much, but new games? noooo. If you want to play Magic Pockets, use the original !
The amiga spirit (and more generally the 16-bit spirit, ST, Arcade...) , on the other hand, will not die, because people continue to contribute to it on new machines. Check all the remakes, you'll be convinced. Let's move on!
for me no problem jotd , i just asked if it was possible, if it's not, i respect your point of you, i'm not a coder.
thanks for your answer, with all my respect for all your achievements on amiga
turrican3 is offline  
Old 17 April 2008, 22:26   #29
turrican3
Moon 1969 = amiga 1985

turrican3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: belgium
Age: 41
Posts: 3,157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Graham Humphrey View Post
All very well but the 8-bit machines tend to get new games on a relatively regular basis, so why not the Amiga? A few of us are trying to do something about it but really I don't know why the older machines tend to get new games but the Amiga (and indeed, the ST) don't tend to very often.
little bit off-topic but yes graham why old 8 bits have more new games than amiga ? If someone have the answer. Perhaps because it takes more time to make amiga games ?
oss topic closed (for me)
turrican3 is offline  
Old 17 April 2008, 22:34   #30
Graham Humphrey
Global Moderator
Graham Humphrey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Norwich, Norfolk, UK
Age: 31
Posts: 10,978
Oh and one more word on this from me (sorry for going off-topic by the way):

@jotd

Just like to add I'm not in anyway criticising you or your efforts, you've done some excellent work and I'm not at all suggesting you should suddenly start programming Amiga games - I just merely disagreed with that statement above
Graham Humphrey is offline  
Old 17 April 2008, 22:39   #31
Dastardly
Into the Wonderful

Dastardly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Gods Country
Age: 43
Posts: 2,114
Everybody stop hassling jotd!...or at least wait until Magic Pockets is finished
Dastardly is offline  
Old 17 April 2008, 23:00   #32
Qube
Registered User
Qube's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: England
Posts: 200
Good luck with the remake jotd, if its like your gods remake then it will be an excellent tribute and you can improve the game at the same time! Looking forward to it
Qube is offline  
Old 17 April 2008, 23:44   #33
turrican3
Moon 1969 = amiga 1985

turrican3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: belgium
Age: 41
Posts: 3,157
Quote:
Originally Posted by jotd View Post
@turrican 3: the limit of the amiga is the CPU power and also GFX power.
680x0 + planar display + chipmem = crawls.
And SDL cannot help for that since it's not designed to optimize, just make it simpler, and not designed with the amiga in mind...
I thought about amiga with cgfx not aga or ecs, when i see the result with scummvm (great work), i thought perhaps it was possible.
Still not possible ? (sorry to ask again, but i would like so much to see enhanced amiga games but on amiga )
Last time i will disturb this thread with this, i promise
turrican3 is offline  
Old 18 April 2008, 00:03   #34
jotd
Cat freak
jotd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: FRANCE
Age: 46
Posts: 1,974
@all: I must say that I appreciate the interest you show on my remakes and on Bitmap Bros games. Me I'd be ready to pay 5000 euros for a new level set of any of the following bitmap bros game: Cadaver, Chaos Engine, Gods, Magic Pockets. The level set would have to be created by the Bros of course .

@turrican3: yes, with cybergfx at least SDL is usable (chunky pixel). Maybe some work could be ported

@graham: I understand and I don't resent your remark, sorry about my hard words. But everyone agrees that there are no more amiga games, although there's a lot of 8-bit games.
Why? Because it's a lot easier to create simple games on 8 bit computers than to create 16-bit games like Turrican or Gods, or Z-Out.
People expect more from a new amiga game than from a 8 bit game. If you want to create an amiga game now, with all the cross-compiling and stuff it will
still look like shit compared to the 1990's titles.
8 bit machines have simple palettes, gfx, and it's a lot easier to match former commercial games than on the amiga.
And the first home computers will remain the 8 bit. The amiga is good, but is an in-between machine.
Also, people who owned 8-bits tend to hack more. People who owned amigas just play games and complain about missing ports

okay. You want new amiga games? You want 8 bit games? You can have both: Check here and here tell me if you want amiga ports of those ones (those games use SDL)

Last edited by jotd; 18 April 2008 at 00:11.
jotd is offline  
Old 18 April 2008, 09:12   #35
frikilokooo
Registered User
frikilokooo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Mallorca,Spain.
Age: 38
Posts: 1,120
Quote:
Originally Posted by jotd View Post
Me I'd be ready to pay 5000 euros for a new level set of any of the following bitmap bros game: Cadaver, Chaos Engine, Gods, Magic Pockets. The level set would have to be created by the Bros of course .
I would pay rather less but I would pay for it.It would be brilliant that Bros would create NEW enemies and NEW graphics backgrounds for its games.Lamentably that will not happen.
frikilokooo is offline  
Old 18 April 2008, 11:19   #36
Dastardly
Into the Wonderful

Dastardly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Gods Country
Age: 43
Posts: 2,114
THe important thing would be that the original Bitmap Bros made new games/levels, and not just whoever is employed by them now.

The Chaos Engine 2 is technically a Bitmap Brothers game but it never really was IMO.
Dastardly is offline  
Old 18 April 2008, 16:46   #37
jotd
Cat freak
jotd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: FRANCE
Age: 46
Posts: 1,974
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dastardly View Post
THe important thing would be that the original Bitmap Bros made new games/levels, and not just whoever is employed by them now.

The Chaos Engine 2 is technically a Bitmap Brothers game but it never really was IMO.
subcontracting is the worst thing

CE2 graphics, great sound, crap gameplay! a heartbreak.
jotd is offline  
Old 29 April 2008, 00:12   #38
jotd
Cat freak
jotd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: FRANCE
Age: 46
Posts: 1,974
Magic Pockets WIP page

check the MP remake page if you like

you'll see some info & screenshots of the game in progress. You'll notice the extra colors & (discrete) alpha channel effects.
jotd is offline  
Old 10 June 2008, 19:59   #39
gimbal
cheeky scoundrel
gimbal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Spijkenisse/Netherlands
Age: 36
Posts: 2,946
So how are you doing with the project, oh great and wise jotd? At least let us know that you are busy and cannot be arsed to do any work on this project at the moment
gimbal is offline  
Old 10 June 2008, 22:42   #40
jotd
Cat freak
jotd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: FRANCE
Age: 46
Posts: 1,974
Quote:
Originally Posted by gimbal View Post
So how are you doing with the project, oh great and wise jotd? At least let us know that you are busy and cannot be arsed to do any work on this project at the moment
Development made some progress, but there are still some annoying bugs and enemy A.I. is non-existent ATM.
I've halted development for now and I'm creating a new level 3 of Gods instead
But I'll provide a demo of the first level soon enough, when I feel like it.
jotd is offline  
AdSense AdSense  
 


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Magic Pockets (US) Mr Softy support.WinUAE 18 03 February 2015 05:27
[Ripped] Magic Pockets Ultron project.Sprites 14 26 October 2006 02:25
Magic Pockets sareks support.Games 6 18 July 2006 23:04
Ripping-Magic Pockets gifgit project.Sprites 6 24 May 2005 14:53

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 02:06.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Page generated in 0.44752 seconds with 12 queries