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Old 18 January 2002, 06:38   #41

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I don't have anyway to upload it, as I don't have an Amiga to transfer the disk.

Anyway, you aren't losing too much, this "compilation" was made by a friend of mine (a "pirate"), it just loads WB , then you have 4 icons, one is Stunt Car Race, one is James Pond, and the other 2 are 2 cracktros from other games (I remember one of the cracktros is from Days of Thunder)

Nothing interesting really
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Old 18 January 2002, 08:52   #42
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Originally posted by TikTok
Not sure on this, but I think CAPS are only interested in disks that cannot be imaged in the ADF format (i.e copy protected disks). The Dune 2 disks are standard Amiga DOS disks. Besides, I thought you said you *downloaded* the adfs of Dune 2, rather than imaged them yourself.
Strange, I swear some/a lot of the games on this 'obtained' list are AmigaDOS based, with no protection of any kind:

And I just checked all messages of mine related to Dune 2, and none of them ever had me mention that I downloaded them off somewhere. They ARE imaged from original floppy disks you know. Remember, I said that I'd put up games you couldn't just download off the web.

Have you tried disk2fdi? With that tool you don't necessarily need an Amiga to dump your disks.
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Old 18 January 2002, 16:45   #43
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I believe CAPS is interested in preserving all Amiga games, protected or otherwise, since that is the initial concept (keeping the original games from extinction). For sure the protected disks get more publicity, due to the controversy of whether this process is even possible, etc. So that bit rises to the top, but the organization is interested in all originals.

Marz, let me repeat again, absolutely *NO* downloaded 'originals' should be contributed. Doing so will only add to your questionable reputation. If it is not a store bought, absolute original copy with no modifications of any kind, don't even consider it. Please!
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Old 18 January 2002, 19:27   #44
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Sorry if I sounded accusatory over the Dune 2 disks - since they had been available before on this board, I presumed you were simply re-uploading someone elses posts. When I mentioned this earlier you simply asked who had previously uploaded them, rather than stating you had imaged them, which made me jump to conclusions. Anyway, my bad.

You are both right about CAPS, there are a fair few AmigaDOS games on that list. I must check out their pages in more detail sometime as I'm wondering if they're actually using the ADF for these originals? I presume so.
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Old 18 January 2002, 23:54   #45
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Hello all. Just to let you all know a few things about what we are doing at CAPS... Also to answer a few questions that have been presented here.

Yes, some of the games on that list are unprotected, that is purely because it is what exists in our collection. They are still originals (I should know - I dumped most of them myself ;) and thus in our project "scope". So yes, we aim to dump *all originals* as TG pointed out, not just copy protected disks. This is a preservation project after all...

I personally still have over 400 original game disks to dump. Some are unprotected, most are protected.

As you can probably imagine, dumping copy protected original disks into an ADF form would require "cracking" the images so they can be contained in a standard "AmigaDOS" disk format - this is not what we are doing, we do not touch any program code when dumping disks.

As for submitting ADFs to us - *even* if they from an original disk, I would direct you to a section of the CAPS FAQ:


Basically - don't. This part of the FAQ raises some valid points. Even if you disagree with it, it is our policy, it was decided a long time ago now and it is not going to change.

Our dumping software (which you will find out if you want to contribute!) will dump *any* (read Amiga, PC, Atart ST, other) floppy disk... At least, that is 100% of the ones tried so far. We may find problems with some but we have not come across any yet, and some of the ones we have already dumped have *extreamly* "interesting" protections ;). (well, we *did* have problems with a couple of disks, but that was while the dumping software was still in development so they do not count ;). In theory we can *even* dump C= 64 5 1/4 inch GCR (i.e. not MFM) based media, if we can get the hardware and connect it to an Amiga.

All of this needs *a lot* more information than the ADF "format" contains. This is a new format, maybe called something like "APF" (Amiga Preservation Format). Yes, I know "yet another format" but as the people "in the know" here will probably tell you, ADF (and even ADF ext and ADF ext2) does not store anything like that which is required for most (in fact *any* in the case of normal ADF) copy protection checks to pass.

It might be interesting to note at this point, that if somebody wanted to do a side project using CAPS technology, say for dumping Atari ST floppy disks (even though the copy protection was nothing like that which was employed on the Amiga, there was some. Notably the AtariST version of CopyLock) then Atari ST emulators would support *exactly* the same disk image format as the Amiga disk images (APF) which we plan to release in the not-too-distant future.

So, just thinking about it now, perhaps something like *.DPF (Disk Preservation Format) would be more appropriate, since they will all be the same. This however might raise confusion determining what system a DPF file is for... Wel, I like APF anyway. :)

You may have realised by this point that any and all dumping is done on an Amiga itself. This is just so you know we are not similar to a Disk2FDI type solution.

DISCLAIMER (sorry, but it has to be done)

*PLEASE* If you are a skeptic, that is fair enough. It is expected, but before you "go off on one", *wait* until we are releasing disk images. If at that point you think it is crap - then fair enough (trust me, you won't ;) we can respect that. But flaming something that has not been released yet, just makes no sense at all - I don't care how much you *think* it is impossible - just wait and see!

I handle all the PR of CAPS (excludes the website apart from the FAQ), so whatever is directed at CAPS, just goes to me. You can argue with me about certain points all you like, I actually enjoy it. ;) But do not expect to get anywhere. Just wait and see!

If any of you have any questions *please* mail us using the contacts page on the site. I am quite happy to answer your questions, it also helps me improve the FAQ. It may however be an idea to look at the FAQ first, which might same us both some time.

Thanks for listening, I hope you guys now have a deeper understanding of what CAPS is all about.
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Old 19 January 2002, 00:54   #46

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Thanks for this great explanation of the CAPS project fiath.
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Old 19 January 2002, 01:25   #47
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Thanks for the answers and the explanations fiath . I must admit I hadn't read the FAQ recently, and I'm sure the ADF question wasn't there the last time I did. The point about even AmigaDOS disks using very subtle protection is one I'm sure a lot of people hadn't considered. At least, I hadn't .
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Old 19 January 2002, 02:44   #48
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Hey, no problem. And yes that question is new, it was the only new thing in the last FAQ update.

About the subtle disk protections, yeah, we have seen some really neat tricks pulled off by the developers (there is not much chance of doing some of these tricks after the game was sent to the publishers...). Interesting stuff. I am sure we will tell you more about that more in due course... :)

Something that I would personally like to do is a little section of the website which tells you a little bit about the copy protection of each game (if any) as it is released. However, this is not very realistic. Perhaps the same, but just for protections that seem interesting for something new and different that we have not seen before. This will probably not happen though unfortuately.

Last edited by fiath; 19 January 2002 at 03:29.
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