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Old 13 July 2004, 23:02   #1
the wolf
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Did you know about all these games?

Hmmm...dunno if it's the right forum this, but I think could be interesting for all you HOL guys...

There's a page with some freshly new games for our lovely Amiga here:
http://www.nic.fi/~varsa/menobox/index.html
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Old 13 July 2004, 23:08   #2
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Aw 3d games, terrible I say.
 
Old 13 July 2004, 23:13   #3
the wolf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burseg
Aw 3d games, terrible I say.
I agree, I also prefer the good old games in 2D, but, hey, they are Amiga...
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Old 13 July 2004, 23:24   #4
RetroMan
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I know these games allready, tested AlyBox on WinUAE with QuarkTex (warp3D Wrapper) some time ago

Yes, they are 3D, but these are great puzzle games, worth a try !
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Old 14 July 2004, 00:10   #5
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This is exactly what I don't understand. They are puzzle games, so why 3d?
 
Old 14 July 2004, 12:10   #6
killergorilla
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burseg
This is exactly what I don't understand. They are puzzle games, so why 3d?
Because some puzzle games can't work in 2D. Grab of a copy of Wetrix+, it's a fantastic puzzle game that needs 3 dimensions to work.

I'm not entirely sure how some of you can classify 2D = good, 3D = bad. There are hundreds (probably more but I haven't played 1000's of games, let alone 3D ones) of great 3D games, the same goes for 2D games.

What's the objection to 3D anyway? Yeah I know some games are made into 3D because it seems 'the thing to do' rather than for a decent reason but some games are designed with 3D in mind and benefit greatly from it. Even if your'e not willing to accept modern day 3D games, you can't object that both Zeewolfs, Hunter, Zarch/Virus, are all good 3D games.

Heck even Marble Madness, Desert/Jungle Strike, D-Generation, they are all essentially 3D games. Just seems to me as though it's the idea of 3D games people don't like because they destroyed our beloved 2D.
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Old 14 July 2004, 12:24   #7
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No I love some 3d games I didn't say 3d is bad but these are "I wannabe 3d" games like some others developed and cancelled for amiga recently I remember a thread I bashed one really good and the developers came, it was last year lol. secret of my soul 3d! how bad it was You won't seriously say you don't see something objectionable with these ugly screenshots will you? There was a time on PC that 3d could only be done ugly because of hardware limitations, in early 90s. Well amiga doesn't need to catch up with THAT time period certainly. Perhaps it's not a good idea to make something that'll work on slow hardware like blizzardvision other than directly targeting the radeon
line.

If the graphics are ugly and makes you dizzy, or you can easily count the polygons hey that's bad! If the designer said "Let's make a 3d game" rather than "Let's make a game" then decided 3d is the way to go, that's also bad.
That's for the ugliness part. But why 3d in a puzzle game again? Sorry I find it a bit stupid to limit people's interaction with the game dynamics via the interface or psyhical limitations of the engine in a PUZZLE game.

Make 3d when required please, like when you need to create the first person effect in role playing games, 3d is a requirement there. And look at for example, Simon 3d and compare it to simon 1&2, you'll understand what I mean. Same goes for 2d! I'd love eye of the beholder games a lot more if they were in 3d, also true for games you mentioned. Sometimes I wonder how we lived without 3d.

Major thing I object isn't 3d it's "the amiga is dead so we can make crap games and people'll still praise us because they are begging for games" approach. I don't see it here, these are modest games, puzzle games after all and it wouldn't be just to accuse some with that but again, this thread makes me remember the old one!

Anyway that's a debate I'm very bored of, I'll link this thread in future reincarnations of the issue. (unless the thread doesn't turn into secret of my balls 3d thread)

Last edited by oldpx; 14 July 2004 at 12:38.
 
Old 14 July 2004, 12:33   #8
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hehe...

looks like it was a little mis-aimed but it still applies (just not directly at you). There are some people on the board like this so they can read it instead

Those screens are ugly though, I've never liked the look of homemade opengl games. They all seem to have that horrible shiny look to them and none of the 'building blocks' seem to look as though they belong.

Monkey Ball rocks.
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Old 14 July 2004, 12:36   #9
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I keep editing the above post I think I'll keep editing for a while, look what you made me do LOL!
 
Old 14 July 2004, 20:23   #10
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"the amiga is dead so we can make crap games and people'll still praise us because they are begging for games"

Indeed.

The problem with these games is not that they are 3D, the problem is that they are so poorly done! I wonder when Amiga people wil snap out of it and realize they are buying shit, and stop supporting the development of shit on the Amiga. How can products like that be sold today, even to a select niche? If Amiga-zealots keep suporting stuff like that, it seem they share a lot with shit-eaters, sorry.

Wetrix ROX btw.
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Old 14 July 2004, 20:44   #11
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Yes exactly, I made a mistake by starting criticising from the 3d part and caused misunderstanding!
 
Old 29 July 2004, 16:42   #12
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(I donīt normally write to forums, but this time i just couldnīt stay quiet.)

Hi, I am the author of those games you are calling crap. Nice to meet all of you.

Firstly, I agree that there really arenīt many commercial and original new games on amiga, but there are few good ones still, for example Tales of Tamar and Crossfire II (and donīt forget Payback and keep in mind the number of developers behind it: just one. Itīs not GTA3, but itīs still fun. ) Remember the hardware thay are supposed to run on and the teams behind them, they donīt have millions of dollars or hundreds of huors to but on a game that will not give them any money back.
Itīs a miracle anyone really even cares to do anything NEW for an amiga, even if the results are crappy. Itīs better to try and fail that not to try at all.

I also hated those pc games of late 90's where anything was forced to 3D, and it really didn't work in most of the cases. Then some day tried to do some simple 3d stuff on my amiga. The results are what they are, but I was having fun.

My older games (ImuBox, MenoBox etc...) are quite crappy. But keep in mind that they are just excercises in programming, I was/am just learning the basics of OpenGL-programming and C. I use a command line compiler (without debugger! ), an old a1200 with faulty gfx-card. (The poor student syndrome)
And damn, I havenīt had so much fun with an amiga since AMOS came out!
And in my perspective, that is all that counts.

And about releasing, I thought that "maybe out there is someone who might like these silly games, even a little tiny bit."
That was reason enough.

And after all, they are free!
As I have statet at the gamesī FAQ: "I you donīt like them, just ignore them."
 
Old 29 July 2004, 21:10   #13
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Hello Luoma,

You will find out that, at least me, but I belive Burseg as well, were harshly criticizing the current Amiga "commercial" efforts. Your games being not the case. Now if you were charging money for this, I would be thinking completely different.

I think the teams behind most current Amiga commercial games are just out to make a quick buck out of anything they produce. Games in the "golden era" were produced by one man with little to no budget, nevertheless they were great games. This doesn't happen anymore, moreso in the Amiga world. People can churn out anything and zealotic amiga populace will buy it just to "support the Amiga". If you would have sold this you would have come to this forum and start posting stuff like "by criticizing my game you are killing the Amiga!!!" and stuff.

I'm glad you are not like that and I welcome you aboard.
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Old 29 July 2004, 21:28   #14
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Hello and welcome abord

i've no particular love for 3d games, so i'm not the one to criticize them. I understand that aside the graphic and 2d/3d approach the main thing of a game is the amusement you have back by playin it. the fact is that given the choice on what to pass your time on and not yet experienced the fun of a new game, you can choose mainly on what you see. and that it's not a particular cool 3d. is the one that keeps me far from the game instead. please understand: mine want to be only an encouragement, as if your work would be horrible, still would be better than any thing i could code. i know nothing of code. but if you are interested in ameliore the appeal of them, well you have a fairly good margin for work. if not it's ok anyway, hell they are free as you said.

you may be right when you say"if you don't like them, just ignore them" but consider that your invitation pretty a obvious statement, as already people don't take what they don't like, and as you are putting your work for other to enjoy/taste/try, get the feedback too, when it's negative also.

anyway cool to have you there
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Old 29 July 2004, 21:41   #15
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I have nothing at all against 3D, though it would be nice to see some 2D games occasionally, why does EVERYTHING have to be in 3D?

It doesn't!! Nowadays developers think that for a game to be good it must be 3D, which as we all know is a load of bollox!

I think there is an over-saturation of FPS games, as every other game is an FPS!

Why not release a good old fashioned platform game with superb gfx? or a shoot 'em up with stunning gfx & sfx?
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Old 05 August 2004, 09:19   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lu0ma
(I donīt normally write to forums, but this time i just couldnīt stay quiet.)

Hi, I am the author of those games you are calling crap. Nice to meet all of you.

My older games (ImuBox, MenoBox etc...) are quite crappy. But keep in mind that they are just excercises in programming, I was/am just learning the basics of OpenGL-programming and C. I use a command line compiler (without debugger! ), an old a1200 with faulty gfx-card. (The poor student syndrome)
And damn, I havenīt had so much fun with an amiga since AMOS came out!
And in my perspective, that is all that counts.

And about releasing, I thought that "maybe out there is someone who might like these silly games, even a little tiny bit."
That was reason enough.

And after all, they are free!
As I have statet at the gamesī FAQ: "I you donīt like them, just ignore them."
Since you're learning to code and are releasing the fruits of your labour for free, you are to be congratulated. You can't please all the people all of the time...........good luck with learning the art of coding
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Old 07 August 2004, 05:25   #17
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lol, them games do look fun :-)

Lu0ma, why not shut these people up and make just one REALLLY GOOD 2d platformer with sexy graphics ?

note> one that works on a pretty almost standard A1200 so everyone can play it!
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