A1200 Killing Hard Disks...

Mick_AKA · 13 January 2008, 20:33

Ok so here's what happened the first time:

Installed a 1.4Gb WD hard drive into A1200 through buffered IDE interface (one of the old eyetech ones)

Installed OS 3.1, installed drivers for Subway USB, and fat95 rebooted...

Booted fine, stuck my pen drive into a USB socket, popped up on my workbench...

Installed new Poseidon for Subway, Installed AmiCDFS, rebooted...

Plugged in USB CD Writer, inserted OS 3.5 CD, Installed OS 3.5 no problems...

Rebooted, hard disk clicking VERY loudly, burning smell, Amiga turned off...

Buffered IDE interface dead, tried hard disk without and got loud clicks and eventually a cylinder error on screen.

Bugger.

And the 2nd Time:

Installed a 3.2Gb Toshiba hard drive (good tested one from my old laptop) into A1200 directly.

Installed OS 3.1, installed drivers for Subway USB, and fat95 rebooted...

Booted fine, stuck my pen drive into a USB socket, popped up on my workbench...

Installed new Poseidon for Subway, Installed AmiCDFS, rebooted...

Plugged in USB CD Writer, inserted OS 3.5 CD, Installed OS 3.5 no problems...

Rebooted, hard disk clicking VERY loudly again, Amiga throws up a cylinder error.

Fuck!

And the 3rd Time:

Installed a 2Gb WD hard drive (good tested one out of old powerbook) into A1200 directly.

Installed OS 3.1, installed drivers for Subway USB, and fat95 rebooted...

Booted fine, stuck my pen drive into a USB socket, popped up on my workbench...

Installed new Poseidon for Subway, Installed AmiCDFS, rebooted...

Plugged in USB CD Writer, inserted OS 3.5 CD, Installed OS 3.5 no problems...

Rebooted, hard disk clicking VERY loudly again, Amiga throws up a cylinder error.

AGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So, either the Amiga is killing hard disks and an identical point in time, or attempting to boot to OS 3.5 is killing them?!!?!?!

Any ideas? (was going to try compact flash but dont really want to kill a 2gb CF card)

thomas · 13 January 2008, 21:22

I'd say you've overloaded your power supply. Everything went fine as long as you plugged in one piece of hardware at a time. But at the last reboot, when everything had to initialize at the same time, the power supply failed. The loud clicking was caused by the drive being switched off and on very quickly. It does not like this. And it confuses the IDE driver, hence the "cylinder error".

The drives don't necessarily need to be dead. You just have to run them with a sufficiently strong power supply.

Mick_AKA · 13 January 2008, 22:10

Im running an original 'Goliath' power supply, you know the external ones that are an AT supply in a big metal case?

Not sure how much power it's putting out...

I cant understand why it was fine booting everything (inc USB devices) in 3.1 but died booting 3.5 without the CD-ROM or flash drive plugged in?!

Looks like im gonna have to build a more powerfull supply into the casing for the Goliath then

Mick_AKA · 13 January 2008, 23:56

Have just tried booting the drives on a stock A1200 with 3.1 roms and im getting:
"Workbench has a checksum error on block..."

On further testing it also looks like my Subway is dead

DrF · 14 January 2008, 00:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mick_AKA

On further testing it also looks like my Subway is dead

I do pray its not, those things cost gooood money

Maybe the subway caused all this?
I've had USB gadgets drain far too much juice on PCs, they usually come up with some gibberish warning me about a overload though...

Mick_AKA · 14 January 2008, 00:15

The subway was working fine previously, now im down 3 hard disks, a buffered IDE interface and possibly my subway.

Anyone have any ideas? because at the moment im ready to toss all my Amiga equipment out of the window...

exoticaga · 14 January 2008, 01:18

Inserted a better gfx card in the pc today with 400 psu. HD started clicking (squealing clicks). Disconnected a device (dvdrw) clicking gone. Another one that needs a bigger psu or less attached to the pc.

I have killed an 80gb drive in the past by ignoring this sound. It did it on startup and some other times. I know better now, and the post above confirms what i found to be the problem.

The dead 80gb drive now only makes constant the same noises as was first noise. Even with Pc stripped barebone, mem, mouse, keyboard, gfx only connected to any psu. Shame because it still has much needed data on it that is needed.

I tried to revive it with PC3K but its russian i think, cannot understand it. Still looking for hard drive motherboard to see if that can cure it.

Theres a lot to be said for making sure you have enough psu power available for the computer.

Mick_AKA · 14 January 2008, 01:52

My current goliath PSU is aparently 150 watts surely an A1200 with one slimline 2.5in hard disk and subway (which im only using 2 ports on) shouldn't be pulling that much power?!

Calgor · 14 January 2008, 04:08

@Mick_AKA

The hard drive and CD Writer will require the most power (from the current draw) on spin-up (i.e. after a reboot or power up). It should require less overall if you do not have a CD inserted while power on/reboot.

I thought the subway had overcurrent + overvoltage protection on the USB port so it should be 500mA 5V per USB port max?

You should check your +12v and +5v levels to see if your power supply is not coping under the extra load. These supplies do get worse with age.

The best A500 power supply should be able to power your setup (assuming no accelerator) if you have one. Just to be sure, if you do have one, check the amp it can supply compared with your HD specs + 2 usb ports. I think there is a website somewhere that showed typcial current draws which you could compare your setup with.

thomas · 14 January 2008, 09:11

Quote:

"Workbench has a checksum error on block..."

This is a software error. It was caused by switching off the HDD in the middle of an acccess operation. You should be able to fix it by formatting the partition.

Merlin · 14 January 2008, 11:14

@ exoticaga

What model of hard drive is it? If you post the make and model, I can have a look in my parts bin as I may have another controller board that will fit.

Merlin

Mick_AKA · 15 January 2008, 14:14

I should not that I was not booting the system with anything plugged into the USB when each drive died.

Thanks for the offer Merlin but im afraid I threw the drives away in a fit on insane rage and the bin man has been

Bamiga2002 · 15 January 2008, 15:01

Do you have another mobo that you could try some hard drives on? Maybe a faulty mobo there...

Mick_AKA · 15 January 2008, 20:36

Yep, tried my spare Rev 1B motherboard, this time with an A500 supply, same story

zipper · 15 January 2008, 21:36

Well, killed an external HD yesterday - on my lappie. Put wrong power cord into the housing, 24V instead of 12V. Zap, and that's it...

Mick_AKA · 16 January 2008, 00:04

I cant see over power being my problem *sigh* looks like I just cant run OS3.5 anymore!

Calgor · 16 January 2008, 10:26

@Mick

Don't tell me you are using the same IDE cable all the time? Perhaps it is some problem with that cable. Maybe the hard drive is making clicks trying to reread the drive because:
- power problem
- software error as pointed out by thomas. In which case format should fix it up
- bad cable
- OS3.5 drivers are stuffing up the writing on your drive (after reboot it would load in the ROM Update). In which case a format using OS3.1 should fix it up.

You should try the drives in a non-amiga computer (with a different cable) to see how they fare, and whether you can format them there after they are having problems.

Jope · 16 January 2008, 11:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by zipper

Well, killed an external HD yesterday - on my lappie. Put wrong power cord into the housing, 24V instead of 12V. Zap, and that's it...

Well did the HD die or only the electronics in the external box?

zipper · 16 January 2008, 12:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jope

Well did the HD die or only the electronics in the external box?

At least the HD (tested dead), probably the box electronics, too. Had just copied about 150 GB to that disk, among them my Amiga Forever/Amikit files. Luckily I had "moved" the system from my old lappy to the new so a plain copy was enough to fix after I bought a new disk. PCmover is a great app - of course Amiga doesn't need such procedure.

13 January 2008, 20:33	#1
Mick_AKA crusader of light Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Stone, Staffordshire. Posts: 1,151	A1200 Killing Hard Disks... Ok so here's what happened the first time: Installed a 1.4Gb WD hard drive into A1200 through buffered IDE interface (one of the old eyetech ones) Installed OS 3.1, installed drivers for Subway USB, and fat95 rebooted... Booted fine, stuck my pen drive into a USB socket, popped up on my workbench... Installed new Poseidon for Subway, Installed AmiCDFS, rebooted... Plugged in USB CD Writer, inserted OS 3.5 CD, Installed OS 3.5 no problems... Rebooted, hard disk clicking VERY loudly, burning smell, Amiga turned off... Buffered IDE interface dead, tried hard disk without and got loud clicks and eventually a cylinder error on screen. Bugger. And the 2nd Time: Installed a 3.2Gb Toshiba hard drive (good tested one from my old laptop) into A1200 directly. Installed OS 3.1, installed drivers for Subway USB, and fat95 rebooted... Booted fine, stuck my pen drive into a USB socket, popped up on my workbench... Installed new Poseidon for Subway, Installed AmiCDFS, rebooted... Plugged in USB CD Writer, inserted OS 3.5 CD, Installed OS 3.5 no problems... Rebooted, hard disk clicking VERY loudly again, Amiga throws up a cylinder error. Fuck! And the 3rd Time: Installed a 2Gb WD hard drive (good tested one out of old powerbook) into A1200 directly. Installed OS 3.1, installed drivers for Subway USB, and fat95 rebooted... Booted fine, stuck my pen drive into a USB socket, popped up on my workbench... Installed new Poseidon for Subway, Installed AmiCDFS, rebooted... Plugged in USB CD Writer, inserted OS 3.5 CD, Installed OS 3.5 no problems... Rebooted, hard disk clicking VERY loudly again, Amiga throws up a cylinder error. AGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! So, either the Amiga is killing hard disks and an identical point in time, or attempting to boot to OS 3.5 is killing them?!!?!?! Any ideas? (was going to try compact flash but dont really want to kill a 2gb CF card)

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13 January 2008, 21:22	#2
thomas Registered User Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 6,987	I'd say you've overloaded your power supply. Everything went fine as long as you plugged in one piece of hardware at a time. But at the last reboot, when everything had to initialize at the same time, the power supply failed. The loud clicking was caused by the drive being switched off and on very quickly. It does not like this. And it confuses the IDE driver, hence the "cylinder error". The drives don't necessarily need to be dead. You just have to run them with a sufficiently strong power supply.

13 January 2008, 22:10	#3
Mick_AKA crusader of light Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Stone, Staffordshire. Posts: 1,151	Im running an original 'Goliath' power supply, you know the external ones that are an AT supply in a big metal case? Not sure how much power it's putting out... I cant understand why it was fine booting everything (inc USB devices) in 3.1 but died booting 3.5 without the CD-ROM or flash drive plugged in?! Looks like im gonna have to build a more powerfull supply into the casing for the Goliath then

13 January 2008, 23:56	#4
Mick_AKA crusader of light Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Stone, Staffordshire. Posts: 1,151	Have just tried booting the drives on a stock A1200 with 3.1 roms and im getting: "Workbench has a checksum error on block..." On further testing it also looks like my Subway is dead

14 January 2008, 00:15	#6
Mick_AKA crusader of light Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Stone, Staffordshire. Posts: 1,151	The subway was working fine previously, now im down 3 hard disks, a buffered IDE interface and possibly my subway. Anyone have any ideas? because at the moment im ready to toss all my Amiga equipment out of the window...

14 January 2008, 01:18	#7
exoticaga Registered User Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: UK Posts: 446	Inserted a better gfx card in the pc today with 400 psu. HD started clicking (squealing clicks). Disconnected a device (dvdrw) clicking gone. Another one that needs a bigger psu or less attached to the pc. I have killed an 80gb drive in the past by ignoring this sound. It did it on startup and some other times. I know better now, and the post above confirms what i found to be the problem. The dead 80gb drive now only makes constant the same noises as was first noise. Even with Pc stripped barebone, mem, mouse, keyboard, gfx only connected to any psu. Shame because it still has much needed data on it that is needed. I tried to revive it with PC3K but its russian i think, cannot understand it. Still looking for hard drive motherboard to see if that can cure it. Theres a lot to be said for making sure you have enough psu power available for the computer.

14 January 2008, 01:52	#8
Mick_AKA crusader of light Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Stone, Staffordshire. Posts: 1,151	My current goliath PSU is aparently 150 watts surely an A1200 with one slimline 2.5in hard disk and subway (which im only using 2 ports on) shouldn't be pulling that much power?!

14 January 2008, 04:08	#9
Calgor (Amigas && Amigos)++ Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Anrea Posts: 999	@Mick_AKA The hard drive and CD Writer will require the most power (from the current draw) on spin-up (i.e. after a reboot or power up). It should require less overall if you do not have a CD inserted while power on/reboot. I thought the subway had overcurrent + overvoltage protection on the USB port so it should be 500mA 5V per USB port max? You should check your +12v and +5v levels to see if your power supply is not coping under the extra load. These supplies do get worse with age. The best A500 power supply should be able to power your setup (assuming no accelerator) if you have one. Just to be sure, if you do have one, check the amp it can supply compared with your HD specs + 2 usb ports. I think there is a website somewhere that showed typcial current draws which you could compare your setup with.

14 January 2008, 11:14	#11
Merlin AmiBay MegaMod Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Manchester, UK Age: 62 Posts: 1,163	@ exoticaga What model of hard drive is it? If you post the make and model, I can have a look in my parts bin as I may have another controller board that will fit. Merlin

15 January 2008, 14:14	#12
Mick_AKA crusader of light Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Stone, Staffordshire. Posts: 1,151	I should not that I was not booting the system with anything plugged into the USB when each drive died. Thanks for the offer Merlin but im afraid I threw the drives away in a fit on insane rage and the bin man has been

15 January 2008, 15:01	#13
Bamiga2002 BlizzardPPC'less Join Date: May 2004 Location: Finland Age: 46 Posts: 3,210	Do you have another mobo that you could try some hard drives on? Maybe a faulty mobo there...

15 January 2008, 20:36	#14
Mick_AKA crusader of light Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Stone, Staffordshire. Posts: 1,151	Yep, tried my spare Rev 1B motherboard, this time with an A500 supply, same story

15 January 2008, 21:36	#15
zipper Registered User Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: finland Posts: 1,838	Well, killed an external HD yesterday - on my lappie. Put wrong power cord into the housing, 24V instead of 12V. Zap, and that's it...

16 January 2008, 00:04	#16
Mick_AKA crusader of light Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Stone, Staffordshire. Posts: 1,151	I cant see over power being my problem sigh looks like I just cant run OS3.5 anymore!

16 January 2008, 10:26	#17
Calgor (Amigas && Amigos)++ Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Anrea Posts: 999	@Mick Don't tell me you are using the same IDE cable all the time? Perhaps it is some problem with that cable. Maybe the hard drive is making clicks trying to reread the drive because: - power problem - software error as pointed out by thomas. In which case format should fix it up - bad cable - OS3.5 drivers are stuffing up the writing on your drive (after reboot it would load in the ROM Update). In which case a format using OS3.1 should fix it up. You should try the drives in a non-amiga computer (with a different cable) to see how they fare, and whether you can format them there after they are having problems.

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