English Amiga Board


Go Back   English Amiga Board > Support > support.Hardware

 
 
Thread Tools
Old 02 June 2018, 21:10   #1
big-ted
Registered User

 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Leicester UK
Posts: 30
a500 diagrom info needed.

I have a 500+ that won't boot after a battery leak. It didn't originally give any output via serial, I replaced U12 and it now boots to an output.

I have bleeped out the pins from u12 and u13 and also the vias in the surrounding areas.

@???U

Garbage before this text was binary numbers: 1, 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, 128, 240, 1 5, 170 and 85
To help you find biterrors to paula. Now starting normal startuptext etc


Amiga DiagROM V1.0 - 27-Oct-17 - By John (Chucky/The Gang) Hertell


Testing if serial loopbackadapter is installed: <> NOT DETECTED
- Parallel Code $ff - Start of ROM, CPU Seems somewhat alive
Checking status of mousebuttons for different startups:
P1RMB P2RMB
Set all Interrupt enablebits (INTENA $dff09a) to Disabled: Done
Set all Interrupt requestbits (INTREQ $dff09c) to Disabled: Done
Set all DMA enablebits (DMACON $dff096) to Disabled: Done
- Parallel Code $fe - Test UDS/LDS line
- Test of writing word $FFFF to $400 OK
- Test of writing word $00FF to $400 OK
- Test of writing word $FF00 to $400 OK
- Test of writing word $0000 to $400 OK
- Test of writing byte (even) $ff to $400 OK
- Test of writing byte (odd) $ff to $401 OK
- Parallel Code $fd - Start of chipmemdetection

Addr $00100400 OK Number of 32K blocks found: $20
Startaddr: $00000400 Endaddr: $00100000
Using $000ECCDE as start of workmem

- Parallel Code $fc - Start of motherboard fastmemdetection
- Parallel Code $fb - Memorydetection done
- Parallel Code $fa - Starting to use detected memory

Testing if serial loopbackadapter is installed: <> NOT DETECTED
Detecting if we have a working raster: DETECTED
Detected Chipmem: 1024KB
Detected Motherboard Fastmem: 0KB
Basememory address: $000ECCDE
- Parallel Code $f9 - Detected memory in use, we now have a stack etc
Set Start of copper (COP1LCH $dff080): Done
Starting Copper (COPJMP1 $dff088): Done
Set all DMA enablebits (DMACON $dff096) to Enabled:



It hangs here with a black screen.



If I hold right mouse button at boot I get purple screen and





@???U

Garbage before this text was binary numbers: 1, 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, 128, 240, 15, 170 and 85
To help you find biterrors to paula. Now starting normal startuptext etc
Amiga DiagROM V1.0 - 27-Oct-17 - By John (Chucky/The Gang) Hertell


Testing if serial loopbackadapter is installed: <> NOT DETECTED
- Parallel Code $ff - Start of ROM, CPU Seems somewhat alive
Checking status of mousebuttons for different startups:
P1LMB P1RMB P2RMB
Set all Interrupt enablebits (INTENA $dff09a) to Disabled: Done
Set all Interrupt requestbits (INTREQ $dff09c) to Disabled: Done
Set all DMA enablebits (DMACON $dff096) to Disabled: Done
- Parallel Code $fe - Test UDS/LDS line
- Test of writing word $FFFF to $400 OK
- Test of writing word $00FF to $400 OK
- Test of writing word $FF00 to $400 OK
- Test of writing word $0000 to $400 OK
- Test of writing byte (even) $ff to $400 OK
- Test of writing byte (odd) $ff to $401 OK
- Parallel Code $fd - Start of chipmemdetection

Addr $00100400 OK Number of 32K blocks found: $20
Startaddr: $00000400 Endaddr: $00100000
Using $000ECCDE as start of workmem

- Parallel Code $fc - Start of motherboard fastmemdetection
- Parallel Code $fb - Memorydetection done
- Parallel Code $fa - Starting to use detected memory

Testing if serial loopbackadapter is installed: <> NOT DETECTED
Detecting if we have a working raster: DETECTED
Detected Chipmem: 1024KB
Detected Motherboard Fastmem: 0KB
Basememory address: $000ECCDE
- Parallel Code $f9 - Detected memory in use, we now have a stack etc
We are in a nonchip/nodraw mode. Serialoutput is all we got. colorflash on screen
is actually chars that should be printed on screen. telling user something happens


To use serial communication please hold down ANY key now
OR click the RIGHT mousebutton.
Holding down the LEFT mousebutton will force serial on and turn off screen
forcing stuff to run in fastmem if avaible

We are in a nonchip/nodraw mode. Serialoutput is all we got. colorflash on screen
is actually chars that should be printed on screen. telling user something happens

DiagROM V1.0 - Amiga32 Edition - 27-Oct-17
By John (Chucky / The Gang) Hertell

MAIN MENU

0 - Systeminfo

1 - Audiotests

2 - Memorytests

3 - IRQ/CIA Tests

4 - Graphictests

5 - Porttests

6 - Drivetests

7 - Keyboardtests

8 - Other tests

S - Setup


But cant get any input via pc or amiga keyboards.


If I hold Left mouse during boot i get this

@???U

Garbage before this text was binary numbers: 1, 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, 128, 240, 15, 170 and 85
To help you find biterrors to paula. Now starting normal startuptext etc
Amiga DiagROM V1.0 - 27-Oct-17 - By John (Chucky/The Gang) Hertell


Testing if serial loopbackadapter is installed: <> NOT DETECTED
- Parallel Code $ff - Start of ROM, CPU Seems somewhat alive
Checking status of mousebuttons for different startups:
P1RMB P2RMB
Set all Interrupt enablebits (INTENA $dff09a) to Disabled: Done
Set all Interrupt requestbits (INTREQ $dff09c) to Disabled: Done
Set all DMA enablebits (DMACON $dff096) to Disabled: Done
- Parallel Code $fe - Test UDS/LDS line
- Test of writing word $FFFF to $400 OK
- Test of writing word $00FF to $400 OK
- Test of writing word $FF00 to $400 OK
- Test of writing word $0000 to $400 OK
- Test of writing byte (even) $ff to $400 OK
- Test of writing byte (odd) $ff to $401 OK
- Parallel Code $fd - Start of chipmemdetection

Addr $00100400 OK Number of 32K blocks found: $20
Startaddr: $00000400 Endaddr: $00100000
Using $000ECCDE as start of workmem

- Parallel Code $fc - Start of motherboard fastmemdetection
- Parallel Code $fb - Memorydetection done
- Parallel Code $fa - Starting to use detected memory

Testing if serial loopbackadapter is installed: <> NOT DETECTED
Detecting if we have a working raster: DETECTED
Detected Chipmem: 1024KB
Detected Motherboard Fastmem: 0KB
Basememory address: $000ECCDE
- Parallel Code $f9 - Detected memory in use, we now have a stack etc
Set Start of copper (COP1LCH $dff080): Done
Starting Copper (COPJMP1 $dff088): Done
Set all DMA enablebits (DMACON $dff096) to Enabled: ?(???????Instruction Detected
PANIC! System halted, not enough resources found to generate better dump

with a black screen.


It seems to hang when asking dmacon to write or clear, how do I narrow down what is not responding and hanging the system.

Any help to decipher what this would be appreciated.

Ted
big-ted is offline  
AdSense AdSense  
Old 02 June 2018, 21:17   #2
plasmab
Registered User

plasmab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Glasgow
Posts: 2,243
The usual killer with the 500+ when this happens is that the lines that pass by the battery to Gary get trashed. Until DiagROM switches on DMA its only using Paula (for serial out), the CIAs (for timing) and Agnus (Chip RAM).

I would start looking at Gary.
plasmab is online now  
Old 02 June 2018, 22:03   #3
big-ted
Registered User

 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Leicester UK
Posts: 30
Thanks for the reply, Plasmab I'll check it out tomorrow and surrounding traces.

Ted
big-ted is offline  
Old 03 June 2018, 14:35   #4
big-ted
Registered User

 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Leicester UK
Posts: 30
No, all Gary traces and vias beep out too, the 5 traces in front of the battery all check out. Going to have to get scope on the job. Not used it before on a pcb so here's a learning curve.

A little more info

If I put original rom back in it goes through the Grey screens and the power light goes from dim to bright, but stops on white screen so it's close to booting.

If I hold right button with diagrom I get purple screen with the main menu on pc monitor but can't input via pc or amiga

Ted
big-ted is offline  
Old 03 June 2018, 14:37   #5
big-ted
Registered User

 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Leicester UK
Posts: 30
Just to add, have tried swapping cias with each other. Swapped cpu paula and Gary for know working ones. Still nothing.
big-ted is offline  
Old 03 June 2018, 15:02   #6
plasmab
Registered User

plasmab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Glasgow
Posts: 2,243
There is something that is causing the bus to hang forever when DMA is enabled.

Use the serial only DiagROM to check that audio will play.

IIRC RetoGameModz has a video with an A600/A500 boot issue exactly as you describe. Worth watching that video.

(Summary the ODD and EVEN CIA select lines were broken in that video)

EDIT: You can use the mouse to move the cursor in diagrom if its actually running.

Last edited by plasmab; 03 June 2018 at 15:12.
plasmab is online now  
Old 03 June 2018, 15:44   #7
big-ted
Registered User

 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Leicester UK
Posts: 30
No can't move the mouse....
Unless I scope the dtack at the cpu and it then boots into the menu and I can move the mouse and play the audio test which works. As soon as I remove the scope probe it hangs again.

Progress.

Put a direct line from the resistor near gary to the via at the bottom of the cpu. No change.
big-ted is offline  
Old 03 June 2018, 16:03   #8
plasmab
Registered User

plasmab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Glasgow
Posts: 2,243
measure DTACK from Gary itself to the CPU & Agnus. And also check VPA/VMA
plasmab is online now  
Old 11 June 2018, 19:48   #9
big-ted
Registered User

 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Leicester UK
Posts: 30
Managed to borrow a working Agnus, same fault.
swaped other socketed chip inc cpu no change.

Found this guide

POWER UP PROBLEMS
1. No workbench prompt:
Screen goes from dark grey to light grey but does not display

8520 U7 Odd CIA (U300 A2000) >swapped with even
8364 U3 Paula (U200 A2000) >swapped with know good one
EMI 1301 1ohm resistor (R309 Rev. 6A/7 boards; R200 A2000) > resistor good.
8370 - 8372/8375 U2 Fat Agnus (U101 A2000) >swapped with know good U2
74LS32 U37 (chip select) U301 A2000) >
U2 socket

Possibly a broken U37, is there a way test test this on the board ? or should I replace it and see. ?


also checked levels at cpu for
BG 4.45 V
BGACK 4.99 V
BR 4.99V
RESET 5V
HLT 4.99 V

Int lines
int 2_ 5v @ u7 and U3
int 6_ 0.17v @u8 and u3 (5v when powering on and drops to 0.17
int 3_ 3.95v @ u2 and u3

These are "E clock" everything on the right of the resistor the cia's have a clean trace. (cia.jpg)

Everything left of the resistor cpu and expansion pin 50 have a "drop out" (cpu.jpg)

Also attached are the "ticks" from the two cias.


As you can see still got no further forward.
Its not going to beat me yet. (the wife and kids say otherwise)
Checked every trace from the cpu and angnus to there destinations and disappointingly they all came back good too.

Ted
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	cia.jpg
Views:	27
Size:	10.3 KB
ID:	58542   Click image for larger version

Name:	cpu.jpg
Views:	24
Size:	10.4 KB
ID:	58543   Click image for larger version

Name:	u7tick.jpg
Views:	23
Size:	8.5 KB
ID:	58544   Click image for larger version

Name:	U8_tick.jpg
Views:	22
Size:	9.1 KB
ID:	58545  
big-ted is offline  
Old 12 June 2018, 22:48   #10
plasmab
Registered User

plasmab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Glasgow
Posts: 2,243
It’s highly unlikely that a chip has gone.

The CIAs get their bus cycle terminated by VPa/VMA... trace those.
plasmab is online now  
Old 13 June 2018, 22:46   #11
big-ted
Registered User

 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Leicester UK
Posts: 30
Hey, Have traced both at the cpu and the results are as below.
Booting.jpg is while it is booting up to the point when it tries to set dma.
the we get hang.jpg both go high to 5v and sit there.

It did get slightly further once no extra info on the serial but the screen flashed alernating between purple/yellow, and the traces on vma and vpa showed signs of life. (its diagrom remember not stock colours) could have been a glitch though.

Thanks for helping plasmab.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	booting.jpg
Views:	29
Size:	34.1 KB
ID:	58571   Click image for larger version

Name:	hang.jpg
Views:	27
Size:	31.9 KB
ID:	58572  
big-ted is offline  
Old 13 June 2018, 23:44   #12
plasmab
Registered User

plasmab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Glasgow
Posts: 2,243
a500 diagrom info needed.

Ok. Trace each address pin at the cpu .. I need to know which address isn’t getting acknowledged

Edit: a multimeter 1 or 0 for each address pin

Last edited by plasmab; 14 June 2018 at 08:27.
plasmab is online now  
Old 14 June 2018, 20:32   #13
big-ted
Registered User

 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Leicester UK
Posts: 30
Hope I got this right. so basically you want to know if there is any activity or not on or off.

I did the same test a few of times and got different results.
started at pin 29 on the cpu.
I've put it in a basic excel spreadsheet

Column "a" was a flashy screen garbled colours.
the rest are when it goes to the black screen with the set dma command.

I put the scope on when first booting during memory test flashy green screen and all the channels have some kind of data wave forms then some drop to 0 and a few have very few waves.

it seems pin 11 upwards have issues with no data.
The columns on the table represent the address pin 1 - 23, and are in volts.

A bit more Info than just on or off, but I thought the last column the pin holding at five volts might mean something.
Attached Files
File Type: rar adrdress.rar (6.0 KB, 17 views)

Last edited by big-ted; 14 June 2018 at 23:09.
big-ted is offline  
Old 16 June 2018, 10:14   #14
big-ted
Registered User

 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Leicester UK
Posts: 30
I've ordered a cheapo logic analyser from China, coming by slow boat. Might be able to help when it arrives in a few weeks time.
big-ted is offline  
Old 17 June 2018, 19:44   #15
big-ted
Registered User

 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Leicester UK
Posts: 30
Made some progress, now I have new issues.
Put a new rom socket on the board.
I now have an issue with the odd cia timing. I've swapped the chips around same outcome.
@???U

Garbage before this text was binary numbers: 1, 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, 128, 240, 15, 170 and 85
To help you find biterrors to paula. Now starting normal startuptext etc

























Serial: 9600 BPS - CPU: 680x0 - Chip: 1024KB - KBFast: 0 Base: $000ECCDE
Amiga DiagROM V1.0 - 27-Oct-17 - By John (Chucky/The Gang) Hertell


Testing if serial loopbackadapter is installed: <> NOT DETECTED
- Parallel Code $ff - Start of ROM, CPU Seems somewhat alive
Checking status of mousebuttons for different startups:
P1RMB P2RMB
Set all Interrupt enablebits (INTENA $dff09a) to Disabled: Done
Set all Interrupt requestbits (INTREQ $dff09c) to Disabled: Done
Set all DMA enablebits (DMACON $dff096) to Disabled: Done
- Parallel Code $fe - Test UDS/LDS line
- Test of writing word $FFFF to $400 OK
- Test of writing word $00FF to $400 OK
- Test of writing word $FF00 to $400 OK
- Test of writing word $0000 to $400 OK
- Test of writing byte (even) $ff to $400 OK
- Test of writing byte (odd) $ff to $401 OK
- Parallel Code $fd - Start of chipmemdetection

Addr $00100400 OK Number of 32K blocks found: $20
Startaddr: $00000400 Endaddr: $00100000
Using $000ECCDE as start of workmem

- Parallel Code $fc - Start of motherboard fastmemdetection
- Parallel Code $fb - Memorydetection done
- Parallel Code $fa - Starting to use detected memory

Testing if serial loopbackadapter is installed: <> NOT DETECTED
Detecting if we have a working raster: DETECTED
Detected Chipmem: 1024KB
Detected Motherboard Fastmem: 0KB
Basememory address: $000ECCDE
- Parallel Code $f9 - Detected memory in use, we now have a stack etc
Set Start of copper (COP1LCH $dff080): Done
Starting Copper (COPJMP1 $dff088): Done
Set all DMA enablebits (DMACON $dff096) to Enabled: Done
Set Beam Conter control register to 32 (PAL) (BEAMCON0 $dff1dc): Done
Set POTGO to all OUTPUT ($FF00) (POTGO $dff034): Done
- Parallel Code $f8 - Starting up screen, text echoed to serialport
Amiga DiagROM V1.0 - 27-Oct-17 - By John (Chucky/The Gang) Hertell



To use serial communication please hold down ANY key now
OR click the RIGHT mousebutton.
Holding down the LEFT mousebutton will force serial on and turn off screen
forcing stuff to run in fastmem if avaible


DiagROM V1.0 - Amiga32 Edition - 27-Oct-17
By John (Chucky / The Gang) Hertell

MAIN MENU

0 - Systeminfo

1 - Audiotests

2 - Memorytests

3 - IRQ/CIA Tests

4 - Graphictests

5 - Porttests

6 - Drivetests

7 - Keyboardtests

8 - Other tests

S - Setup







Serial: 9600 BPS - CPU: 680x0 - Chip: 1024KB - KBFast: 0 Base: $000ECCDE
Information of this machine:

Dump of all readable Custom Chipset HW Registers:
BLTDDAT ($dff000): $FFFF DMACONR ($dff002): $4380 VPOSR ($dff004): $A000
VHPOSR ($dff006): $8737 DSKDATR ($dff008): $FFFF JOY0DAT ($dff00a): $FE00
POT0DAT ($dff012): $BDD4 POT1DAT ($dff014): $D4D4 POTINP ($dff016): $5500
SERDATR ($dff018): $0800 DSKBYTR ($dff01a): $9000 INTENAR ($dff01c): $0000
INTREQR ($dff01e): $0020 DENISEID ($dff07c): $FFFC HHPOSR ($dff1dc): $00E0

Chipmem starts at: $00000400 and Ends at: $00100000 Unused chip: 968930 Bytes





















Serial: 9600 BPS - CPU: 680x0 - Chip: 1024KB - KBFast: 0 Base: $000ECCDE
DiagROM V1.0 - Amiga32 Edition - 27-Oct-17
By John (Chucky / The Gang) Hertell

MAIN MENU

0 - Systeminfo

1 - Audiotests

2 - Memorytests

3 - IRQ/CIA Tests

4 - Graphictests

5 - Porttests

6 - Drivetests

7 - Keyboardtests

8 - Other tests

S - Setup







Serial: 9600 BPS - CPU: 680x0 - Chip: 1024KB - KBFast: 0 Base: $000ECCDE
IRQ & CIA Tests




1 - Test IRQs

2 - Test CIAs

9 - Mainmenu





















Serial: 9600 BPS - CPU: 680x0 - Chip: 1024KB - KBFast: 0 Base: $000ECCDE
CIA Tests. Check if your CIAs can time stuff. REQUIRES LEV3 IRQ!

Press any key to start tests (2 sec/each), Press ESC for mainmenu


Flashing on screen is fully normal, indicating CIA timing

Testing Timer A, on CIA-A (ODD) : 13056ms - CIA Timing too slow! FAILED
Testing Timer B, on CIA-A (ODD) : 13056ms - CIA Timing too slow! FAILED
Testing CIA-A TOD (Tick/VSync) : 4210688 Ticks - Too fast ticksignalFAILED
Testing Timer A, on CIA-B (EVEN): 2000128ms OK
Testing Timer B, on CIA-B (EVEN): 2000128ms OK
Testing CIA-B TOD (HSync) : 31137 Ticks OK


















Serial: 9600 BPS - CPU: 680x0 - Chip: 1024KB - KBFast: 0 Base: $000ECCDE
IRQ & CIA Tests




1 - Test IRQs

2 - Test CIAs

9 - Mainmenu





















Serial: 9600 BPS - CPU: 680x0 - Chip: 1024KB - KBFast: 0 Base: $000ECCDE
Testing IRQ Levels. Press any key to start. ESC or RMB to exit

Screen Flashing during test is normal, it is a sign that IRQ is executed

Testing IRQ Level 1: OK
Testing IRQ Level 2: OK
Testing IRQ Level 3: OK
Testing IRQ Level 4: OK
Testing IRQ Level 5: OK
Testing IRQ Level 6: OK
Testing IRQ Level 7 (WILL Fail unless you press a custom IRQ7 button): CANCELED


IRQ Tests done

Any idea where to try to check now ?

when diagrom first boots it auto goes to system info without any buttons being pressed, if that means anything.

Cheers Ted
big-ted is offline  
Old 24 June 2018, 19:39   #16
big-ted
Registered User

 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Leicester UK
Posts: 30
Fixed it. Was high resistance on d7 to the cia. Just ran some kynar in. Happy days. Now on to my other unit....

Thanks for everybodys help

Ted
big-ted is offline  
Old 25 June 2018, 20:39   #17
CRP
Registered User

 
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Milano
Posts: 28
sorry can you please explain more in detail what your fault was, how you found out and what fixed it?

thanks
CRP is offline  
Old 25 June 2018, 23:29   #18
big-ted
Registered User

 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Leicester UK
Posts: 30
I had a no boot scenario, added diagrom and that would only boot so far and hung at enable dma.(unless I probed dtack with scope) I found when pressing down on the rom area when booting I got different results. Fitted new socket and it then booted diagrom not stock Rom. But had issue with odd cia timings.

Traced data lines (see my other post)and found d7 had high resistance. Soldered in a piece of kynar to by pass original trace and it now works again.

Ted
big-ted is offline  
AdSense AdSense  
 


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Info needed: T2 Judgment Day ninjabearhug Amiga scene 3 20 June 2016 20:09
Basic info needed Dagger Coders. General 8 26 November 2015 18:50
AROS info needed DeafDaz New to Emulation or Amiga scene 20 06 September 2011 05:19
Info needed on A1200 expansion Merlin support.Hardware 22 27 April 2007 14:04
Games: Info Needed thread Twistin'Ghost HOL data problems 22 07 March 2003 16:54

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 16:24.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Page generated in 0.08636 seconds with 16 queries