Tubular Worlds AGA sound issues with WUAE

hexaae · 10 January 2010, 13:43

Tubular Worlds AGA seems to have some strange sound issues (tested with WUAE 2.0.1 and 2.0.2 beta3 2010.01.10):
1. timing is ok ONLY if you select "Sound emulated 100%"...
2. ...but sound fx (explosions etc.) are strange and it's like they are played at wrong frequency.

dlfrsilver · 10 January 2010, 16:10

it works great here..... please tell us how your sound is configurated.

hexaae · 10 January 2010, 16:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlfrsilver

it works great here..... please tell us how your sound is configurated.

Pay attention to sound fx (music is ok), they sound "downsampled" to me... is it just my impression?

dlfrsilver · 10 January 2010, 16:26

use 22050hz or 44000hz. Use 30% for stereo seperation and no emulated audio filter.
Ah i forgot use directsound

It should behave like a real A1200.

Toni Wilen · 10 January 2010, 16:33

Think about it: What does sound settings have to do with this if MUSIC sounds fine but SOUND EFFECTS does not..

Perhaps it shounds wrong, perhaps not but this is too difficult to confirm.

EDIT: also 44100Hz suggestion is nowadays bogus, 48000Hz may be sound cards "native" rate..

hexaae · 10 January 2010, 16:39

I miss my real A1200..

I can't confirm infact it was the same on the real Amiga...
Toni, WASAPI seems the fastest mode (no sound delay etc.) to me, better than DirectSound. Is it correct?

Toni Wilen · 10 January 2010, 16:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by hexaae

I miss my real A1200..

I can't confirm infact it was the same on the real Amiga...
Toni, WASAPI seems the fastest mode (no sound delay etc.) to me, better than DirectSound. Is it correct?

I am too lazy to load it in to A1200, sorry

Yes, WASAPI usually has lower latency. Basically the only reason why it was added.

hexaae · 10 January 2010, 16:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

Think about it: What does sound settings have to do with this if MUSIC sounds fine but SOUND EFFECTS does not..

Good point. Maybe I'm just too paranoid

It's the first game I see where sound settings influence timing (try it without Sound 100% accurate)...

NewDeli · 10 January 2010, 16:56

WASAPI sounds better because it's more or less a kernel driver mode, but it's less stable in the long-run, from what I've experienced.
My tweaking options suggestion is different from Dlfrsilver's, yet it might still need a few addtional steps to solve the issue :
Revert to direct sound, don't swap channels, tick automatic switching, increase sound buffer by one unit.
I have written a short yet effective (yeah, I like to congratulate myself sometimes

) tutorial on how to install ASIO4ALL, in case your audio device (chipset ?) can afford it.

Toni Wilen · 10 January 2010, 17:02

Not again....

Lets repeat: How it can be sound driver problem when music and fx play simultaneously and only fx has possibly wrong pitch..

No more offtopic stuff please.

It is either hearing problem or emulation bug

(it is AGA after all which means timing is something..)

dlfrsilver · 10 January 2010, 17:10

i have tubular worlds AGA installed on my A1200, and my PC just aside. I can compare anytime i want the sound (music or fx). What i got on my A1200 is what i get when i use winuae on my PC.

hexaae · 10 January 2010, 17:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlfrsilver

i have tubular worlds AGA installed on my A1200, and my PC just aside. I can compare anytime i want the sound (music or fx). What i got on my A1200 is what i get when i use winuae on my PC.

Well, this should put all doubts to rest.

NewDeli · 10 January 2010, 18:25

I played the game for a few minutes (ADF, cracked by Classic). As the soundtrack seems to be played at a louder level, I didn't hear much the sfx so I cannot say if they are correct or muffled.
I heard crackles at the very beginning... before the intro.

I know it's irrelevant, but now I remember I grabbed the MS-DOS version instead of the Amiga one for some reason.

hexaae · 12 January 2010, 22:42

Very very strange... Today I tried an experiment: I edited the sound file tubenoise.sfx importing it with a higher frequency and the sound effects (it's an 8SVX file format) finally sound as they should!

Please Toni, investigate on the real Amiga because I'm afraid I was right and sounds are played at incorrect speed. Would also help if someone could find the original dumped disks, not these cracked ones...

dlfrsilver · 13 January 2010, 05:01

This game has no copy protection. The ADF were made from original disks.

Toni Wilen · 13 January 2010, 13:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by hexaae

Very very strange... Today I tried an experiment: I edited the sound file tubenoise.sfx importing it with a higher frequency and the sound effects (it's an 8SVX file format) finally sound as they should!

What is correct frequency? and what is (approximately) "wrong" frequency?

Toni Wilen · 13 January 2010, 16:24

Music + Sound uses different fx frequency values than Sound FX only setting..

hexaae · 13 January 2010, 18:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

What is correct frequency? and what is (approximately) "wrong" frequency?

Importing them in Audacity as RAW with a freq of 44100 they sound more sensibly IMHO... Instead in the game it seems they are played at a VERY low freq... I may be wrong, it's just an impression but it's strange for me...

Unfortunately I don't have my real A1200 here to test the game.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

Music + Sound uses different fx frequency values than Sound FX only setting..

I can't notice a big difference...

Toni Wilen · 13 January 2010, 19:09

You can't play 44100Hz using Paula, max is about 28KHz.. (at least without doublescan tricks but this game is PAL compatible)

hexaae · 13 January 2010, 19:51

Yes, I know. But it's just an example: even if you import the sound fx file as RAW with 22.1KHz you can hear a big difference....

10 January 2010, 13:43	#1
hexaae Bug hunter Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Italy Age: 48 Posts: 2,165	Tubular Worlds AGA sound issues with WUAE Tubular Worlds AGA seems to have some strange sound issues (tested with WUAE 2.0.1 and 2.0.2 beta3 2010.01.10): 1. timing is ok ONLY if you select "Sound emulated 100%"... 2. ...but sound fx (explosions etc.) are strange and it's like they are played at wrong frequency.

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10 January 2010, 16:10	#2
dlfrsilver CaptainM68K-SPS France Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Melun nearby Paris/France Age: 46 Posts: 10,474	it works great here..... please tell us how your sound is configurated.

10 January 2010, 16:26	#4
dlfrsilver CaptainM68K-SPS France Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Melun nearby Paris/France Age: 46 Posts: 10,474	use 22050hz or 44000hz. Use 30% for stereo seperation and no emulated audio filter. Ah i forgot use directsound It should behave like a real A1200.

10 January 2010, 16:33	#5
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,534	Think about it: What does sound settings have to do with this if MUSIC sounds fine but SOUND EFFECTS does not.. Perhaps it shounds wrong, perhaps not but this is too difficult to confirm. EDIT: also 44100Hz suggestion is nowadays bogus, 48000Hz may be sound cards "native" rate..

10 January 2010, 16:39	#6
hexaae Bug hunter Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Italy Age: 48 Posts: 2,165	I miss my real A1200.. I can't confirm infact it was the same on the real Amiga... Toni, WASAPI seems the fastest mode (no sound delay etc.) to me, better than DirectSound. Is it correct?

10 January 2010, 16:56	#9
NewDeli Banned Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Paris / FRANCE Age: 50 Posts: 1,248	WASAPI sounds better because it's more or less a kernel driver mode, but it's less stable in the long-run, from what I've experienced. My tweaking options suggestion is different from Dlfrsilver's, yet it might still need a few addtional steps to solve the issue : Revert to direct sound, don't swap channels, tick automatic switching, increase sound buffer by one unit. I have written a short yet effective (yeah, I like to congratulate myself sometimes ) tutorial on how to install ASIO4ALL, in case your audio device (chipset ?) can afford it.

10 January 2010, 17:02	#10
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,534	Not again.... Lets repeat: How it can be sound driver problem when music and fx play simultaneously and only fx has possibly wrong pitch.. No more offtopic stuff please. It is either hearing problem or emulation bug (it is AGA after all which means timing is something..)

10 January 2010, 17:10	#11
dlfrsilver CaptainM68K-SPS France Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Melun nearby Paris/France Age: 46 Posts: 10,474	i have tubular worlds AGA installed on my A1200, and my PC just aside. I can compare anytime i want the sound (music or fx). What i got on my A1200 is what i get when i use winuae on my PC.

10 January 2010, 18:25	#13
NewDeli Banned Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Paris / FRANCE Age: 50 Posts: 1,248	I played the game for a few minutes (ADF, cracked by Classic). As the soundtrack seems to be played at a louder level, I didn't hear much the sfx so I cannot say if they are correct or muffled. I heard crackles at the very beginning... before the intro. I know it's irrelevant, but now I remember I grabbed the MS-DOS version instead of the Amiga one for some reason.

12 January 2010, 22:42	#14
hexaae Bug hunter Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Italy Age: 48 Posts: 2,165	Very very strange... Today I tried an experiment: I edited the sound file tubenoise.sfx importing it with a higher frequency and the sound effects (it's an 8SVX file format) finally sound as they should! Please Toni, investigate on the real Amiga because I'm afraid I was right and sounds are played at incorrect speed. Would also help if someone could find the original dumped disks, not these cracked ones...

13 January 2010, 05:01	#15
dlfrsilver CaptainM68K-SPS France Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Melun nearby Paris/France Age: 46 Posts: 10,474	This game has no copy protection. The ADF were made from original disks.

13 January 2010, 16:24	#17
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,534	Music + Sound uses different fx frequency values than Sound FX only setting..

13 January 2010, 19:09	#19
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,534	You can't play 44100Hz using Paula, max is about 28KHz.. (at least without doublescan tricks but this game is PAL compatible)

13 January 2010, 19:51	#20
hexaae Bug hunter Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Italy Age: 48 Posts: 2,165	Yes, I know. But it's just an example: even if you import the sound fx file as RAW with 22.1KHz you can hear a big difference....

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