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Old 30 June 2020, 19:32   #1
nikosidis
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2nd button Amiga joystick

I'm planing to make a 2 button joystick for Amiga.
I know the 5V line need a resistor.
Is 0,25Watt 33Ohm ok?
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Old 30 June 2020, 19:34   #2
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You don't need 5V for a second button at all. Just short it to ground like the first button.
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Old 30 June 2020, 19:53   #3
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Daedalus: Ok, thx
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Old 30 June 2020, 20:05   #4
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Daedalus: I'm also thinking about a third button for jump to simulate joystick movement (up, right). Is it just to make a split cable from button connect to up, right pins?
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Old 30 June 2020, 21:20   #5
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For the 2nd fire button you need to have a switch for pin 9.

https://sites.google.com/one-n.co.uk...ttons-joystick

And for a dedicated fire button for jump (UP), yes, just wire a switch in parallel to UP.

Last edited by solarmon; 30 June 2020 at 22:13.
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Old 30 June 2020, 21:39   #6
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solarmon: I don't get it. If I have a button with input, ground. Is it not just to wire from pin 9 to input and ground to ground? Why I need a switch?
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Old 30 June 2020, 21:43   #7
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solarmon: I guess you are thinking if 2nd button can also be used as fire 1. Just like Competition pro. type of joystick?
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Old 30 June 2020, 22:03   #8
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When I say 'switch' I mean whatever you use to make the signal active - which in this case is pulling the signal to ground.

See the diagram in the link I have provided.

EDIT: I was assuming you were going to use the normal method of using micro-switches. But reading your post again, it seems you are looking to use some other method to activate (pull to ground) the signals.

Last edited by solarmon; 30 June 2020 at 22:15.
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Old 30 June 2020, 23:25   #9
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solarmon: Thank you for the answers. I will use micro switch joystick and maybe micro switch buttons. Everything will go to ground.
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Old 01 July 2020, 15:41   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nikosidis View Post
Daedalus: I'm also thinking about a third button for jump to simulate joystick movement (up, right). Is it just to make a split cable from button connect to up, right pins?
Yep, if you connect a switch in parallel with the up switch, for example, it will have the same function and both will still be usable.
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Old 01 July 2020, 22:55   #11
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you have to dd the 5v 10k resistor otherwise in some games the 2nd button will not work

examples

BCkid,bubble and squeak, almost all CD32 games and lot of other games which were designed for the CD32 pad and the SEGA master system pad

also adding a resistor the button will be much better and more responsive
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Old 01 July 2020, 23:11   #12
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A Sega Master System controller does not have any active or passive components in it - it is basically wires, pads and buttons.



Edit: You can see the two fire buttons have connections to pin 6 (FIRE1) and 9 (FIRE2) and connections to pin 8 (GROUND).

I'll try out some of those games with the Sega Master System controllers that I have and see if the second button works. But it works when testing in Amiga Test Kit.

Last edited by solarmon; 01 July 2020 at 23:22.
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Old 01 July 2020, 23:31   #13
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Quote:
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A Sega Master System controller does not have any active or passive components in it - it is basically wires, pads and buttons.



I'll try out some of those games with the Sega Master System controllers that I have and see if the second button works. But it works when testing in Amiga Test Kit.
the cd32 pad have resistors in all butons
anyways
for example BCKID is from 1991 then you can reply me for which 2 button gamepad was done this game ?

because if you do not add a resistor the 2nd button will not work in this game
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Old 01 July 2020, 23:47   #14
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I only questioned your statement:

"designed for the CD32 pad and the SEGA master system pad"

I was just pointing out that the Sega Master System pad does not have any resistors.

I will try the games and see if what works and what doesn't work.
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Old 02 July 2020, 00:30   #15
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@Misclegend

I tried BC Kid in 2 button mode, and with the Sega Master System Controller, the second button does not work for jump.

My Quickshot Maverick QS-162 (designed for Sega Megadrive) does work - B button for headbutt and C button for jump.

My Quickshot Maverick QS-128F didn't work in either Amiga or Sega mode. I assume the 'Sega' mode is for a 2-button Master System controller. Strangely, the 2nd fire button signal was triggered whenever I switch in and out of Sega mode, so there would be a jump only when I switch in or out of Seg mode.

The Amiga Test Kit joystick test showed that for the Sega Master System controller, it was detecting the second fire button. But for the Quickshot QS-162 and QS-128F it was not detecting a 2 firebutton at all.

So this suggest to me that the 2 fire button detection routing is different between ATK and from the game.

I assume the required resistor is a pull up resistor to VCC? I assume the second firebutton detection routine doesn't like it floating, hence the need for the pullup resistor.

Last edited by solarmon; 02 July 2020 at 00:35.
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Old 02 July 2020, 02:10   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solarmon View Post
@Misclegend

I tried BC Kid in 2 button mode, and with the Sega Master System Controller, the second button does not work for jump.

My Quickshot Maverick QS-162 (designed for Sega Megadrive) does work - B button for headbutt and C button for jump.

My Quickshot Maverick QS-128F didn't work in either Amiga or Sega mode. I assume the 'Sega' mode is for a 2-button Master System controller. Strangely, the 2nd fire button signal was triggered whenever I switch in and out of Sega mode, so there would be a jump only when I switch in or out of Seg mode.

The Amiga Test Kit joystick test showed that for the Sega Master System controller, it was detecting the second fire button. But for the Quickshot QS-162 and QS-128F it was not detecting a 2 firebutton at all.

So this suggest to me that the 2 fire button detection routing is different between ATK and from the game.

I assume the required resistor is a pull up resistor to VCC? I assume the second firebutton detection routine doesn't like it floating, hence the need for the pullup resistor.
yes BCKID need a resistor otherwise 2nd button will not work,
according to your tests it seems was coded for the megadrive pad
I can't imagine the Amiga users having a megadrive pad in 1991 , that's really funny because the megadrive in 1991 was just 1 year old

BTW,

if you are testing games
here is what I remember personally tested long time ago
( if my memory don't fail)

don't need a resistor

turrican 1 , 2 and 3
alien 3
yo joe
desert strike
R-type 1 and 2

needs a resistor:

BCKID
bubble and squeak AGA
alfred chicken CD32 (cracked floppy version)
Flink CD32 ( cracked floppy version)

and surely all CD32 games which uses lowlevel.library


post your results

Last edited by Misclegend; 02 July 2020 at 02:17.
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Old 02 July 2020, 11:04   #17
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I just tried Turrican 1 (IPF and ADF) and I could not get any of my joysticks to work with the second button feature.
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Old 02 July 2020, 12:25   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solarmon View Post
I just tried Turrican 1 (IPF and ADF) and I could not get any of my joysticks to work with the second button feature.
turrican 1 2nd button works without resistor ( pin 9 + pin 8 ground)
check how are the buttons linked in your master system pad,use a multimeter
how did you created a floppy from IPF, Have u got a kryoflux?
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Old 02 July 2020, 13:21   #19
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The Master System pad is same as picture above - this is my specific one:



You can see that the two fire button pads connect to signal pin 9 and 6 and to common ground pin on 8. This works as fire button 1 and 2 when tested in Amiga Test Kit.

I converted the IPF image to HFE and used in a Gotek in my A1200. The second firebutton didn't work in that test.

I have a Greaseweazle so I can write the IPF image to floppy disk. But I do have the original Turrican game and disk and tested it in my A500 and that did work!

I now need to test with the original disk in A1200 and figure out why it didn't work with the IPF/HFE version, or whether there is a problem with my A1200.
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Old 03 July 2020, 03:05   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solarmon View Post
The Master System pad is same as picture above - this is my specific one:



You can see that the two fire button pads connect to signal pin 9 and 6 and to common ground pin on 8. This works as fire button 1 and 2 when tested in Amiga Test Kit.

I converted the IPF image to HFE and used in a Gotek in my A1200. The second firebutton didn't work in that test.

I have a Greaseweazle so I can write the IPF image to floppy disk. But I do have the original Turrican game and disk and tested it in my A500 and that did work!

I now need to test with the original disk in A1200 and figure out why it didn't work with the IPF/HFE version, or whether there is a problem with my A1200.
surely your A1200 motherboard is revision 2b ? plz confirm

rev 2b motherboards have certain unknown bug which prevent some games the 2nd button work, perhaps they added a pullup resistor or something alike in pin 9
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