English Amiga Board


Go Back   English Amiga Board > Support > support.Other

 
 
Thread Tools
Old 01 September 2017, 11:18   #1
Retro1234
Bo Bo

Retro1234's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: 5150
Posts: 3,988
Making music with Amiga How?

Making music with Amiga How?

Any guides etc - magazine guides etc
Recommended software
Also I see Music-Keyboards often hooked up to Amigas - How is this done what hardware is needed and can it be done under WinUae?
Thanks
Retro1234 is offline  
Old 01 September 2017, 16:39   #2
Sinphaltimus
Registered User

Sinphaltimus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Cresco, PA, USA
Age: 48
Posts: 1,092
[ Show youtube player ]
Sinphaltimus is offline  
Old 01 September 2017, 16:47   #3
daxb
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Germany
Posts: 2,112
The two main ways are the MIDI one and the tracker one. What to use depends on your goal/preferences.

For MIDI you need a MIDI-interface where you can connect MIDI instruments and a MIDI-sequencer program like BarsnPipes for control/arrangement. I don`t know it it works with WinUAE or if it makes sense.

Then there are 4 channels (Octamed, Protracker, ...) and multi channels trackers (OctamedSoundStudio, DigiboosterPro, HivelyTracker, ...) what are sequencer programs. They usually use samples (recorded instruments, sounds, voices, ...) you can load and arrange.
daxb is offline  
Old 01 September 2017, 17:50   #4
Akira
Registered User

Akira's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: New York
Posts: 19,265
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinphaltimus View Post
[ Show youtube player ]
Oh look is that dude who goes mental about NTSC :P

HEre's a tutorial for Protracker:
[ Show youtube player ]
Akira is offline  
Old 01 September 2017, 17:59   #5
Retro1234
Bo Bo

Retro1234's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: 5150
Posts: 3,988
Thanks for your Replys - please keep them coming....

I think for now I might try Tracker but im still interested in MIDI so have a few more questions

What midi keyboards are compatible? only older ones, from the 80- 90s?

I think I read somewhere about serial port emulation on WinUae - so anyone know if you can do this under WinUae

Last edited by Retro1234; 01 September 2017 at 18:06.
Retro1234 is offline  
Old 01 September 2017, 18:12   #6
Akira
Registered User

Akira's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: New York
Posts: 19,265
Quote:
Originally Posted by Retro1234 View Post
What midi keyboards are compatible? only older ones, from the 80- 90s?
MIDI is a standard and all are compatible. It just depends what you want to do. B ut you can use anything from 1979 to today.
Octamed is a tracker that supports MIDI as well as the Amiga internal sounds so you can do both.

As for using WinUAE, if you have a USB to MIDI device you can use it as a MIDI interface for the virtual Amiga. Look at the I/O PORTS options, tehre's a section for MIDI.
You cannot connect an Amiga serial MIDI interface to a PC!

I tried this and it works but USB--MIDI interfaces are shit and laggy, you will notice a big latency. I would not recommend doing this at all, it's just shit and it's not WinUAE's fault. You cannot compare the tight no lag performance of a true serial MIDI interface to the shitty USB conversion shit going on. Even if you used a PC DAW, latency is much higher in MIDI than on a true serial interface.
Akira is offline  
Old 01 September 2017, 19:56   #7
Retro1234
Bo Bo

Retro1234's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: 5150
Posts: 3,988
Quote:
Originally Posted by Akira View Post
MIDI is a standard and all are compatible. It just depends what you want to do. B ut you can use anything from 1979 to today.
Octamed is a tracker that supports MIDI as well as the Amiga internal sounds so you can do both.

As for using WinUAE, if you have a USB to MIDI device you can use it as a MIDI interface for the virtual Amiga. Look at the I/O PORTS options, tehre's a section for MIDI.
You cannot connect an Amiga serial MIDI interface to a PC!

I tried this and it works but USB--MIDI interfaces are shit and laggy, you will notice a big latency. I would not recommend doing this at all, it's just shit and it's not WinUAE's fault. You cannot compare the tight no lag performance of a true serial MIDI interface to the shitty USB conversion shit going on. Even if you used a PC DAW, latency is much higher in MIDI than on a true serial interface.
This is some great info
So I should be able to use any of these keyboards ( https://www.amazon.co.uk/s/?ie=UTF8&...sl_o96xn1vn9_e) with WinUae?

Can you recommend a keyboard?
Retro1234 is offline  
Old 01 September 2017, 20:41   #8
Akira
Registered User

Akira's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: New York
Posts: 19,265
Quote:
Originally Posted by Retro1234 View Post
This is some great info
So I should be able to use any of these keyboards ( https://www.amazon.co.uk/s/?ie=UTF8&...sl_o96xn1vn9_e) with WinUae?

Can you recommend a keyboard?
Yes, you can use any of those with WinUAE, but as for your second question, from what I said before, I cannot recommend any of them to use with WinUAE, as this is laggy, latency is way high (ie the time fthat passes from you pressing a key and the computer reacting to that command, is noticeable).

As a general recommendation, I'd need to know what you want to do with it and also what kind of level of dexterity you have with keyboards. Some people just want a tiny one for messing about, others like me need a full size keyboard with at least 88 keys.

If you are just faffing about maybe start with a tiny one like the MPK Mini from Akai, and there's an Alesis one for 48 quid which can't be that bad.
But have in mind that if you want to use it as INPUT for your tracker, your tracker will probably ONLY recognize MIDI notes. The controllers, knobs, pitch bend, etc, will be ignored. Trackers do not take Control Change input and map it to effects or anything (that would be a neat feature, though). So, it is very, very basic, but if you want to input notes with real keyboard keys instead of a computer keyboard, this is a good option.

By the way, none of these have a sound engine inside, they are just controllers, so if you wanna get a keyboard that you control from the Amiga to make music with it, you need a proper synthesizer. But then you need to use exclusively OctaMED or a more hefty MIDI package like Music-X, Bars & Pipes or other.
Akira is offline  
Old 01 September 2017, 23:32   #9
Retro1234
Bo Bo

Retro1234's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: 5150
Posts: 3,988
You definitely cant hook Amiga serial MIDI interface to serial > USB? Why maybe this is less laggy.

The "laggy" is putting me off but im not really setup for real Amiga at the moment.

Your information is really helpful - Im only just messing about so just a cheap keyboard to mess about with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Akira View Post
Yes, you can use any of those with WinUAE, but as for your second question, from what I said before, I cannot recommend any of them to use with WinUAE, as this is laggy, latency is way high (ie the time fthat passes from you pressing a key and the computer reacting to that command, is noticeable).

As a general recommendation, I'd need to know what you want to do with it and also what kind of level of dexterity you have with keyboards. Some people just want a tiny one for messing about, others like me need a full size keyboard with at least 88 keys.

If you are just faffing about maybe start with a tiny one like the MPK Mini from Akai, and there's an Alesis one for 48 quid which can't be that bad.
But have in mind that if you want to use it as INPUT for your tracker, your tracker will probably ONLY recognize MIDI notes. The controllers, knobs, pitch bend, etc, will be ignored. Trackers do not take Control Change input and map it to effects or anything (that would be a neat feature, though). So, it is very, very basic, but if you want to input notes with real keyboard keys instead of a computer keyboard, this is a good option.

By the way, none of these have a sound engine inside, they are just controllers, so if you wanna get a keyboard that you control from the Amiga to make music with it, you need a proper synthesizer. But then you need to use exclusively OctaMED or a more hefty MIDI package like Music-X, Bars & Pipes or other.
Retro1234 is offline  
Old 03 September 2017, 20:31   #10
Retro1234
Bo Bo

Retro1234's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: 5150
Posts: 3,988
Quote:
Originally Posted by Akira View Post
By the way, none of these have a sound engine inside, they are just controllers, so if you wanna get a keyboard that you control from the Amiga to make music with it, you need a proper synthesizer. But then you need to use exclusively OctaMED or a more hefty MIDI package like Music-X, Bars & Pipes or other.
Could you explain this a bit more?

and can I have some links to your work.
Retro1234 is offline  
Old 04 September 2017, 00:03   #11
emufan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: #DrainTheSwamp
Posts: 4,546
Quote:
Originally Posted by Retro1234 View Post
I think I read somewhere about serial port emulation on WinUae - so anyone know if you can do this under WinUae
I can recommend VirtualMidiSynth - use the older 1.17.1 version,
the 2.x version just phones home every here and then, 1.17.1 works very good, 32 and 64 bit.

next you need a good soundfont: OmegaGMGS2 my fav.
add this one to VirtualMidiSynth.

in winuae you set i/o port midi out to VirtualMidiSynth, thats it.

to get some pseudo midi in ( without a keyboard) you can use Midi Yoke 1.75,
does work very well on win7. since it is32 bit only - you have to use winuae 32 bit version.

with Yoke installed, you can play a midi file, and set the output to Midi Yoke port1 in the midi-player,
in winuae you set midi in to Yoke port1.
you can now record the midi file with any midi capable software on your emulated amiga

some software you may try:
Music-X
Master Tracks Pro
Intelligent.Music-M ( cool tool, but not a standard sequencer )
Steinberg Pro 24
DeluxeMusic 2.0 ( i have no clue how to setup mid in/out, but should work somehow)
Dr.T's Midi Recording Studio
Dr.T's KCS Level II

Last edited by emufan; 04 September 2017 at 01:28.
emufan is offline  
Old 04 September 2017, 19:16   #12
Akira
Registered User

Akira's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: New York
Posts: 19,265
Quote:
Originally Posted by Retro1234 View Post
You definitely cant hook Amiga serial MIDI interface to serial > USB? Why maybe this is less laggy.
Amiga serial and PC serial are not the same. You could use a PC serial MIDI interface, but finding drivers for it might be a problem. Still, you are using it all through emulation, so there might be latency.

Also all the links you sent, or most, are controllers that only send MIDI through USB. they are not real MIDI, they have no MIDI ports, so even if you were to hook a real MIDI interface to your PC somehow, these controllers would not be able to connect to it. You need a controller that actually has MIDI ports (they are becoming harder and harder to find as people favor computer setups and USB over MIDI more and more).

Also how would it be less laggy? You would still have USB to serial. The problem is USB, not serial or MIDI.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Retro1234 View Post
Could you explain this a bit more?
The links you showed me are of controllers. they don t make noise. They are just that, controllers. Whatever you control with them is what makes sound.

As I said I don't know what you wan to do with this but it seems to me that MIDI, especially if using emulation, is not a good route.

Quote:
Originally Posted by emufan View Post
software stuff
Everything you recommend would only make the system less responsive. Every piece of software will have a lag coming from sending messages back and forth through the system. Also I don't think the OP is interested in making music with a MIDI device.

I guess most people used to make music on modern software are used to lag and work around it, but if you ever used a real MIDI rig, latency is something you cannot accept again.


As I said Retro1234,I don't understand your reasoning to want to do this, but if you are new to music making I Would not recommend to mess with any of this, all it will do is put you off. Especially because you are dealing with a very non-optimal setup. fIf you were trying to do this with a real Amiga I would understand a bit more. as is, not worth the hassle IMO.
Akira is offline  
Old 07 September 2017, 02:09   #13
Retro1234
Bo Bo

Retro1234's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: 5150
Posts: 3,988
thanks both for more info - I might start with emufan suggestions, its just always been on my list of things I've wanted to do - make some chip tune or Drum and Bass - just make some music with the Amiga

I could probably hook my A600 or 1200......

I've heard theres some cool software for the Atari as well

Id be interested if there were any guides from back in the day - Books or articles in magazines......

Last edited by Retro1234; 07 September 2017 at 02:14.
Retro1234 is offline  
Old 07 September 2017, 16:49   #14
Akira
Registered User

Akira's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: New York
Posts: 19,265
You don't need any of what emufan said to start, it will just complicate your setup and make it less responsive. Why do you want to sequence a general MIDI instrument anyway? None of those sounds you will find in actual drum & bass or "chiptune" . Also most of the MIDI sequencers for Amiga I find rather cryptic to begin with. And the more you have to deal with, the more complicated it gets, and in my opinion, worse.

Start with Protracker or Octamed. That's what we all did. Use samples. There's SHIT TONS of samples out there ready for you to use. Grab them from your favorite mods. Analyze how your favorite mods are made. Use just the 4 channels the Amiga has to offer, the restrictions will prove educational in the long run. 16 channels of MIDI and 128+ instruments of a GM will be overwhelming at first (and sound poopy)
Akira is offline  
Old 07 September 2017, 19:27   #15
Retro1234
Bo Bo

Retro1234's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: 5150
Posts: 3,988
Quote:
Originally Posted by Akira View Post

Start with Protracker or Octamed. That's what we all did. Use samples. There's SHIT TONS of samples out there ready for you to use. Grab them from your favorite mods. Analyze how your favorite mods are made. Use just the 4 channels the Amiga has to offer, the restrictions will prove educational in the long run. 16 channels of MIDI and 128+ instruments of a GM will be overwhelming at first (and sound poopy)
Sounds like a good idea
Retro1234 is offline  
Old 01 October 2017, 12:26   #16
Retro1234
Bo Bo

Retro1234's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: 5150
Posts: 3,988
I saw Maddi/MsMadLemon has done soundtracker guide that looks good

[ Show youtube player ]
Retro1234 is offline  
Old 01 October 2017, 15:58   #17
MigaTech
Only Amiga !!

MigaTech's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 522
Sequencer One is also a great MIDI software package.
MigaTech is offline  
 


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Making IFF music sample PHIL1980 request.Other 4 28 November 2015 23:41
Amiga Music Remastered - Music Disk Masterseries cry request.Music 0 17 January 2015 01:17
Amiga and making music questions eldancer support.Hardware 9 05 December 2012 01:25
Clear Play It Loud Game Boy with modifications for music making Akira MarketPlace 0 21 September 2012 18:57
App for making music? Dreedo request.Apps 9 19 July 2011 09:07

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 05:21.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Page generated in 0.08657 seconds with 15 queries