WonderBoy in Monsterland

1time · 08 November 2010, 10:27

Hi.

Wonderboy is not working as it should. The game does not crash or anything but something is wrong.

It is running to slow and the sound effects are "crackling".

If i run the game with CACHE it is going to fast, the sound is still wrong.

I have tried this on the following setups.

A4000/040
A1200/060
A1200/040
A1200/030

And ofcourse i have a registerd WHDload version. Also tried with differant versions of WHDload.

Anyone that has any idea?

PS: Huge respect to the ppl still working with game/demo installations for Whdload.

jotd · 09 November 2010, 06:16

Probably a cpu-dependent loop that has been overlooked.

the best thing to do would be to file a bugreport so the team knows:

http://mantis.whdload.de/

@Codetapper: maybe I can help on the subject

Codetapper · 09 November 2010, 07:24

I would think the game would run too fast not too slow if that were the case! Crackling maybe an empty DBF loop yes.

Fabie · 09 November 2010, 08:38

I have this game running on my A1200/020/28mhz and works fine if cache is on
with cache off the game is really slow
the sound here is correct

btw,also you can build a floppy...and play it instead whdload

1time · 09 November 2010, 15:26

I have never tried it on a 020.

That is probably what is wrong.

The game runs to fast with cache on and to slow without the cache feature.

Hmmm floppy? Brrr.. sounds scarry. I like my games more when they are started with WHDload =)

So, any good coder that could fix this?

Codetapper · 09 November 2010, 20:59

I'm pretty sure the original is terribly slow too, tonnes of blitter waits were added to the game which would slow the WHDLoad version down a little to prevent it crashing/glitching.

Hungry Horace · 09 November 2010, 21:59

whilst on the topic - CodeTapper - is there any chance of an update of the WHDload slave to include 2 buttons support, high score save etc, or at least any chance of 'lending' the source so that others could look into adding such features?

Cheers!

jotd · 09 November 2010, 22:04

I try to add customx tooltypes to avoid blitterwaits on slow machines, or games with lots of blitwait fixes are too slow

Codetapper · 10 November 2010, 00:29

My right arm is in a cast at the moment, and I can barely one finger type with my sprained left hand after a stupid asian woman driver knocked me off my bike. All this plus a newborn baby! Coding anything will have to wait!

jotd · 10 November 2010, 05:24

argh. Congrats BTW. 2 newborns here, but hands fully functional (I tend to run over people with my car myself since the time I sold my bike)

Edit: please agree with me there's generally nothing wrong with asian women, except for the ones who can't drive.

1time · 10 November 2010, 08:02

If i start this game on my A500 from a slow floppy. The game works as it should.

So on the question if the game is equally slow in the original version the answer is no.

Im not here to complain, i love all the work you guys make with whdload installas, and i also understand that this could be a b....h to fix.

Just crossing my fingers that someone would find a nice solution to the problem.

jotd · 10 November 2010, 12:25

@1time: same problem (now solved) with James Pond install. I've added a switch to disable blitterwaits: works with good speed on slow machines (if you use the switch on a fast machine it crashes of course!)

_ThEcRoW · 10 November 2010, 14:48

I always play this classic by floppy on my a500!

1time · 10 November 2010, 15:45

Thanks for the tip jotd.

So really no solution for my A1200 then ;(

Minuous · 10 November 2010, 16:26

Just curious why blitter waits would cause a significant slowdown on slow machines. In such a case, isn't the blitting finished by the time the wait is done, which would result in not waiting at all? All I can think of is that there must a lot of overhead involved in checking the blit status.

StingRay · 10 November 2010, 17:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minuous

In such a case, isn't the blitting finished by the time the wait is done, which would result in not waiting at all?

Even if the blit is already finished and there is no need to wait you still have to take the extra instructions needed to wait for the blitter to finish into account. If it's a tight loop which runs in 1 frame on a 68000 machine with not many cycles left it is entirely possible that the patched version won't run in 1 frame anymore.

Codetapper · 10 November 2010, 22:23

Super Wonderboy on the otherhand looks so inefficiently coded (ST port no doubt) that it drops from about 3 to 4 frames making it look REALLY slow!

When my hand is out of the cast I will add a tooltype to disable the blitter waits as JOTD suggested.

Leffmann · 10 November 2010, 22:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minuous

Just curious why blitter waits would cause a significant slowdown on slow machines. In such a case, isn't the blitting finished by the time the wait is done, which would result in not waiting at all? All I can think of is that there must a lot of overhead involved in checking the blit status.

Quote:

Originally Posted by StingRay

Even if the blit is already finished and there is no need to wait you still have to take the extra instructions needed to wait for the blitter to finish into account. If it's a tight loop which runs in 1 frame on a 68000 machine with not many cycles left it is entirely possible that the patched version won't run in 1 frame anymore.

Most likely scenario is that the blitter priority bit is not set during blitter waits, and the CPU will then steal cycles from the blitter regularly just so it can do nothing but wait for the blitter to finish, and a blitter operation could potentially take 25% longer to complete.

StingRay · 10 November 2010, 22:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leffmann

Most likely scenario is that the blitter priority bit is not set during blitter waits, and the CPU will then steal cycles from the blitter regularly just so it can do nothing but wait for the blitter to finish, and a blitter operation could potentially take 25% longer to complete.

Even blitter nasty set will not change the fact that you have to add additional instructions to the code to make it run on higher CPU's. Try fixing Slayer's scrollers for 680x0 and you'll know what I mean! They won't run in one frame anymore. Remember that we're talking about patching code for higher CPU's here and not just "normal" blitter waits.

skateblind · 11 November 2010, 00:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hungry Horace

whilst on the topic - CodeTapper - is there any chance of an update of the WHDload slave to include 2 buttons support, high score save etc, or at least any chance of 'lending' the source so that others could look into adding such features?

Cheers!

Please release the source so others can extend upon your already magnificent work!

08 November 2010, 10:27	#1
1time Amiga Lover Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Stockholm / Sweden Age: 46 Posts: 612	WonderBoy in Monsterland Hi. Wonderboy is not working as it should. The game does not crash or anything but something is wrong. It is running to slow and the sound effects are "crackling". If i run the game with CACHE it is going to fast, the sound is still wrong. I have tried this on the following setups. A4000/040 A1200/060 A1200/040 A1200/030 And ofcourse i have a registerd WHDload version. Also tried with differant versions of WHDload. Anyone that has any idea? PS: Huge respect to the ppl still working with game/demo installations for Whdload.

09 November 2010, 15:26	#5
1time Amiga Lover Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Stockholm / Sweden Age: 46 Posts: 612	I have never tried it on a 020. That is probably what is wrong. The game runs to fast with cache on and to slow without the cache feature. Hmmm floppy? Brrr.. sounds scarry. I like my games more when they are started with WHDload =) So, any good coder that could fix this? Last edited by 1time; 09 November 2010 at 17:10.

10 November 2010, 05:24	#10
jotd This cat is no more Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: FRANCE Age: 52 Posts: 8,160	argh. Congrats BTW. 2 newborns here, but hands fully functional (I tend to run over people with my car myself since the time I sold my bike) Edit: please agree with me there's generally nothing wrong with asian women, except for the ones who can't drive. Last edited by jotd; 10 November 2010 at 12:23.

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09 November 2010, 06:16	#2
jotd This cat is no more Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: FRANCE Age: 52 Posts: 8,160	Probably a cpu-dependent loop that has been overlooked. the best thing to do would be to file a bugreport so the team knows: http://mantis.whdload.de/ @Codetapper: maybe I can help on the subject

09 November 2010, 07:24	#3
Codetapper 2 contact me: email only! Join Date: May 2001 Location: Auckland / New Zealand Posts: 3,182	I would think the game would run too fast not too slow if that were the case! Crackling maybe an empty DBF loop yes.

09 November 2010, 08:38	#4
Fabie Banned Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: France Posts: 478	I have this game running on my A1200/020/28mhz and works fine if cache is on with cache off the game is really slow the sound here is correct btw,also you can build a floppy...and play it instead whdload

09 November 2010, 20:59	#6
Codetapper 2 contact me: email only! Join Date: May 2001 Location: Auckland / New Zealand Posts: 3,182	I'm pretty sure the original is terribly slow too, tonnes of blitter waits were added to the game which would slow the WHDLoad version down a little to prevent it crashing/glitching.

09 November 2010, 21:59	#7
Hungry Horace Wipe-Out Enthusiast Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: . Age: 43 Posts: 2,538	whilst on the topic - CodeTapper - is there any chance of an update of the WHDload slave to include 2 buttons support, high score save etc, or at least any chance of 'lending' the source so that others could look into adding such features? Cheers!

09 November 2010, 22:04	#8
jotd This cat is no more Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: FRANCE Age: 52 Posts: 8,160	I try to add customx tooltypes to avoid blitterwaits on slow machines, or games with lots of blitwait fixes are too slow

10 November 2010, 00:29	#9
Codetapper 2 contact me: email only! Join Date: May 2001 Location: Auckland / New Zealand Posts: 3,182	My right arm is in a cast at the moment, and I can barely one finger type with my sprained left hand after a stupid asian woman driver knocked me off my bike. All this plus a newborn baby! Coding anything will have to wait!

10 November 2010, 08:02	#11
1time Amiga Lover Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Stockholm / Sweden Age: 46 Posts: 612	If i start this game on my A500 from a slow floppy. The game works as it should. So on the question if the game is equally slow in the original version the answer is no. Im not here to complain, i love all the work you guys make with whdload installas, and i also understand that this could be a b....h to fix. Just crossing my fingers that someone would find a nice solution to the problem.

10 November 2010, 12:25	#12
jotd This cat is no more Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: FRANCE Age: 52 Posts: 8,160	@1time: same problem (now solved) with James Pond install. I've added a switch to disable blitterwaits: works with good speed on slow machines (if you use the switch on a fast machine it crashes of course!)

10 November 2010, 14:48	#13
_ThEcRoW Amiga NetRunner Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Spain Age: 45 Posts: 941	I always play this classic by floppy on my a500!

10 November 2010, 15:45	#14
1time Amiga Lover Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Stockholm / Sweden Age: 46 Posts: 612	Thanks for the tip jotd. So really no solution for my A1200 then ;(

10 November 2010, 16:26	#15
Minuous Coder/webmaster/gamer Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Canberra/Australia Posts: 2,629	Just curious why blitter waits would cause a significant slowdown on slow machines. In such a case, isn't the blitting finished by the time the wait is done, which would result in not waiting at all? All I can think of is that there must a lot of overhead involved in checking the blit status.

10 November 2010, 22:23	#17
Codetapper 2 contact me: email only! Join Date: May 2001 Location: Auckland / New Zealand Posts: 3,182	Super Wonderboy on the otherhand looks so inefficiently coded (ST port no doubt) that it drops from about 3 to 4 frames making it look REALLY slow! When my hand is out of the cast I will add a tooltype to disable the blitter waits as JOTD suggested.

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