Sega controllers on A1200 ?

[asm1]

Hi

I got myself a Sega Megadrive Arcade Power Stick a while back. Plugging it in to the Joystick port of my A1200 causes the Amiga not to boot! The lights on the stick seem to come on and indicate "life" but as I say, the amiga won't boot lol.

Its the 3 button version. I thought these worked ok on miggies...

Anyone ?

Andrew

[yaqube]

Maybe this will help: http://eab.abime.net/showpost.php?p=562220&postcount=29.

[EreWeGo]

Not sure about the "Arcade Power Stick", but I've used the standard 3 and 6 button Sega gamepads without any issues, (only one button works though, the "B" button).

I did try the wire swap mod, and was able to use two fire buttons, but not with the WHDLoad games I tried, (Brutal Sports Football and Total Football), although it did work with two buttons if I booted those games from the floppy versions...

[killergorilla]

I've used an Arcade Power Stick with a CD32 and had no probs with it.

[seuden]

I used Mega Drive and Master System pads on my A500 in past with no probs. Are the sticks different then?

[Info-Seeker]

Hey Guys,

I too was frustrated with the lack of nice joysticks available for the Commodores and Amigas on ebay and what not. My All time favorite Joystick for the Commodore was the Slick Stick, a small very well built stick that was/is still quite popular with the Commodore fans. Every time one comes up on ebay they run the bid up to something rediculous for a 20+ year old joystick.

So I too had taken it upon myself to find some suitable replacements, and, just as you did, I found those to be the Sega Genesis pads and sticks.

I had mentioned it to some of the guys in the different channels I hang in on irc and a cat named Golan turned me on to the best info on the subject. it seems back in Issue 5 of Commodore World, the Christmas 1994 issue I believe, there is an article on page 45 about how to build a small little protection circuit in to a sega joystick or pad to proect the Commodore computers while using them.

I actually have that issue online in my little Commodore section because it took me so long to find the information myself I figured there had to be others interested in the same article. Here is a link to the full magazine...

http://www.digirock.net/commodore/Co...d_Issue_05.pdf

It basically uses a resistor inline to prevent the voltage from traveling through the sticks in to the joystick port on the Commodores. I actually modded a couple of Genesis Power Plugs with this mod, hoping I could get the added features of the power plug to work with the Commodores, and making them a nice adapter for the Commodore in the process, plus they have plenty of room inside to add the resistors making them perfect for a novice like me.

http://www.digirock.net/commodore/Ge...wer%20Plug.jpg

Well, that didn't work out so well, not sure if I wired them backwards or if the power plug needs the +5 volts from the Genesis to power its internal logic. 1 of these days I will start screwing with it again and possibly run a small dc power adapter to it to see if I can get it to do it's thing, but for now I just put them on the side.

The Joysticks seem to work just fine on the 128 without it, but I am told a problem can arise if you hit keys on the keyboard while using the joystick. Because of this, I will not recommend using the sticks directly without some type of protection circuit, but they do work.

I picked up 1 of these for 5 bucks and it works great...
http://www.digirock.net/commodore/Genesis_Pad.jpg

and a set of these for like 20 bucks for those arcade games...
http://www.digirock.net/commodore/Ge...ade_Sticks.jpg

All in all, I am pretty happy with them. Also, if you do not want to build anything yourself, there is a really cool cat out of Australia named Nick Coplin, the Author of 64HDD / Pro for the Commodore 8 bits. He makes some nice little parts called the 64JPX, a number of different joystick adapters for different types of console controllers allowing them all to be used on the 64/128 and Amigas.

I have purchased a number of things from him including his 64HDD Pro and can personally tell you he is a great guy, who really stands behind his stuff. He has also answered every question I have ever asked quite promptly. Nothing worse than sitting around with a new part you can not get working waiting on someone to answer your email...

Here is the link to the 64JPX adapters on Nick's Site...
http://www.64hdd.com/64jpx/64jpx.html

I will be picking up 4 of these in the near future, with 2 of the Mouse Pass throughs. Great little parts, and we have to protect the Commodores!

Hope this helps!

Info

[Ry34]

Sorry for digging up an old thread, just wanted to share my "Sega" controller experience.

I purchased these controllers (2 x 6 button Sega clones) from Amazon... https://www.amazon.com.au/gp/product/B00EAM862S
Plugged them into my A1200, fired up Chaos Engine and was only able to press fire or press a direction once then the power would cut out and no buttons would work.

Opened the casing and switched the cable/pins from pins 5 and 7 and tested again. Controller now works as it should!

Picked the pair of these up for AUD $13 delivered. Highly recommended.

[Hewitson]

Originally Posted by Ry34

Picked the pair of these up for AUD $13 delivered. Highly recommended.

Highly recommended? Even though they'll short out the computer unless modified?


Stick with the original Sega pads.

[Ry34]

Originally Posted by Hewitson

Highly recommended? Even though they'll short out the computer unless modified?

You're right, I wouldn't recommend them in their "factory state" but a simple mod and they're a good cheap solution.

[jotd]

no sega controller is able to get 6 buttons like CD32 ones though. The best you can do is 2 buttons.

[DanyPPC]

I remember there is a trick in ADoom or Doom Attack that permits to use all the buttons of the Sega Genesis 6 button pad.

[Daedalus]

Swapping pins 7 and 5 between the pad and the Amiga will enable the Amiga to read all buttons on any 3- or 6-button Megadrive pad without issues. However, the protocol is very different from that of the CD32 pad, so you won't get compatibility between them. Software has to explicitly support the Sega pads' extra buttons in order to use them in that way, otherwise it just functions as a 2-button controller.

[str0m]

These work well, used my wireless MD pad with one on my CD32 https://abload.de/image.php?img=amig...apter27i6g.jpg

[DanyPPC]

I own a Retro-Bit Sega MD Wireless Controller which I tested successfully on my A1200 wih RysMk2 adapter in CD32 mode.

[Retro-Nerd]

Originally Posted by DanyPPC

I own a Retro-Bit Sega MD Wireless Controller which I tested successfully on my A1200 wih RysMk2 adapter in CD32 mode.

Yep, there are different wireless combinations that work with the Rys MK2 adapter in CD32 mode.



1. Raphnet Genesis USB Adapter+8bitDo M30 pad (2.4GHz version). Also the wireless Joyzz pad from Krikzz is fine. But the automatically mapped buttons are a bit strange from the layout.


2. Retrobit Sega Saturn pad, also the 2.4GHz version, which comes with an USB dongle too. The automatically mapped buttons fit better here. Just like with their Genesis/MD pad i assume.


or the Amiga to Genesis adapter, directly connected to the Amiga port (from melbourneconsolerepros, which isn't available anymore as it seems.). It supports all kinds of Sega 6 button pads, original or clones

[jotd]

I'm a noob with a Sega Quickjoy SGFighter (and possibly another one) that I could spare. Can someone post picture on how to swap pins? is that easy?

Someone used an arduino! to do that: http://phobosys.de/blog_january_18.html looks clunky.

And after that if someone has software to detect/read sega joypads, I could support them in my installs.

[Bren McGuire]

This only happens with garbage knock-offs, original Sega controllers will not do this. Do not recommend things that are damaging to an Amiga!

Retrobit now make 1:1 Sega 6 button controllers for cheap, and those are very recommended.

You don't want to be cheap when treating your fragile vintage technology

Originally Posted by Ry34

Sorry for digging up an old thread, just wanted to share my "Sega" controller experience.

I purchased these controllers (2 x 6 button Sega clones) from Amazon... https://www.amazon.com.au/gp/product/B00EAM862S
Plugged them into my A1200, fired up Chaos Engine and was only able to press fire or press a direction once then the power would cut out and no buttons would work.

Opened the casing and switched the cable/pins from pins 5 and 7 and tested again. Controller now works as it should!

Picked the pair of these up for AUD $13 delivered. Highly recommended.

[dreadnought]

I think I might buy one of these adapters for Sega pads, do you think it'll add any lag to the equation?

[Daedalus]

Originally Posted by jotd

I'm a noob with a Sega Quickjoy SGFighter (and possibly another one) that I could spare. Can someone post picture on how to swap pins? is that easy?

Someone used an arduino! to do that: http://phobosys.de/blog_january_18.html looks clunky.

And after that if someone has software to detect/read sega joypads, I could support them in my installs.

There are two different approaches. One is to use some sort of intelligent controller, which reads the Sega pad 100% as a Megadrive would, and then translates that for Amiga use using the CD32 pad protocol. That way you get compatibility with existing software, and that's what the sophisticated adaptors do and probably what that Arduino-based adaptor does as well.

The second way is to swap over pins 5 and 7, which can be done non-destructively using two 9-pin D-sub connectors (male and female) and connecting all pins 1:1, except pins 5 and 7, which are crossed. This will make sure pads are powered correctly, so even power-hungry devices like wireless adaptors and controllers with lots of extra functions will work. But they will only work in 2-button mode in this configuration unless software is written specifically to read them.

Reading Megadrive pads is very easy really, especially 3-button pads, so that should be simple to add to an install if you felt like it. Basically, pin 5 controls which buttons are read. By default, pin 5 is high, which puts the CD32 pad in 2-button compatibility mode, and makes the MD pad transmit up, down, left, right as normal, button B as fire 1 (pin 6) and button C as fire 2 (pin 9). If you set pin 5 low, the MD pad instead transmits up and down as normal, but left and right as both pressed together (which is how you detect the pad being present), button A as fire 1 (pin 6) and Start as fire 2 (pin 9).

6 button pads are a little more involved to read: you need to set pin 5 high to read the first set of buttons, then low to read the second as before. But you need to do that within 1.5ms, otherwise it assumes 3-button pad behaviour. If you do that, then do it again twice (so 3 full cycles), it puts the pad in 6-button mode, and the 4th cycle will read B and C as normal for pin 5 high, but up, down, left and right will instead report Z, Y, X and Mode buttons respectively. The pin 5 down of the 4th cycle reads Start and A as normal, and then the controller resets, ready to start the process again. The key thing is to make sure you change pin 5 quicker than every 1.5ms, or the controller resets and you need to start again.

[jotd]

This is very interesting. I wonder if don't have those connectors stored somewhere. Any schematics to locate the pins?

And the read process seems complex but if sega joypads can be detected, it means that we can seamlessly adapt the joypad reading code for that case. That would be cool. But I'm not going to write that code myself. Plus I have a real A1200 but now all dev tools are on WinUAE. So it will be not that easy to build & test stuff.