Would a Super Denise (8373 R4 390433-02) work in my A500?

appiah4 · 22 May 2015, 14:45

I came across someone selling a Super Denise chip for real cheap. I have an A500 with a 1MB ECS Agnus; I was wondering if I should grab the chip in question. Would replacing with my Denise give me any benefits? Would it even work?

Fingerlickin_B · 22 May 2015, 17:22

Hi,

You actually need this for ECS screenmodes to work, so yes, it will be of benefit

PZ.

Toni Wilen · 22 May 2015, 19:57

It works but I don't see any benefit with ECS screenshots on unexpanded A500, they require too much chip ram bandwidth to be usable without faster cpu and fast ram. (=A3000)

btw, some demos show only blank screen with ECS Denise. ECS Denise fixes OCS Denise bug that some programs accidentally required.

Fingerlickin_B · 23 May 2015, 11:05

Interesting points Toni.

Thread hijack time!

Obviously ECS is beneficial on my "faster-than-stock-A3000" A2000 with '030, extra RAM, etc, which I regularly use for internet browsing.

However, I have an A500 with nothing more than an '010 & 512kb fast board (hacked to be switchable to make 1mb Chip).

The A500 mentioned above is used for nothing else but playing .adf file games with a Gotek.

Would I be correct in assuming that you are saying there would be no benefit in the scenario from having ECS chipset fitted? As in, all non-AGA games will still load if I revert to OCS chipset?

PZ.

Toni Wilen · 23 May 2015, 13:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fingerlickin_B

Would I be correct in assuming that you are saying there would be no benefit in the scenario from having ECS chipset fitted? As in, all non-AGA games will still load if I revert to OCS chipset?

I am quite sure no A500 game or demo use any of new ECS Denise features.

You already have reduced compatibility due to 68010 so adding ECS Denise does not make it much worse

(or better)

- 68010 reduces compatibility more than any OCS/ECS option.
- Few games and demos are OCS Agnus or ECS Agnus only. (corrupted graphics). This is not related to 1M/0.5+0.5M memory selection.
- Very few demos (possibly games too) have blank screen if ECS Denise.

Note that A500 with ECS Agnus (8372A) can be called simply as ECS A500, even if it does not have ECS Denise. A500 + ECS Denise was extremely rare combination. A500 + ECS Agnus was quite common because it was factory config in later A500 revisions.

Fingerlickin_B · 23 May 2015, 13:54

So I should ditch the 68010 & replace it with 68000?

Done!

PZ.

Toni Wilen · 23 May 2015, 13:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fingerlickin_B

So I should ditch the 68010 & replace it with 68000?

Only when/if some program fails to work

Leffmann · 23 May 2015, 18:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

It works but I don't see any benefit with ECS screenshots on unexpanded A500, they require too much chip ram bandwidth to be usable without faster cpu and fast ram. (=A3000)

btw, some demos show only blank screen with ECS Denise. ECS Denise fixes OCS Denise bug that some programs accidentally required.

What bug is this?

Toni Wilen · 23 May 2015, 18:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leffmann

What bug is this?

Quick and too simple explanation: horizontal diwstrt values 0 and 1 will open horizontal display window if OCS Denise. ECS does not, value needs to be at least 2.

Full explanation:

http://eab.abime.net/showpost.php?p=627835&postcount=65
http://eab.abime.net/showpost.php?p=628336&postcount=66

Fingerlickin_B · 23 May 2015, 19:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

Only when/if some program fails to work

Chase H.Q. wouldn't load past intro screen before with '010 installed & machine would lock up...'000 back in place & it now loads

Thanks Toni

PZ.

appiah4 · 14 February 2017, 10:55

Revisiting this old thread; Now that I own an ACA500Plus and can run an 68EC000 at 42MHz, should I replace my Denise with a Super Denise

Jope · 14 February 2017, 11:56

Probably not, but feel free if you can find one cheap. :-)

The ECS Amiga really likes 15kHz horizontal refresh. Above that, the performance is just disappointing.

appiah4 · 14 February 2017, 15:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jope

Probably not, but feel free if you can find one cheap. :-)

The ECS Amiga really likes 15kHz horizontal refresh. Above that, the performance is just disappointing.

Yeah I'm kind of keeping eyes open for a good bargain grab but they don't seem to be very common, interestingly. One would think battery damaged A500+ boards taken apart and sold for spares would be a thing..

idrougge · 15 February 2017, 01:10

What would you use it for? Using Productivity or Superhighres screenmodes?

appiah4 · 15 February 2017, 10:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by idrougge

What would you use it for? Using Productivity or Superhighres screenmodes?

The only valid reason I have is using high res modes for wordprocessing.

idrougge · 15 February 2017, 11:43

You do know that you need a VGA/multisync screen for Productivity?

appiah4 · 15 February 2017, 12:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by idrougge

You do know that you need a VGA/multisync screen for Productivity?

Yeah, that's the next logical step

zipper · 15 February 2017, 14:37

I did some time use Productivity as the 60 Hz refresh was so easy to eyes compared to 50 Hz flicker - 4 col WB was pretty ugly yet.

22 May 2015, 14:45	#1
appiah4 Registered User Join Date: May 2015 Location: Somewhere in Time Posts: 439	Would a Super Denise (8373 R4 390433-02) work in my A500? I came across someone selling a Super Denise chip for real cheap. I have an A500 with a 1MB ECS Agnus; I was wondering if I should grab the chip in question. Would replacing with my Denise give me any benefits? Would it even work?

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Wanted : Super HiRes Denise 8373	Matt020	MarketPlace	0	23 February 2010 05:57
WTD: ECS Super Denise	alexh	MarketPlace	6	03 October 2009 23:01
Super Denise Upgrade / CDTV	Canyon Matt	support.Hardware	2	06 December 2008 14:55
Wanted: ECS Denise (8373)	mark_k	MarketPlace	1	21 November 2007 05:48
Super Denise (ECS) wanted!	Antiriad	MarketPlace	4	18 September 2003 12:15

22 May 2015, 17:22	#2
Fingerlickin_B Amiga Nut Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Belco, Australia Posts: 2,239	Hi, You actually need this for ECS screenmodes to work, so yes, it will be of benefit PZ.

22 May 2015, 19:57	#3
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 45 Posts: 24,626	It works but I don't see any benefit with ECS screenshots on unexpanded A500, they require too much chip ram bandwidth to be usable without faster cpu and fast ram. (=A3000) btw, some demos show only blank screen with ECS Denise. ECS Denise fixes OCS Denise bug that some programs accidentally required.

23 May 2015, 11:05	#4
Fingerlickin_B Amiga Nut Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Belco, Australia Posts: 2,239	Interesting points Toni. Thread hijack time! Obviously ECS is beneficial on my "faster-than-stock-A3000" A2000 with '030, extra RAM, etc, which I regularly use for internet browsing. However, I have an A500 with nothing more than an '010 & 512kb fast board (hacked to be switchable to make 1mb Chip). The A500 mentioned above is used for nothing else but playing .adf file games with a Gotek. Would I be correct in assuming that you are saying there would be no benefit in the scenario from having ECS chipset fitted? As in, all non-AGA games will still load if I revert to OCS chipset? PZ.

23 May 2015, 13:54	#6
Fingerlickin_B Amiga Nut Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Belco, Australia Posts: 2,239	So I should ditch the 68010 & replace it with 68000? Done! PZ.

14 February 2017, 10:55	#11
appiah4 Registered User Join Date: May 2015 Location: Somewhere in Time Posts: 439	Revisiting this old thread; Now that I own an ACA500Plus and can run an 68EC000 at 42MHz, should I replace my Denise with a Super Denise

14 February 2017, 11:56	#12
Jope - Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Helsinki / Finland Age: 40 Posts: 8,298	Probably not, but feel free if you can find one cheap. :-) The ECS Amiga really likes 15kHz horizontal refresh. Above that, the performance is just disappointing.

15 February 2017, 01:10	#14
idrougge Registered User Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Stockholm Posts: 4,003	What would you use it for? Using Productivity or Superhighres screenmodes?

15 February 2017, 11:43	#16
idrougge Registered User Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Stockholm Posts: 4,003	You do know that you need a VGA/multisync screen for Productivity?

15 February 2017, 14:37	#18
zipper Registered User Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: finland Posts: 1,644	I did some time use Productivity as the 60 Hz refresh was so easy to eyes compared to 50 Hz flicker - 4 col WB was pretty ugly yet.

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)