Help on Graphic Cards

Fenrir · 29 August 2005, 17:26

Ok, as I have said many times, I'm a really old amiga user but a relatively new "complex" amiga user (aka - amigas >500)
I own an amiga 4000 since 2001, and I recently bought a decent monitor to start using it but heck, OS 3.9 it's quite different from my old workbench 3.1, so I have to learn how to use it from the scratch or so

Here's my problem. My A4000 has a really basic configuration (A3640 040, Oktagon SCSI controller with a puny 1GB HD, CDRom, 2mb chip, 16 fast) and I would really like to add a decent graphic card before mangling with the OS trying stuff. As for now, my OS displays 16 colours and looks crappy, unlike the astounding screenshots I've seen around the net and in these boards.
I've found some graphic cards on E-Bay, mainly Cybervision 3D Zorro II/III, and I've noticed that it's the most common card used by experienced amiga users in here.
Have you got some hints for me?
I've seen this auction, this one and this one.
Are they the graphic cards I'm looking for? To improve resolution, display more colours and make things a bit sleek. If you've got a different card to suggest, I'm all ears.
This is just the beginning of many questions. IF you have a good site explaining Amiga Hardware it's good too. I've got three huge manuals but they're in german and it's really hard to understand.

Thanks in advance.

thomas · 29 August 2005, 17:59

Please note that there is a CyberVision 64 and a CyberVision 64 3D, these are completely different.

I think a CyberVision 64 3D or a Picasso IV are the models to choose. For more information see here: http://www.amiga-hardware.com/showcat.cgi?CATID=16

You should look for a card which passes the Amiga video output through the gfx card output. Otherwise you won't be able to use programs which only run on the Amiga native graphics modes. Unless you have two monitors, one for the Amiga output and one for the gfx card.

AMIGAZ · 29 August 2005, 18:07

The Cybervision 64 not the 3D model would be best for him since it has pass thru for the AGA screenmodes.
The CV64 can be found for quite reasonable prices which is not the case with Picasso IV which cost as much as his whole A4000 system

Fenrir · 29 August 2005, 18:10

From the site you linked, it seems like the Cybervision 3D is a slightly better card, although it has the display problems you mentioned. There are no picasso cards available on E-bay at the moment, so it looks like this card is the best choice, since it shouldn't be a 3D and it has 4 mb which is nice.
It's only one day left, so if this is a good card I'm ready to bid. I'm a bit suspicious about the low price, but it should inflate a bit by tomorrow I'm afraid

Is this one the good one?

AMIGAZ · 29 August 2005, 18:26

Since I have one in my A4000D and it works very well even with games that require an RTG card.
I also have a scandoubler in my video slot in my A4000 which is connected to my CV64 so I can play whdload games also thru the gfx card

Fenrir · 29 August 2005, 18:31

For games I've got my old faithful A500 and an A1200 - that is not my main focus.
I'd like a card capable of displaying a sufficient amount of colours (at least SVGA-TrueColour) and a decent resolution (min. 800x600, but even 1024x768) without slowing down to a crisp. Creating a decent and fast environment to run applications and test stuff on the OS - even surfing on the internet and bringing up a remote server is what I look for.
Even because almost no game work on my A4000 for some reasons :P

So, if this is the right card, I'm going to bid on that one linked above.

kriz · 29 August 2005, 18:39

yes a cybervision64 is nice, I use one on my a4000 aswell (I also have an external scandoubler, its really good as its auto passes it through the scandoubler if I use some aga stuff....)

recomended!

AMIGAZ · 29 August 2005, 20:13

Well, this is what my CV64 shows on my monitor here on my A4000D...a bit of OS4 look

http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/3808/grab11vy.png

kriz · 29 August 2005, 20:52

nice! What at cpu do you use, and is it powericons you are using? How is the speed for you?

AMIGAZ · 29 August 2005, 21:16

I´m using a Cyberstorm MKII ´060@50mhz.
Yes and powericons, don´t know what I would have done without them.
Going from glowicons to powericons doesn´t slow things down at all

Now I´m waiting for Ibrowse 2.4 so I can view all webpages on my Amiga´s or OS4 so I can use the PPC version of Aweb.
Forgot to add that I´m runnina a 800x600 24bit screenmode, don´t want to go any higher since then only 16bit screenmodes will work.

Fenrir · 29 August 2005, 21:38

That's very good looking. You know... that's the kind of look I like. It's good, and rough enough to keep that amiga feeling I like. Actually I don't like an amiga to be too polished and have a pc-look.
Nonetheless, I didn't know what powericons were, so I made a research over the internet and now I know. I found a screenshot

http://www.amiga.org/modules/myalbum/photos/2177.jpg

that was quite striking. Even though I wouldn't achieve such an incredibly polished look, I'd really like to know what kind of graphic card can give an amiga such a resolution with such colour depth and definition. Any idea?

kriz · 29 August 2005, 21:39

ahh I have to install powericons aswell then! Nice

Ibrowse 2.4 mmmm

Long time waiting for it, hehe crazy..

kriz · 29 August 2005, 21:42

Fenrir: You need a fast cpu and powericons (wich enables you to use 32bit icons)..

But this looks to me like os4 ?

AMIGAZ · 29 August 2005, 21:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fenrir

That's very good looking. You know... that's the kind of look I like. It's good, and rough enough to keep that amiga feeling I like. Actually I don't like an amiga to be too polished and have a pc-look.
Nonetheless, I didn't know what powericons were, so I made a research over the internet and now I know. I found a screenshot

http://www.amiga.org/modules/myalbum/photos/2177.jpg

that was quite striking. Even though I wouldn't achieve such an incredibly polished look, I'd really like to know what kind of graphic card can give an amiga such a resolution with such colour depth and definition. Any idea?

That could be a Picasso IV, BVision PPC, Cybervision PPC or a Voodoo 3-5 gfx card.
The old cards like Piccolo, Cybervision 64 can't handle very high resolutions at high refresh rates, think it's because their pixel clocks are rated very low.
Imho 800x600 24bit is enough for some web browsing and such, you can go up to 1024x768 16bit with the card I'm using and 24 bit vs 16 isn't so noticeable.

AMIGAZ · 29 August 2005, 21:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by kriz

Fenrir: You need a fast cpu and powericons (wich enables you to use 32bit icons)..

But this looks to me like os4 ?

The demo of IB 2.4 was showed at AmiGbg, hope they get their thumbs out of their buttholes and release it now

AMIGAZ · 29 August 2005, 21:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by kriz

ahh I have to install powericons aswell then! Nice

Ibrowse 2.4 mmmm

Long time waiting for it, hehe crazy..

PowerIcons are almost to easy to install, just copy the program to C: and add a line to your startup-sequence and then d/l the png icons you want and rename them to .info instead of .png
And in OS3.9 you just click information on the icon you want to change and drag the desired icon on top of the icon in the information window and click save.

Fenrir · 29 August 2005, 22:07

Now I've got a curiosity: are these graphic cards still on steady production? Or are they all leftovers and used, and their production has been shut years ago? And if they're still produced, where can they be bought first hand? A website maybe, or just second hand retailers...? I've browsed through google with no luck.
Last time I've seen a shop selling amiga stuff was in Oslo like 10 years ago.

AMIGAZ · 29 August 2005, 22:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fenrir

Now I've got a curiosity: are these graphic cards still on steady production? Or are they all leftovers and used, and their production has been shut years ago? And if they're still produced, where can they be bought first hand? A website maybe, or just second hand retailers...? I've browsed through google with no luck.
Last time I've seen a shop selling amiga stuff was in Oslo like 10 years ago.

They're not made anymore, best place to find one is on Ebay.de

Fenrir · 29 August 2005, 23:18

This means that we're trading the same old hardware from user to user until every single piece will wear out

damn it's like a countdown to exctintion.
Well, I guess this is sorted out for today.
Thanks a lot for your help people

fryguy · 29 August 2005, 23:20

Amigaz: I think they said that IB 2.4 should be out before christmas, which probably means 23rd of december

29 August 2005, 17:26	#1
Fenrir Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Tromsø, Norway Age: 47 Posts: 66	Help on Graphic Cards Ok, as I have said many times, I'm a really old amiga user but a relatively new "complex" amiga user (aka - amigas >500) I own an amiga 4000 since 2001, and I recently bought a decent monitor to start using it but heck, OS 3.9 it's quite different from my old workbench 3.1, so I have to learn how to use it from the scratch or so Here's my problem. My A4000 has a really basic configuration (A3640 040, Oktagon SCSI controller with a puny 1GB HD, CDRom, 2mb chip, 16 fast) and I would really like to add a decent graphic card before mangling with the OS trying stuff. As for now, my OS displays 16 colours and looks crappy, unlike the astounding screenshots I've seen around the net and in these boards. I've found some graphic cards on E-Bay, mainly Cybervision 3D Zorro II/III, and I've noticed that it's the most common card used by experienced amiga users in here. Have you got some hints for me? I've seen this auction, this one and this one. Are they the graphic cards I'm looking for? To improve resolution, display more colours and make things a bit sleek. If you've got a different card to suggest, I'm all ears. This is just the beginning of many questions. IF you have a good site explaining Amiga Hardware it's good too. I've got three huge manuals but they're in german and it's really hard to understand. Thanks in advance. Last edited by Fenrir; 29 August 2005 at 17:32.

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29 August 2005, 17:59	#2
thomas Registered User Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 6,985	Please note that there is a CyberVision 64 and a CyberVision 64 3D, these are completely different. I think a CyberVision 64 3D or a Picasso IV are the models to choose. For more information see here: http://www.amiga-hardware.com/showcat.cgi?CATID=16 You should look for a card which passes the Amiga video output through the gfx card output. Otherwise you won't be able to use programs which only run on the Amiga native graphics modes. Unless you have two monitors, one for the Amiga output and one for the gfx card.

29 August 2005, 18:07	#3
AMIGAZ Amiga-Mad Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Sweden Age: 46 Posts: 1,286	The Cybervision 64 not the 3D model would be best for him since it has pass thru for the AGA screenmodes. The CV64 can be found for quite reasonable prices which is not the case with Picasso IV which cost as much as his whole A4000 system

29 August 2005, 18:10	#4
Fenrir Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Tromsø, Norway Age: 47 Posts: 66	From the site you linked, it seems like the Cybervision 3D is a slightly better card, although it has the display problems you mentioned. There are no picasso cards available on E-bay at the moment, so it looks like this card is the best choice, since it shouldn't be a 3D and it has 4 mb which is nice. It's only one day left, so if this is a good card I'm ready to bid. I'm a bit suspicious about the low price, but it should inflate a bit by tomorrow I'm afraid Is this one the good one?

29 August 2005, 18:26	#5
AMIGAZ Amiga-Mad Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Sweden Age: 46 Posts: 1,286	Since I have one in my A4000D and it works very well even with games that require an RTG card. I also have a scandoubler in my video slot in my A4000 which is connected to my CV64 so I can play whdload games also thru the gfx card

29 August 2005, 18:31	#6
Fenrir Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Tromsø, Norway Age: 47 Posts: 66	For games I've got my old faithful A500 and an A1200 - that is not my main focus. I'd like a card capable of displaying a sufficient amount of colours (at least SVGA-TrueColour) and a decent resolution (min. 800x600, but even 1024x768) without slowing down to a crisp. Creating a decent and fast environment to run applications and test stuff on the OS - even surfing on the internet and bringing up a remote server is what I look for. Even because almost no game work on my A4000 for some reasons :P So, if this is the right card, I'm going to bid on that one linked above.

29 August 2005, 18:39	#7
kriz Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: No(R)Way Age: 41 Posts: 3,185	yes a cybervision64 is nice, I use one on my a4000 aswell (I also have an external scandoubler, its really good as its auto passes it through the scandoubler if I use some aga stuff....) recomended!

29 August 2005, 20:13	#8
AMIGAZ Amiga-Mad Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Sweden Age: 46 Posts: 1,286	Well, this is what my CV64 shows on my monitor here on my A4000D...a bit of OS4 look http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/3808/grab11vy.png

29 August 2005, 20:52	#9
kriz Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: No(R)Way Age: 41 Posts: 3,185	nice! What at cpu do you use, and is it powericons you are using? How is the speed for you?

29 August 2005, 21:16	#10
AMIGAZ Amiga-Mad Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Sweden Age: 46 Posts: 1,286	I´m using a Cyberstorm MKII ´060@50mhz. Yes and powericons, don´t know what I would have done without them. Going from glowicons to powericons doesn´t slow things down at all Now I´m waiting for Ibrowse 2.4 so I can view all webpages on my Amiga´s or OS4 so I can use the PPC version of Aweb. Forgot to add that I´m runnina a 800x600 24bit screenmode, don´t want to go any higher since then only 16bit screenmodes will work.

29 August 2005, 21:38	#11
Fenrir Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Tromsø, Norway Age: 47 Posts: 66	That's very good looking. You know... that's the kind of look I like. It's good, and rough enough to keep that amiga feeling I like. Actually I don't like an amiga to be too polished and have a pc-look. Nonetheless, I didn't know what powericons were, so I made a research over the internet and now I know. I found a screenshot http://www.amiga.org/modules/myalbum/photos/2177.jpg that was quite striking. Even though I wouldn't achieve such an incredibly polished look, I'd really like to know what kind of graphic card can give an amiga such a resolution with such colour depth and definition. Any idea?

29 August 2005, 21:39	#12
kriz Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: No(R)Way Age: 41 Posts: 3,185	ahh I have to install powericons aswell then! Nice Ibrowse 2.4 mmmm Long time waiting for it, hehe crazy..

29 August 2005, 21:42	#13
kriz Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: No(R)Way Age: 41 Posts: 3,185	Fenrir: You need a fast cpu and powericons (wich enables you to use 32bit icons).. But this looks to me like os4 ?

29 August 2005, 22:07	#17
Fenrir Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Tromsø, Norway Age: 47 Posts: 66	Now I've got a curiosity: are these graphic cards still on steady production? Or are they all leftovers and used, and their production has been shut years ago? And if they're still produced, where can they be bought first hand? A website maybe, or just second hand retailers...? I've browsed through google with no luck. Last time I've seen a shop selling amiga stuff was in Oslo like 10 years ago.

29 August 2005, 23:18	#19
Fenrir Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Tromsø, Norway Age: 47 Posts: 66	This means that we're trading the same old hardware from user to user until every single piece will wear out damn it's like a countdown to exctintion. Well, I guess this is sorted out for today. Thanks a lot for your help people

29 August 2005, 23:20	#20
fryguy Registered User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Skarabörg, Sweden Age: 44 Posts: 1,019	Amigaz: I think they said that IB 2.4 should be out before christmas, which probably means 23rd of december

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