Scourge of the Underkind: Development thread

[Adrian Browne]

Will you have level codes to restart levels? I'd avoid making it old skool tough- many Amiga games are too diffifcult- no need to follow suit.

[CaptainNow]

Originally Posted by Adrian Browne

Will you have level codes to restart levels? I'd avoid making it old skool tough- many Amiga games are too diffifcult- no need to follow suit.

There will be level codes yes, and it won't be old school tough
In fact I anticipate it being rather easy to complete...not too easy though

[Trachu]

Originally Posted by LordNipple

Hi!

I answer this question in the FAQ

Well, Dont take it personally but the game lacks colour.
It looks like 16colour Atari st game.

The engine itself is very fast, all is working very smoothly, but the game needs more colour and less dithering.

I have noticed Magnus work for some time, but its too bad he keeps it for himself and hides from the world.
Amiga 500 scene needs badly people like him and his genious work.

[CaptainNow]

Originally Posted by Trachu

Well, Dont take it personally but the game lacks colour.
It looks like 16colour Atari st game.

The engine itself is very fast, all is working very smoothly, but the game needs more colour and less dithering.

I have noticed Magnus work for some time, but its too bad he keeps it for himself and hides from the world.
Amiga 500 scene needs badly people like him and his genious work.

It is a 16 colour game.
And I am very happy with the palette, I feel it is giving me the results I am after. I understand that it might not be to everyone's taste, but I guess that's life.

Magnus is indeed a genius, I am very lucky to be working with him on this project

[Adrian Browne]

Originally Posted by LordNipple

There will be level codes yes, and it won't be old school tough
In fact I anticipate it being rather easy to complete...not too easy though

Whew!!!

[Trachu]

Originally Posted by LordNipple

It is a 16 colour game.
And I am very happy with the palette, I feel it is giving me the results I am after. I understand that it might not be to everyone's taste, but I guess that's life.

Magnus is indeed a genius, I am very lucky to be working with him on this project

I am not talking about the palette you used, I am talking that 50% of the screen area is created using 2 colours dithered floor and 2/3 colour top of the walls.
This gives the feeling of overall poorness of graphic quality.

You can keep the palette if that is what you like, but use more than just 3 colours.

BTW. why you dont use 32colours?

[Graham Humphrey]

I think it looks tremendous and I don't think you'd necessarily notice it's 16 colours. Very detailed and well animated. It's a great use of a restricted palette I think. Sheer number of colours aren't everything.

[Adrian Browne]

I think 16 colours were chosen to keep the speed up in the game engine and game action etc. I'm sure lord nipple said as much before.

[CaptainNow]

Originally Posted by Trachu

I am not talking about the palette you used, I am talking that 50% of the screen area is created using 2 colours dithered floor and 2/3 colour top of the walls.
This gives the feeling of overall poorness of graphic quality.

You can keep the palette if that is what you like, but use more than just 3 colours.

BTW. why you dont use 32colours?

Haha! I don't really feel I have to justify my design choices to you, especially as you're being rather rude. For the sake of others who are reading this and who think the same I will clarify: 16 colours were chosen because if we were to work in 32 the frame rate would drop to 25 FPS, this is something Magnus wasn't prepared to do so I have been tasked with producing a 16 colour palette that gives nice results, so far I have had very positive feedback regarding those graphics (apart from yourself).

The palette is staying as it is, I don't have time to re-draw every sprite just to suit one user.
As for how I use my colours, it truly has nothing to do with you, no-one is forcing you to play this or to like it. I value all feedback of course, positive or negative.

[Lazycow]

Originally Posted by Trachu

This gives the feeling of overall poorness of graphic quality.

I want to disagree here, I like the graphics style very much. Ok, the diversity of colors is a bit restricted, but you usually have to do some compromises if you're only using 16 colors and in my eyes the result is top-notch!

[Predseda]

You should rename this topic Wayne, it is not easy to find.

[Gzegzolka]

I do not mind if You are using 16 colors or more. Your game look very professional and I wish You good luck with finishing it. Sure, there is a lot of stuff to do, to improve, to create levels and objects etc - level I have seen in video feels bit empty, with not much decorations and architecture design, just a maze, but it's enough to show game engine. But what You have just now is stunning - in my opinion Your project got same "feel" as Gods, Chaos Engine, Alien Bash2, Darkmare and Dragonstone. I just hope You will have both great ideas for levels with different setting and determination to create them.

How about using different palette for status bar?

Will there be picture of nice looking girl in shop section? And will she be nice animated like Colin from Xenon 2 shop?

Will there be more details on walls and floors like furniture, big objects, animated stuff?

Will there be wood/forest level?

[CaptainNow]

Renamed

The level you see in the videos is simply placeholder, to test things in. The actual levels will look vastly better than this, maybe we should've waited to show off what we were doing but we're just so excited about it and wanted to share that excitement.

There will be other settings, yes. Forest no.
I spent a large portion of time drawing the various panels etc using the existing palette. If this is something of a mistake I will regret it in time I'm sure, but I am rather proud of the way they look and so they will stay as they are.

It is inevitable that whenever someone is making something creative there will always be those who seek out what they feel are weaknesses in order to validate their own opinions. But that's all they are: opinions. They can, of course go and make their own games and leave us to make ours.

When this game is finished I will have achieved something I have always wanted to do. Magnus's programming is the best thing about this project but I am very proud of the work I have done so far. Magnus is also extremely happy with my work.

There will be a shop yes
I might make that 32 colours though, we'll see, I am very aware of the filesize bloating and us having trouble fitting it onto one disk

[Predseda]

I want it boxed.

BTW: why one disk?

[CaptainNow]

Originally Posted by Predseda

I want it boxed.

BTW: why one disk?

It's simply a matter of costs
We also love the practical challenge of fitting this on one disk.

[Gzegzolka]

Thanks for fast answers I understood it was placeholder.

I was thinking would it be possible to use some kind of hardware amiga trick to have other pallet for bottom status bar and still have lots of fps. If not, I will be totally okay with what is it now. It's not like I would like You to change something, it's just my opinion and I respect Your choices.

I must confess that I like those old games that got shop with nice shopkeeper gal Lords of Thunder on Sega CD was my favorite with her design and charming voice sample.

Why only one disk? Would it be better to have each level theme on one disk and than have more graphics or even some ambient music/effects? I like a lot idea of cd version with adf file and I would love to buy it

[Trachu]

Originally Posted by LordNipple

Haha! I don't really feel I have to justify my design choices to you, especially as you're being rather rude. For the sake of others who are reading this and who think the same I will clarify: 16 colours were chosen because if we were to work in 32 the frame rate would drop to 25 FPS, this is something Magnus wasn't prepared to do so I have been tasked with producing a 16 colour palette that gives nice results, so far I have had very positive feedback regarding those graphics (apart from yourself).

The palette is staying as it is, I don't have time to re-draw every sprite just to suit one user.
As for how I use my colours, it truly has nothing to do with you, no-one is forcing you to play this or to like it. I value all feedback of course, positive or negative.

First of all I did not mean to be rude, however if I express my opinion there is still a possibility that someone might not like it, especially when he misunderstand it.
I am not here to critisize you but to make your game look better.
I told you exactly why i do not like the graphics and the situation when 50% of the screen is created using 2 or 3 colours is not my opinion, but sad fact.
Someobody might think it is still good and he has all the right to think so, but I do not like it because its 2016 and i know Amiga 500 can do MUCH MUCH MORE.
Dont change the palette just use more colours to create the objects, especially those who you use most frequently.
I specialise myself in colour quantisation and psychovisualistic, so I know pretty much what i am talking about and you can check my work on Ryggar thread or better check how great amiga graphics can be on Magnus T page.
[ Show youtube player ]

Colourfull, plenty of details, superb.

[CaptainNow]

Originally Posted by Trachu

First of all I did not mean to be rude, however if I express my opinion there is still a possibility that someone might not like it, especially when he misunderstand it.
I am not here to critisize you but to make your game look better.
I told you exactly why i do not like the graphics and the situation when 50% of the screen is created using 2 or 3 colours is not my opinion, but sad fact.
Someobody might think it is still good and he has all the right to think so, but I do not like it because its 2016 and i know Amiga 500 can do MUCH MUCH MORE.
Dont change the palette just use more colours to create the objects, especially those who you use most frequently.
I specialise myself in colour quantisation and psychovisualistic, so I know pretty much what i am talking about and you can check my work on Ryggar thread or better check how great amiga graphics can be on Magnus T page.
[ Show youtube player ]

Colourfull, plenty of details, superb.

To quote a certain character from The Life of Brian..'There's no pleasing some people'.
I will continue to make the graphics exactly how I want to, Magnus is happy with how I work and that is good enough for me.

[Predseda]

Could you please give me your pallete values? I would like to try to draw something with it for myself.

[nobody]

Personally i use a 32 color Amiga palette (0 to 15 steps) i made some time ago after lots and lots (and lots) of trial and error, and again could be improved to save 1 or 2 colors
http://pixeljoint.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=19759

then i try to restrict if i need 16 colors in this castlevania style game i am drawing (with some touches from master of darkness).