Fixing Strider sprite - Page 2

viddi · 14 April 2018, 23:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by ross

I've got where the problem lie but a pain to solve.. (long and boring task).
Damn Tiertex and his "st emulation" code

.

Are the masks faulty in a way?

ross · 15 April 2018, 01:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by viddi

Are the masks faulty in a way?

No, the masks are dynamically real time generated.
As you can see in message #12 sprites gfx is irregular (to save memory and make it works on 512KB Amigas) and you need a table to maintain all variable tile values.
"st emulator" is dumb and convert everytime everything on-screen and off-screen, background and sprites.
You never know if the blitter works for something really usefull (without visible enemies and main character freezed, blitter is anyway stormed by requests..).
This makes it difficult to understand when he is actually copying wrong parts in the main character's movements.
(well, I could make a complete resource of the code but I wanted to avoid it..)

Back on topic: aforementioned table is somewhere wrong for some frames, too much words are copied for the successive blitting and some garbage appear.
I managed to find some of the correct values but not all because I have to go practically groping.

dlfrsilver · 15 April 2018, 01:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by ross

No, the masks are dynamically real time generated.
As you can see in message #12 sprites gfx is irregular (to save memory and make it works on 512KB Amigas) and you need a table to maintain all variable tile values.
"st emulator" is dumb and convert everytime everything on-screen and off-screen, background and sprites.
You never know if the blitter works for something really usefull (without visible enemies and main character freezed, blitter is anyway stormed by requests..).
This makes it difficult to understand when he is actually copying wrong parts in the main character's movements.
(well, I could make a complete resource of the code but I wanted to avoid it..)

Back on topic: aforementioned table is somewhere wrong for some frames, too much words are copied for the successive blitting and some garbage appear.
I managed to find some of the correct values but not all because I have to go practically groping.

The game code is not that big. But that's an horrible job :/

ross · 15 April 2018, 01:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlfrsilver

The game code is not that big. But that's an horrible job :/

Yes, this is the reason why I want to avoid it

But I just came up with an idea to speed up the wrong value search (in fact, I did not try too much

).

I'll try tomorrow.

viddi · 15 April 2018, 01:15

@ross: Ah, thanks a lot for the info.

Indeed a crazy job.

But it would be cool to see Strider fixed.

Thanks for your work!

ross · 15 April 2018, 11:58

I'm using the internal sprites renderer to find the garbage.

Notice this frame

So it's not only some black pixels in slope positions..

viddi · 15 April 2018, 13:21

Oh!

Crazy! Didn´t notice that!

ross · 15 April 2018, 13:29

Found 13 bad rendered sprites frame.
But there's one more that evade me!

viddi · 15 April 2018, 14:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by ross

Found 13 bad rendered sprites frame.
But there's one more that evade me!

Wow! Fantastic work.

dlfrsilver · 15 April 2018, 19:59

what a shite work Tiertex did, seriously !

rothers · 15 April 2018, 20:28

Commodore really could have had such a lead on the competition if they had coded these ports in house or at least had some hand in it. Those terrible early (ST) Amiga games really hurt the system. It irritates me to this day!

ross · 15 April 2018, 21:17

I'm debated.. Make a new cracked/trained ADF or fix an existing?
Maybe the latter.
But seems that no one in TOSEC is good enough (and sure is a mess..).

viddi · 15 April 2018, 22:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by ross

I'm debated.. Make a new cracked/trained ADF or fix an existing?
Maybe the latter.
But seems that no one in TOSEC is good enough (and sure is a mess..).

A fixed WHDload version would be perfect imo.

malko · 15 April 2018, 22:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by viddi

A fixed WHDload version would be perfect imo.

But people playing from floppy would not benefit the patched version then...
Maybe the WHDLoad installer accept cracked copy ? Did someone tested it ?

ross · 15 April 2018, 22:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by viddi

A fixed WHDload version would be perfect imo.

Yes, can be made

Quote:

Originally Posted by malko

But people playing from floppy would not benefit the patched version then...

And yes, but I need to decide how.

Quote:

Maybe the WHDLoad installer accept cracked copy ? Did someone tested it ?

No, WHDLoad for cracked copy is not accepted (there can be some exception due to lack of working original but this is not the case).

Well, like usual I do not have much free time (and the weekend has flown) but I see what I can do

viddi · 15 April 2018, 23:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by ross

Yes, can be made

Brilliant.

I have an original copy of Strider. But all I can do is trying to make an ADF or DMS archive...

ross · 16 April 2018, 14:52

Things is going more and more funny

Well, I looked at how move to the operative phase, but not everything can be corrected by editing the sprites table because ...
some of the nasty sprites are bad memory aligned! Some data need to be bit-shifted horizontally or vertically.
This is really incredible for a professional product.

So a big problem for a WHDLoad version with original floppy.
Data to be fixed is really to big for a slave, much much better a diff file added to the package or simply a pre-made archive.

You can object that some bit-shift can be dinamically calculated with the slave but there is a big knot:
original data are in compressed pc1 file format (degas elite), depacked in a buffer then st interleave trasformed then amiga plane real-time blitter used.
This is a big pain to manage (if you touch and patch some image through one of the phases you can "invade" other frames..).

Two possible solution:
- manually redesign (yes, some sprite need to be slightly modified) and realign gfx data with degas, repack and adjust loader (perfect solution).
- brutally cut some sprites (not too much actually) via above-mentioned sprites table mod. (quick solution).

Did I already say damn Tiertex?

dlfrsilver · 16 April 2018, 14:55

the sprites are indeed contained on 320x200 4 BPL 16 colors PC1 compressed Degas Elite pictures.

Why they used that when they could have cut each sprite is beyond me.

ross · 16 April 2018, 15:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlfrsilver

the sprites are indeed contained on 320x200 4 BPL 16 colors PC1 compressed Degas Elite pictures.

Why they used that when they could have cut each sprite is beyond me.

Hi Denis, there's an easy solution to manage/modify/save this image format on Amiga or PC?

[file 00000085 seems a PC1 file but an error in open is signaled.., i've to check from original floppy image]

dlfrsilver · 16 April 2018, 18:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by ross

Hi Denis, there's an easy solution to manage/modify/save this image format on Amiga or PC?

[file 00000085 seems a PC1 file but an error in open is signaled.., i've to check from original floppy image]

(ahaha

They have shot off the PI1 files headers on 2 files XD !)

Even better : unused PC1 files, the Amiga program is 103kb (crunched with tetragon), when the ST one is 69kb (crunched as well). 40kb of junk!

each graphic files once renamed as PC1 loads perfectly.

CHR*.CHR are the tiles, PC1 format with header shot

I have renamed by comparing the ST file names the unnamed Amiga files :

15 April 2018, 11:58	#26
ross Defendit numerus Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: Crossing the Rubicon Age: 53 Posts: 4,468	I'm using the internal sprites renderer to find the garbage. Notice this frame So it's not only some black pixels in slope positions.. Attached Thumbnails

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Strider II credits	dlfrsilver	HOL suggestions and feedback	20	07 August 2015 23:27
Strider	Muzkat	support.Games	8	07 August 2015 23:27
Strider -> Zelnik Party in DK	Autopsy/Hoodlum	Amiga scene	6	07 November 2013 15:29
Strider	DamienD	support.Games	3	22 August 2005 18:45

15 April 2018, 01:15	#25
viddi Moderator Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Germany Age: 44 Posts: 4,007	@ross: Ah, thanks a lot for the info. Indeed a crazy job. But it would be cool to see Strider fixed. Thanks for your work!

15 April 2018, 13:21	#27
viddi Moderator Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Germany Age: 44 Posts: 4,007	Oh! Crazy! Didn´t notice that!

15 April 2018, 13:29	#28
ross Defendit numerus Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: Crossing the Rubicon Age: 53 Posts: 4,468	Found 13 bad rendered sprites frame. But there's one more that evade me!

15 April 2018, 19:59	#30
dlfrsilver CaptainM68K-SPS France Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Melun nearby Paris/France Age: 46 Posts: 10,412	what a shite work Tiertex did, seriously !

15 April 2018, 20:28	#31
rothers Registered User Join Date: Apr 2018 Location: UK Posts: 487	Commodore really could have had such a lead on the competition if they had coded these ports in house or at least had some hand in it. Those terrible early (ST) Amiga games really hurt the system. It irritates me to this day!

15 April 2018, 21:17	#32
ross Defendit numerus Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: Crossing the Rubicon Age: 53 Posts: 4,468	I'm debated.. Make a new cracked/trained ADF or fix an existing? Maybe the latter. But seems that no one in TOSEC is good enough (and sure is a mess..).

16 April 2018, 14:52	#37
ross Defendit numerus Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: Crossing the Rubicon Age: 53 Posts: 4,468	Things is going more and more funny Well, I looked at how move to the operative phase, but not everything can be corrected by editing the sprites table because ... some of the nasty sprites are bad memory aligned! Some data need to be bit-shifted horizontally or vertically. This is really incredible for a professional product. So a big problem for a WHDLoad version with original floppy. Data to be fixed is really to big for a slave, much much better a diff file added to the package or simply a pre-made archive. You can object that some bit-shift can be dinamically calculated with the slave but there is a big knot: original data are in compressed pc1 file format (degas elite), depacked in a buffer then st interleave trasformed then amiga plane real-time blitter used. This is a big pain to manage (if you touch and patch some image through one of the phases you can "invade" other frames..). Two possible solution: - manually redesign (yes, some sprite need to be slightly modified) and realign gfx data with degas, repack and adjust loader (perfect solution). - brutally cut some sprites (not too much actually) via above-mentioned sprites table mod. (quick solution). Did I already say damn Tiertex?

16 April 2018, 14:55	#38
dlfrsilver CaptainM68K-SPS France Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Melun nearby Paris/France Age: 46 Posts: 10,412	the sprites are indeed contained on 320x200 4 BPL 16 colors PC1 compressed Degas Elite pictures. Why they used that when they could have cut each sprite is beyond me.

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)