Other languages for the amiga

Tiddlypeeps · 13 January 2010, 11:21

I have admitted defeat with 68k asm for the moment, I am not learning it fast enough to have anything to show for my final project in 3 months

My new plan is to write a small game in some higher level language and then try to convert chunks into asm, at least that way I will have something visual to show and I will have messed around with some asm.

What language would anyone recommend I use, one that is easy to swap out chunks with asm. Im thinking C just because I know it already, but I dont know if its easy to inegrate asm with. Anyone have any suggestions?

BuZz · 13 January 2010, 13:32

Integrating with asm depends on the C compiler/linker, but is possible and not too hard but GCC inline asm format is ugly :/ VBCC might do you well, and comes with a good commandline assembler.

You could give E a go, which is a popular language on the miggy.

Leffmann · 13 January 2010, 13:44

Blitz Basic and Amos are the most popular ones. Blitz is the faster and more efficient of the two, and Amos has the bigger user and code base and in my opinion seems more complete and easier to get started with. They both have excellent graphics support and are great for making simpler games with. C is far easier to convert to assembly than Blitz or Amos, but for graphics you would have to make use of an external library, or learn how to use the graphics routines in the AmigaOS, or hit the hardware directly.

The versions you would want to download are Amos Professional and Blitz Basic 2.

BuZz · 13 January 2010, 13:45

I hadn't thought to mention those, but good to point out. Note that if you already know C I doubt you want to go back to basic again :-)

pmc · 13 January 2010, 14:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiddlypeeps

I have admitted defeat with 68k asm for the moment

BOO! HISS!

Oh well... can't say you can be blamed if making a game is your aim and you have a fairly tight deadline.

I'd agree with Leffman - BB2 or AMOS is the way to go. With BB2 I understand you can use inline asm code but I'm not sure if you can do this with AMOS.

I used AMOS literally once when I was about 16 years old - I needed to make a program for a piece of school coursework for my Computer Studies exam and, being me (ie. very lazy

), hadn't coded *anything* at all for it until the Sunday afternoon before it was due in Monday morning. AMOS came to my rescue that day - quite easy to use if I remember correctly. I made a program for printing cassette tape (anyone under 25 remember those?) inlays. Got an A on the coursework too.

As for BB2 - never used it at all and don't really intend to either but loads of people love it - I think I'm right in saying that it's still produced and updated and there's evolutions of it for the PC.

Me? I'll stick to asm.

Tiddlypeeps · 13 January 2010, 14:40

I havent completely given up on asm, just putting it aside for the moment, it is just a lot more time consuming than i initially thought, it might even be easier to learn if im just converting small lumps of code.

Are the graphics routines in the AmigaOS hard to use in C? Is there any documentation on it?
What C compilers are available for the amiga?

Ill take a look into Amos as it seems to be the most popular, anyone know any good reading material on it, or sample code?

cosmicfrog · 13 January 2010, 15:02

E lets you do inline assembly as well I`m sure, might be wrong as haven`t used it for ages

killergorilla · 13 January 2010, 15:21

Yeah it does allow inline assembly.

Samurai_Crow · 13 January 2010, 16:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiddlypeeps

Are the graphics routines in the AmigaOS hard to use in C? Is there any documentation on it?
What C compilers are available for the amiga?

Ill take a look into Amos as it seems to be the most popular, anyone know any good reading material on it, or sample code?

C is easy. E is easier and it lets you inline your assembly code easier also.

Amos is simple but not so easy if you're trying to integrate assembly code with it. For Amos questions refer to the AmosPro Manual. The Amos Factory website is helpful also although it isn't always reachable.

phx · 13 January 2010, 16:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiddlypeeps

Are the graphics routines in the AmigaOS hard to use in C?

Depends what you wish to do. A "small game" could be a small shooter with scrolling, or a workbench-based thinking game. For the first I doubt that using the OS libraries makes much sense. The result will be disappointing. It also depends on the target hardware.

In any case you need some experience to decide which OS routines fit best to your problem.

When your target hardware is strong enough, it might be easiest, for the short amount of time you've got, to look into SDL or similar game-friendly libraries. Or, as already suggested, try it in some BASIC dialect.

Quote:

Is there any documentation on it?

There are always the autodocs, which discribe any OS function in detail. And lots of example sources on the net. You could also buy books about it, but that's 20 years ago.

Quote:

What C compilers are available for the amiga?

Lots. But actively maintained are only vbcc and gcc. SAS/C has probably the best 68k codegen of all, if you manage to get a copy. StormC was the last supported Amiga compiler with a GUI, but the codegen was really bad, until they switched to gcc. vbcc is compact, easy to install and a real Amiga compiler. gcc is somewhat bloated, but useful for porting Unix stuff and supports C++. Other compilers have no longer any importance (hope I didn't forget one).

Graham Humphrey · 13 January 2010, 17:18

I have put a complete installation of Blitz 2.1 in the Zone, with the Blitz Support Suite installed, as well as lots of games that include source code. Might be worth a look?

Tiddlypeeps · 14 January 2010, 11:44

I have decided on C as it is apparently one of the easier ones ot inline asm into, and it probably the only language that will be of use to me when i finish college, as it is still used by lots of games companies, so I might aswell get more experience with it.

Anyone know where I can download gcc for the Amiga?

gilgamesh · 14 January 2010, 13:50

You prabably want a cross compiler? See here

Tiddlypeeps · 14 January 2010, 14:49

Is there no version of gcc that will run on the machine itself?

davideo · 14 January 2010, 15:33

If you intend to program in C - why not have a look at GameSmith.

It includes an additional library and routines for handling graphics and screens with C and Assembler.

Comes complete with an old version of GCC (I think it's GCC) and assembler.

Works a treat for small stuff and comes with a few example programs that show you what can be done with it.

If you can get hold of a copy of the manual (350+ pages) it demonstrates all the different routines. (I'm in the process of scanning this in and turning it into a PDF file).

Dave G

Tiddlypeeps · 14 January 2010, 15:41

Anyone know where I can download gamesmith?

davideo · 14 January 2010, 15:45

It's currently in 'The Zone!'

Dave G

Tiddlypeeps · 18 January 2010, 22:55

Cheers for the gamesmith download.

Anyone know where I can find some tutorials for this.

I have installed gamesmith using the emulator to a folder on windows that is emulating a hard drive. On the emulator there is a file called Citas which seems to be some sort of programme for dealing with images, and a folder called tutorial which appears to be empty, but when i open that folder in windows it has some c code which seems like it contains everything i need to know from a coding point of view.
I just have no idea how to compile and run it.

davideo · 18 January 2010, 23:43

CITAS is the animation creation program that allows you to create animated sprites etc and then use them in your C/Assembler programs.

You need an editor to load the C source files into and look at them.

If you went through the proper install a basic (not in the language BASIC sense) editor should have been installed. I can't remember what it was called at the moment.

The only tutorials I've ever seen are those included with GameSmith. Even if you search Aminet you will only find the same ones

My pdf of the manual is nearly complete - I could send you a copy when it's done but it's bluddy huge!!!

Dave G

Tiddlypeeps · 18 January 2010, 23:58

There dosent seem to be any editor.
There are quite a few files that are invisible on the amiga that i can see in the windows folder. Maby i did something wrong when installing it that caused the icon files not to copy over. Should I be using it via the command line?

I would love a copy of the manual. When its done will you put it in the Zone, or should i pm you my email address so you can send it that way?

13 January 2010, 11:21	#1
Tiddlypeeps Tiddlypeeps Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Ireland Posts: 67	Other languages for the amiga I have admitted defeat with 68k asm for the moment, I am not learning it fast enough to have anything to show for my final project in 3 months My new plan is to write a small game in some higher level language and then try to convert chunks into asm, at least that way I will have something visual to show and I will have messed around with some asm. What language would anyone recommend I use, one that is easy to swap out chunks with asm. Im thinking C just because I know it already, but I dont know if its easy to inegrate asm with. Anyone have any suggestions?

13 January 2010, 13:44	#3
Leffmann Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Sweden Posts: 2,269	Blitz Basic and Amos are the most popular ones. Blitz is the faster and more efficient of the two, and Amos has the bigger user and code base and in my opinion seems more complete and easier to get started with. They both have excellent graphics support and are great for making simpler games with. C is far easier to convert to assembly than Blitz or Amos, but for graphics you would have to make use of an external library, or learn how to use the graphics routines in the AmigaOS, or hit the hardware directly. The versions you would want to download are Amos Professional and Blitz Basic 2. Last edited by Leffmann; 13 January 2010 at 13:51. Reason: .

14 January 2010, 15:33	#15
davideo Amiga Tomcat Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Boston Lincs Posts: 1,500	If you intend to program in C - why not have a look at GameSmith. It includes an additional library and routines for handling graphics and screens with C and Assembler. Comes complete with an old version of GCC (I think it's GCC) and assembler. Works a treat for small stuff and comes with a few example programs that show you what can be done with it. If you can get hold of a copy of the manual (350+ pages) it demonstrates all the different routines. (I'm in the process of scanning this in and turning it into a PDF file). Dave G Last edited by davideo; 14 January 2010 at 15:34. Reason: Typo

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Which programming languages were used on the Amiga historically?	punchy71	Coders. General	27	29 August 2018 12:01
Winuae languages	pjhutch	support.WinUAE	7	26 September 2012 17:06
More languages or multilanguage ?	Another World	HOL suggestions and feedback	1	24 August 2008 20:39
The Word 'Game' In Different Languages (Was: Looking for the amiga games)	utri007	Amiga scene	28	28 September 2006 12:43
Mean Streets - All Languages	killergorilla	request.Old Rare Games	10	03 August 2006 16:18

13 January 2010, 13:32	#2
BuZz Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Location: Oxford / UK Age: 47 Posts: 583	Integrating with asm depends on the C compiler/linker, but is possible and not too hard but GCC inline asm format is ugly :/ VBCC might do you well, and comes with a good commandline assembler. You could give E a go, which is a popular language on the miggy.

13 January 2010, 13:45	#4
BuZz Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Location: Oxford / UK Age: 47 Posts: 583	I hadn't thought to mention those, but good to point out. Note that if you already know C I doubt you want to go back to basic again :-)

13 January 2010, 14:40	#6
Tiddlypeeps Tiddlypeeps Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Ireland Posts: 67	I havent completely given up on asm, just putting it aside for the moment, it is just a lot more time consuming than i initially thought, it might even be easier to learn if im just converting small lumps of code. Are the graphics routines in the AmigaOS hard to use in C? Is there any documentation on it? What C compilers are available for the amiga? Ill take a look into Amos as it seems to be the most popular, anyone know any good reading material on it, or sample code?

13 January 2010, 15:02	#7
cosmicfrog The 1 who ribbits Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: leek, Staffs, UK Age: 56 Posts: 3,557	E lets you do inline assembly as well I`m sure, might be wrong as haven`t used it for ages

13 January 2010, 15:21	#8
killergorilla Lesser Talent Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: UK Age: 42 Posts: 7,957	Yeah it does allow inline assembly.

13 January 2010, 17:18	#11
Graham Humphrey Moderator Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Norwich, Norfolk, UK Age: 37 Posts: 11,167	I have put a complete installation of Blitz 2.1 in the Zone, with the Blitz Support Suite installed, as well as lots of games that include source code. Might be worth a look?

14 January 2010, 11:44	#12
Tiddlypeeps Tiddlypeeps Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Ireland Posts: 67	I have decided on C as it is apparently one of the easier ones ot inline asm into, and it probably the only language that will be of use to me when i finish college, as it is still used by lots of games companies, so I might aswell get more experience with it. Anyone know where I can download gcc for the Amiga?

14 January 2010, 13:50	#13
gilgamesh Linux snob Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Monkey Island Posts: 997	You prabably want a cross compiler? See here

14 January 2010, 14:49	#14
Tiddlypeeps Tiddlypeeps Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Ireland Posts: 67	Is there no version of gcc that will run on the machine itself?

14 January 2010, 15:41	#16
Tiddlypeeps Tiddlypeeps Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Ireland Posts: 67	Anyone know where I can download gamesmith?

14 January 2010, 15:45	#17
davideo Amiga Tomcat Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Boston Lincs Posts: 1,500	It's currently in 'The Zone!' Dave G

18 January 2010, 22:55	#18
Tiddlypeeps Tiddlypeeps Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Ireland Posts: 67	Cheers for the gamesmith download. Anyone know where I can find some tutorials for this. I have installed gamesmith using the emulator to a folder on windows that is emulating a hard drive. On the emulator there is a file called Citas which seems to be some sort of programme for dealing with images, and a folder called tutorial which appears to be empty, but when i open that folder in windows it has some c code which seems like it contains everything i need to know from a coding point of view. I just have no idea how to compile and run it.

18 January 2010, 23:43	#19
davideo Amiga Tomcat Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Boston Lincs Posts: 1,500	CITAS is the animation creation program that allows you to create animated sprites etc and then use them in your C/Assembler programs. You need an editor to load the C source files into and look at them. If you went through the proper install a basic (not in the language BASIC sense) editor should have been installed. I can't remember what it was called at the moment. The only tutorials I've ever seen are those included with GameSmith. Even if you search Aminet you will only find the same ones My pdf of the manual is nearly complete - I could send you a copy when it's done but it's bluddy huge!!! Dave G

18 January 2010, 23:58	#20
Tiddlypeeps Tiddlypeeps Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Ireland Posts: 67	There dosent seem to be any editor. There are quite a few files that are invisible on the amiga that i can see in the windows folder. Maby i did something wrong when installing it that caused the icon files not to copy over. Should I be using it via the command line? I would love a copy of the manual. When its done will you put it in the Zone, or should i pm you my email address so you can send it that way?

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)