fighting with easynet

[Sephnroth]

Hi guys,
I finally received my network card + easynet from amikit but I'm having a little bit of a challenge getting it working.

My first problem was driver on floppy and my 1200 does not have working floppy drive atm.. but I found 3c589.lha on aminet and it seems to of done the job! Not had any error messages anyway!

My second problem was the easynet install being on a cdrom but I pulled the CF card from my a1200 and booted WinUAE from it mounting the easynet cd at the same time. I've copied all the files to my CF and I did install it from WinUAE but after putting the CF back in the 1200 I decided to install easynet again just incase something different occured on real hardware.

Thats the background info and now I am at a point where easynet thinks its all installed properly, it saw my network card and I could select it without error.

However

a) when I "Go Online" it takes way longer than it seems to for other people on youtube etc to get online, when it has done that it checks for updates and that takes ages too and finally it will say "Online" and tell me how long i've been on

b) no network features seem to work. I can't ping anything, including my router. There is a green light on the dongle that connects to the pcmcia card and it is lit, I then connected via network cable to the switch in my office (same switch my main desktop i'm now using connects to) and the switch is lighting up to suggest it knows there is something connected and alive in that port. BUT if I go to my routers config page in a browser and look at connected devices the amiga is -not- there. If in the amiga shell I try to ping the router or another pc on my network it fails with 100% packet loss. My pc cannot ping my amiga either.

Absolutely no idea what to do next!

My IP settings are all correct as best as I can tell, I used the preset for "UK - Virgin Media" to set dns and domain name (and I double checked that information with what my desktop uses and it seems correct) - I've added my amigas ip, the loopback address and the router all to the amigas hosts list...

Don't know what I did wrong Any clues?

Just incase its relevant this is on an Amiga 1200 with an ACA 1221 accelerator (with every feature unlocked) and I am running Bloodwytch's classic workbench.

[Pat the Cat]

Aminet TCP/IP prior to 4.1 is a dog for internet usage over a network.

Such are still marketed as "Easynet Pro", although you can dig out the software yourself if you try.

Roadshow is making a lot of people happy. Quick to setup, much nicer build. But that's commercial too.

Which ROM you are booting the A1200 and similar can have an impact, but in general, most of the network software distributions should work to some extent with 3.0.

3.1 and up are much tighter - less forgiving of lashed up systems. They do things properly, but doesn't always work with network solutions released for 3.0.

[Signman]

This sounds almost exactly like my scenario a few months ago. I just gave up.

[gary_nz]

Sounds like my scenario too and I also gave up. I tried on several times on several different machines including a fresh install on an A1200 and A600. I even had a ticket logged with AmigaKit and I got nowhere.

The only suggestion I have is that if any accelerator install that has more than 8Mb installed can stop the PCMCIA slot from working properly.
EDIT
Sorry - that should be if the card has more than 4Mb RAM installed because of memory addressing issues.

[Pat the Cat]

It boils down to - earlier releases of AmiTCP needed a custom bsdsocket.library to work properly and even then, async mode only.

The extra cash pays for things like SMB (MS product) compatibility, I think. It's a license with technology issue. Certainly some people had to go out and find a daemon afterwards, ntsd I think. Again licensed, in packs of five, and very expensive.

A lot of people think "EasyNet" when actually what they get is "hacked up and pirated attempt to access proprietary software that doesn't really work Net."

Get the later versio and use a proper library, or use a different TCP/IP Stack. You don't have to use Aminet. Most people try that route because it's cheap, but they don't understand WHY it's cheap.

Card.device can be an issue too, but it would appear you have that licked already (I don't. but the networked A1200 is a slow boat project).

[Sephnroth]

So you're basically saying it is not working right because it's the non-pro version and aminet 3.x is bad at getting online over a network? Well that's no good, the product wasn't free regardless of if it was cheap!

SMB is Samba isn't it? Amiga samba is included with my package. Of course browsing the net etc is gonna be slow on a 1200 - its just for fun But my main want was to be able to copy files from PC across the network so I never have to remove my CF card again. I looked at the package and... network card, check, tcp/ip stack, check, samba drivers, check - I really struggle to believe that this can't work and assumed i'd just fluffed the config! But the two guys above who gave up do not fill me with confidence

I honestly don't mind paying to upgrade to easynet pro for amitcp 4.0, especially if that will fix my issues. I just struggle with the idea that it doesn't work -at all- if I don't >_<

[Pat the Cat]

Check the Aminet version. It's pointless checking the library, the version number is identical to the real thing. Replacing both should fire it up properly

As for being upset about paying for the distro, it still has some functionality (to be fair) it's just not what people are expecting they paid for.

Also, I think Roadshow is cheaper. That is using the Genesis variant of Aminet, much later release? Could be why it's getting fans.

If the Amiga side isn't running a daemon, the PCs on the networke can't really "see" it, because there is nobody home to talk to. The network router is just obeying commands to route packets to the right places and works (slowly). That's how I read these tea leaves. You are getting online onto the internet, but you do not have network functionality.

Remember, it was originally released as a dial up internet solution. Effectively, your network card was the phone company. Hence the problems with early distros having components that didn't work properly on a real network. to get to the internet.

AFAIK the only real network provider that still supports and supplies Amiga client software is Novell. That might be helpful, if your network is Novell. Everybody else it costs an arm and a leg just to talk on a telephone.

[Locutus]

I have no idea what gibberish Pat just wrote.

But to answer:

- if you want to pay money Roadshow is the bestest
- Miami is probably easiest to setup but only available as warez (zomg!)
- Genesis is included with OS3.9 but doesn't have DHCP.
- AmiTCP3 available for free, if you aren't used to configuring unix style networking not easy.

[Pat the Cat]

Originally Posted by Locutus

AmiTCP3 available for free, if you aren't used to configuring unix style networking not easy.

AmiTCP versions prior to 4.1 are none-functional in a lot of respects. What is so hard to understand about that?

Did you even read the first post? No, I didn't think so.

Are you even aware that the problems of the inet225 distro, based on the CBM AS225 distro, and for which an early version of AmiTCP is the principal cause, are documented online? No, I didn't think so either.

http://www.amigaforever.com/kb/14-109

On the Amiga side, using Amiga Explorer in TCP/IP mode requires the original bsdsocket.library, or a compatible TCP/IP library. The libraries provided by AmiTCP/IP version 4.x (released in 1994, and which became the reference for Amiga bsdsocket.library functionality) or newer, Miami and WinUAE, for example, work fine. There is a known issue in relation with the TCP/IP stack which was part of the "Enlan-DFS" and "Inet-225" products, which, by design, included limited compatibility with the bsdsocket.library, specifically to support certain programs such as AmiPhone, but not to offer full compatibility with the original library having the same name. Important features used by Amiga Explorer, such as asynchronous socket events, are missing in this library. Under these circumstances Amiga Explorer may issue a "TCP/IP library cannot be opened" message and not function.

Don't use early AmiTCP earlier than 4.1 or you WILL get problems. It's a CBM utility that they never actually released out of house anyway. If you must, use 4.1 or later or a different TCP/IP stack. Easynet ships with 3.X. You pretty much have to upgrade it anyway. It might technically get you online, with certain very old browsers. The latest is 4.2, and costs a bunch, last time I checked, but that might have changed. Roadshow is a BARGAIN really. But, you can do the work yourself, find alternative TCP-IP stack maybe (HOW OFTEN HAVE I REPEATED THAT) and you don't have to pay to network an Amiga. That is what you are paying for, somebody to go out there, into the Aminet and other archives, and dig this crap out. And a lot of it IS crap, in the sense of, it works slowly, if it works at all.

You wouldn't believe some of the hoops people have been trying to jump through,

http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthre...ht=inet&page=2

[Locutus]

I'm not going to argue with someone who already confuses Aminet/AmiTCP and thinks CBM was here in Finland.

Go take your pills and fuck you :-D

[Pat the Cat]

Originally Posted by Locutus

I'm not going to argue with someone who already confuses Aminet/AmiTCP and thinks CBM was here in Finland.

Go take your pills and fuck you :-D

CBM might as well have been on the moon, for all the good they did for the customers when it came to networking Amigas. Not getting on the internet and web, that came later. Just the basic "I want to connect this computer to that computer without fucking around all week".

CBM's attitude was, if you didn't give them at least a blow job at the first meeting at least, you weren't worthy of their attention. That's how they treated EVERYBODY. Me included.

Seems like some Amigans picked up these habits.

[Overflow]

I have EasyNet myself, which came with the network cards Ive purchased from Amigakit. Tried to get it working, but found it frustrating. Ended up using MiamiDX instead.
MiamiDX is real easy to get online with. Ive read comments that its rather slow compared to others.

[Daedalus]

Originally Posted by Pat the Cat

The extra cash pays for things like SMB (MS product) compatibility, I think. It's a license with technology issue. Certainly some people had to go out and find a daemon afterwards, ntsd I think. Again licensed, in packs of five, and very expensive.

Eh? Samba server is free, though it's the smbfs client that is included with Easynet, not the server. Nevertheless, that is free also.

Anyway, regarding the OP, I've never had any issues running AmiTCP 3.x or 4.x on any A1200 with 3.1 ROMs, though AmiTCP depends on having static IP addresses. Fiddling with text files can be awkward, but it's not that difficult once you read the guides - the default settings are fine for most purposes. DNS is not required to ping other machines or the router by IP address, so if pinging by IP isn't working, there's no point even trying to get DNS working.

A delay like that sounds like you're trying to use some sort of dynamic addresses via DHCP or whatever. If you give it a static IP address it should report as online right away, even with no actual network connection since the Amiga API doesn't have support for media connection status. So try give all static IPs (IP, subnet, DNS, gateway etc.) and see if it at least reports online without a delay. Then you can go from there.

As noted, MiamiDX is a more fully-featured stack, with proper DHCP support and a decent configuration GUI. But it is also slower, and AFAIK never released freely if that sort of thing is a concern.

[Pat the Cat]

Originally Posted by Daedalus

* FULLY COMPREHENSIVE ANSWER.

Thank you Daedalus, that sums up a lot of undiscovered issues from my point of view.

I don't think you meant that Microsoft will supply a free server that runs in AmigaDOS with your response, but I've given up being surprised by now.

"Free" doesn't mean "free and works on Amiga". Sadly.

Unless you have AROS and a Vampire, possibly.

[Daedalus]

Well I'm not sure what fee you think is applicable for SMB, or how that might apply to Easynet. Of course I didn't mean Microsoft would supply a server, but thankfully the open source community took that on many, many years ago instead. I was referring to SMB as the protocol, of which Samba is the most popular implementation outside of Microsoft's own, rather than any specific product. I thought such a distinction would be obvious given the context...

Anyway, the protocol has been moved on by Microsoft a great deal since those days, but the old implementations are still enough for most purposes. It's slow, but I've been running an SMB server (Samba) on one of my Amigas for close to 20 years now. (Jeez, I'm old!)

Besides that however, Easynet doesn't include the Samba server, only the filesystem client. This means it can be used to connect to shares on other machines, but doesn't offer any server functionality. Unlike the server, this is actually reasonably quick to use and doesn't need a powerful Amiga to work, and is something that I use daily.

[Sephnroth]

First things first - thank you to everyone who took the time to respond! I didn't quite expect the fight in the middle (peace guys) but theres still loads of good info here It seems clear there are perhaps better choices than the amitcp stack BUT in my mind it should work still. Easnet comes with the stack and a browser, at the bare minimum that should function. I may ultimately end up going with a new stack later but I'd love to solve this so I can put together a tutorial/youtube vid for other users who get the package.


Daedalus: I am using 3.0 roms I think, could this be a breaking factor? I believe the requirements for easynet state "2.x, 3.x, 4.x" so I felt safe with the purchase. I am using a static IP. I assigned the amiga 192.168.0.84 with a subnet of 255.255.255.0 which matches my local network. I put my routers IP (192.168.0.1) as the gateway address. The only thing I did not set was the domain name which was set automatically when I chose the virgin media DNS preset - I believe it was set to virgin.net or maybe virginmedia.net. I have not been offered any DHCP options, I presumed it simply was not supported and left it at that.

None of this am I configuring through commands or text files though - EasyNet has its own configuration screen where I set all this data - I presume it runs the appropriate AmiTCP commands when I confirm the settings dialog

RE Samba: yes the amiga acting as a samba CLIENT is all I want I have a static server running in my attic which I intend to throw an amiga share on to store stuff I want my amiga to have access to. I dont need to get at the amiga from my pc

Im sat here at work atm and I'm 99% certain that when I was adding hosts I stupidly added 127.0.0.1 with the name "loopback" when of course it should say localhost - could a mishap like that break everything?

[liviux76]

I've been running Easynet Pro for more than 1 year without any issues and it is pretty "fast" in my opinion.

My configuration is with static IP, Subnet, GW, etc... and as soon as I've set up those values I was able to go on Internet and browse the Samba shares on my local network.

I don't think that it is necessary to specify the hostname for 127.0.0.1 IP address but I don't see why the "wrong name" can affect the functionality of the IP Stack.

(a bit) OT:
I've also tried to setup a Samba Server but it doesn't work... probably I'll need the help of Daedalus in order to solve this issue since I've just read that he is running a Samba Server on his Amiga...

[Locutus]

For the SMB mounting not working, one issue often with old clients is the exchange of encrypted passwords.

Double check your SMB server has the option for legacy clients enabled.

[Daedalus]

To be honest I wouldn't recommend running the server if you plan on doing much else with the Amiga. When it's responding to queries it uses significant CPU time, enough to make graphics work in TVPaint or PPaint feel clunky and MP3s to skip, and that's on an 060/66 with SCSI. Generally I only run it when needed, but if you're determined, I can give you a hand. There was a good guide my MikeyC, but I can't find it after a quick Google...

Using the client on the other hand, as Locutus says, depends on the server you're connecting *to*. Besides the password encryption issue mentioned, Windows versions greater than Vista (and OSX versions from 10.6 on IIRC) need a newer version of smbfs, which still has some issues but does work. Older versions such as the common 1.74 result in corrupted transfers. Connecting to various Linux distros new and old, and older versions of Windows and OSX works great with any version however, and is simple to do so I always recommend just doing that for network transfers. Once you have the TCP/IP stuff working, the client should "just work" provided you have hostname entries in your hosts file for each server you wish to connect to.

It's easy to change the hosts file to try different configurations, but I can't see how that would affect things either - all it does is offer a sort of "manual" DNS service to your machine for the local network. The loopback address may be needed for certain software but pinging should work regardless. Likewise, the domain setting shouldn't affect direct IP connections on your network. Easynet provides a front-end for editing the config files, but it might be worth opening them in an editor to manually check that the correct values are actually getting saved - wonky file permissions can have a strange effect in these situations, especially if you've involved a non-Amiga filesystem anywhere along the way.

You are right, it should work fine and without any issues. I can't imagine any reason it wouldn't work on 3.0. I used it on 3.0 just fine until I upgraded to 3.5, and I currently use AmiTCP mostly on all my classics.

[Pat the Cat]

Originally Posted by Sephnroth

I didn't quite expect the fight in the middle (peace guys)

I'm very sorry. I've had maybe 25 years resentment over something that wasn't even anything to do with the Amiga. It was Future that banned me from tinkering with such things. I can't help noticing a great big hole in the CBM history marked "Amiga Network". That's my choice partly, but NOT at the time, and maybe me Aminet and the Amiga just had to evolve anyway.

Plus I'm potentially in a big bucket of trouble right now, and it's pretty hectic from all sorts of angles. Happens to everybody from time to time. Don't want to talk about that stuff, and past connections and disconnections are something I'm dealing with as an avoidance measure, maybe.

Again I say sorry and I'll wind my neck in generally. wot network Pat? Exactly.