The Amiga 1000 could of done a game like Wolfenstein in 1985 - shock!

[Miggy4eva]

Originally Posted by Shatterhand

Ok mate, keep being an annoying cat then, I guess it's your right.

Amiga is better than the X68000, Neo Geo, Mega-Drive, Playstation 4 and the Xbox One. Alas, I don't understand why people waste their times using a PC Windows Box when an A500 is a lot better and more usable and has true multi-tasking and can play Wolf 3D at 60 fps and Atari users are the ones here saying nonsense. Final Fight Amiga is better than the X68000 version, Golden Axe amiga is better than the arcade one, AGA games run at 50 fps with 256 colors, Xenon 2 is the best vertical shoot'em up ever, Project-X is better than anything consoles got it at that time, 1 button is enough to play Street Fighter 2, the only reason Amiga didn't have Doom was because coders were lazy and Workbench never, ever, EVER crashes.

It's ok. I really agree with Akira now, I just think you are troll by now. But hey, Amiga is the best thing ever.

Well I realise you are being sarcastic but honestly half of what you say is true even though you exaggerate a bit. I won't rebutt what you said because I know you are trying to troll me, but one comment - Street Fighter 2 on the Amiga was an absolute disgrace, they didn't even use the mode 7-like trick on the background to give it a 3d look. However the gameplay dynamics are easily manageable with 1 button joystick. In fact I prefer the simplicty, and the skill required to do combinations. If the game engine was written correctly, without the coders being so damned lazy and greedy, I have every reason to believe the Amiga version of Street Fighter 2 could have been one of the best versions, instead of the worst. And that's not a troll.

But I know that is hijacking the thread.

Question - couldn't the mode-7 like technique (such as used in the background of lionheart, or discussed here: http://www.pouet.net/topic.php?which=10195) be used to do the floor and ceiling in an OCS Wolfenstein? Add that to the Wildcat demo and we'd actually be halfway to Doom!

[Amiga1992]

They can do what they want but to come into Amiga forums and start fights, make untrue claims and bash the Amiga, well, they can get 2 barrels of truth fired back at them. That is all.

How about you coming here and start fights, make untrue claims and bash anything but Amiga? Unlike you, most people here do not engage in these stupid system fights, because more often than most, they are based on ridiculous fandom and not actual facts.
And you are particularly aggressive about it.
You went on a thread about conversions from hardware, talking a lot of misinformation and fighting another member when you were told "what you are saying is simply not true". Which it wasn't,. Ah, but no, this other user committed the "crime" of mentioning the Atari ST and not in the worst of lights! The cheek! insanity! Must retaliate!

Originally Posted by Miggy4eva

However they also make many ridiculous claims and exaggerate

Because you don't?
You didn't last two paragraphs without getting exactly into the territory you condemned:

I would argue the X68000 is not as good.

The Amiga was strong enough to compete head-to-head with X68000 hardware

Thirdly the X68000 was not revolutionary or did anything new unlike the Amiga.

Fourth, the Amiga had a total ecosystem, true multitasking OS with Workbench that killed NEC's OS.

Wow you really have deep knowledge of the X68k platform.

These add up to other completely false claims you have made on otehr threads.


If you cannot realize that the problem vector has been you all along, there is a problem. Any time people have told you to stop attacking others and that what you say is incorrect, you have blown up. You have signed up like a week or so ago. You should understand that you look like a full-blown troll. If you are not, just change your attitude, but if you are, let us be and move somewhere else where you feel more "at home", like dunno, maybe Lemon Amiga .


[edit] Oh you added some more gold. HEre goes:

Originally Posted by Miggy4eva

they didn't even use the mode 7-like trick on the background to give it a 3d look.

That's not "Mode 7".

Question - couldn't the mode-7 like technique (such as used in the background of lionheart, or discussed here: http://www.pouet.net/topic.php?which=10195) be used to do the floor and ceiling in an OCS Wolfenstein? Add that to the Wildcat demo and we'd actually be halfway to Doom!

Again, saying things you don't understand, and refering again to the 20FPS demo you so much love.
As it was said to you again, a DEMO and a GAME are completely different things. A GAME has a LOT MORE STUFF going on at once than a DEMO SCENE.

And you insult the game coders (greedy and lazy). Yeah because it's their fault! I am sure you could do better mate. Go on, wow us all, because your knowledge of all things amiga is supreme.

I give up.

[idrougge]

Originally Posted by Miggy4eva

Finally look at the sales numbers. They don't lie.

And that's why the 286 PC is a hundred times better than the Amiga.

[pandy71]

Originally Posted by idrougge

And that's why the 286 PC is a hundred times better than the Amiga.

Tell me more - i could do at the beginning of 90's side by side comparison between 286 (16MHz) and 386SX (also 16MHz) vs A500 - had impression that both PC was incapable to offer such graphics and audio as A500, speed was comparable (jpeg decoding for example).

forgot to mention: price for stripped (with 128KB of RAM not 256KB) VGA card was somewhere around 2/3 price of A500 (and VGA required monitor which usually was grayscale and more expensive than 1084).

[idrougge]

Don't ask me, ask Miggy4eva. According to him, sales figures never lie.

[pandy71]

Originally Posted by idrougge

Don't ask me, ask Miggy4eva. According to him, sales figures never lie.

Well... then Macintosh is way beyond any competition... (for 68k machine).

[idrougge]

Since sales figures never lie, the 286 is vastly superior to any 68k CPU.

[Miggy4eva]

Yeah ok, really funny. Har har har. In fact several people call me troll and then you act like trolls.
What I mean is up to 1 million sales. After that, yes we all know that Mac and 286 dominated the market due to business and education sectors. This was bullshit because the A500 was better than both but the marketing and commercial connections just weren't there.
But that is the big boys game, the Amiga lost the game because of marketing and business reasons and nothing to do with hardware or software. It had everything and could do everything better than 68k Mac or 286.
X68000 wasn't even in the big boys game.

Akira, I won't reply to all of the pointless attacks you made on me but here are some things I want to say. You and others keep editing my quotes when you quote me, to make sure it looks like I'm talking shit

Originally Posted by Akira

That's not "Mode 7".

I didn't say mode 7. I said mode 7-like. I know mode 7 is a SNES feature, but Amiga has similar technique discovered by genius coders. That's what I was referring to. That is what is discussed in the pouet.net link I provided.

Originally Posted by Akira

Again, saying things you don't understand, and refering again to the 20FPS demo you so much love.
As it was said to you again, a DEMO and a GAME are completely different things. A GAME has a LOT MORE STUFF going on at once than a DEMO SCENE.

Again you chop my quotes. In the same post, maybe the next sentence I said I know that the demo doesn't contain AI or sprites. I know. I KNOW.
But every first person shooter is at one stage in its early life, a tech demo. Yes it will lose some FPS with addition of features but Wildcat demo could lose 50% of its frames per second and still be better than ST Wolf. Not to mention there will be further optimisations, and those additions won't cost 50% of fps anyway.

Originally Posted by Akira

And you insult the game coders (greedy and lazy). Yeah because it's their fault! I am sure you could do better mate. Go on, wow us all, because your knowledge of all things amiga is supreme.

You don't have to be a coder to know what Amiga is capable of, and that some programs are not up to par. You don't have to be a coder to recognise an ST lazyport. You don't have to be a coder see the different between Lionheart and Streetfighter 2. You don't have to be a sprinter to see that Usain Bolt is faster than other sprinters.
Street Fighter 2 is a terrible conversion to the Amiga. End of story.

[kovacm]

Originally Posted by Miggy4eva

Yes it will lose some FPS with addition of features but Wildcat demo could lose 50% of its frames per second and still be better than ST Wolf. Not to mention there will be further optimisations, and those additions won't cost 50% of fps anyway.

Atari ST Wolfenstein 3D is quite old (more than a decade) and in meantime new coder discovered that 40% time in Atari ST Wolfenstein 3D is wasted!
So ST version could be 40% faster if someone implement new optimizations.

[britelite]

Originally Posted by Miggy4eva

Yeah ok, really funny. Har har har. In fact several people call me troll and then you act like trolls.

You're not a troll, but rather someone way to enthusiastic who has absolutely no idea what he's talking about, which isn't a good combination either.

I know. I KNOW.

To be honest, no you don't.

Yes it will lose some FPS with addition of features but Wildcat demo could lose 50% of its frames per second and still be better than ST Wolf.

So, you mean something running at around 8fps (you know, 50% of 16fps) would be better than the ST-version?

Not to mention there will be further optimisations, and those additions won't cost 50% of fps anyway.

And how do you come to this conclusion, considering you don't really have a clue of what's going on in a game (or the wildcat demo for that matter).

You don't have to be a coder to know what Amiga is capable of

No, but it certainly helps.

[Miggy4eva]

Originally Posted by kovacm

Atari ST Wolfenstein 3D is quite old (more than a decade) and in meantime new coder discovered that 40% time in Atari ST Wolfenstein 3D is wasted!
So ST version could be 40% faster if someone implement new optimizations.

I thought we were trying to stop the Amiga vs ST trolling here....
I find it very hard to believe St Wolf can be ANOTHER 40% faster? Ah, so it might run in real life almost as fast as the videos on youtube run, in speed-up emulators.
If somebody found a faster technique, why do they ignore it? The proof is in the pudding, show me where it is.

[kovacm]

Originally Posted by Miggy4eva

If somebody found a faster technique, why do they ignore it? The proof is in the pudding, show me where it is.

First you show me Wolfenstein on Amiga at any speed.

btw
YT videos of ST Wolfenstein are on ST (8MHz) or MegaSTe/Falcon (16MHz). In description people wrote on which configuration video is recorded.

[britelite]

Originally Posted by Miggy4eva

The proof is in the pudding, show me where it is.

Right back at you, if you're going to claim Wolf 3D can be oh so much faster on the A500 than on the ST, then show us some proof

[Kalms]

Originally Posted by kovacm

Atari ST Wolfenstein 3D is quite old (more than a decade) and in meantime new coder discovered that 40% time in Atari ST Wolfenstein 3D is wasted!
So ST version could be 40% faster if someone implement new optimizations.

Do you have any links to this? I'd like to read more about it.

[Dunny]

Originally Posted by Miggy4eva

Secondly anyone can make amazing hardware specs with unlimited budget. It's not hard to make a powerful machine that costs £500 and nothing to be admired. The ST was strong enough to compete head-to-head with Amiga hardware, even if it loses some battles, for a fraction of the price. It was elegant, a multimedia, all-purpose machine better than anything on the planet the day it was released for a price that anyone who did the proper analysis would pay.

I thought this might bring some balance to a very, very stupid argument

[kovacm]

Originally Posted by Kalms

Do you have any links to this? I'd like to read more about it.

In this thread you have talk about Doug (user: dml) 3D engine for ST: http://www.atari-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=16682

[ Show youtube player ]

and there is talk about optimization even Ray engine. Also Ray mention on his site http://s390174849.online.de/ray.tscc.de/wolf3d.htm that plan for never-released version is to implement "a delta clear to draw floors/ceilings more quickly".

[Zarchos]

Pop corn mode ON

Did I tell you I owned an Archimedes because it was so much more advanced than the Amiga ?

Pop corn mode OFF

Coming back in a few days to harvest.
In the meantime, playing Wolfenstein
and
Doom Trilogy http://www.arsvcs.demon.co.uk/leisure/index.html
on my Archie.

[kovacm]

@Zarchos any YT video of this game on original Archie to recommend?

[Miggy4eva]

Originally Posted by kovacm

In this thread you have talk about Doug (user: dml) 3D engine for ST: http://www.atari-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=16682

17 pages of hogwash.
Lots of talk but I bet any money we will NEVER see an improved ST Wolf. It's all talk.

[Thorham]

Originally Posted by Shatterhand

Amiga is better than the X68000, Neo Geo, Mega-Drive, Playstation 4 and the Xbox One.

It's certainly cooler than the Playstation 4 and XBox One