Help update Amiga-Hardware : Agnus - Page 3

desantii · 29 August 2010, 06:53

FYI, not sure on all not being pin compatible. Just swaped this one (from an NTSC megachip)
Agnus (2 MB) 8375 318069-11

To this one (to try to create a PAL megachip) and it works great
Agnus (2 MB) 8375 390544-01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zetr0

It might be best to point out that theres some error in the first post.

the A600 had two different 8375 Agnus

a 2MB 8375 3190544 (rev 1.0 type 1 *image from amiga-hardware*)
a 2MB 8375 318069 (most common A600 rev 1.0 *type2* to 1.5)

from my investigations the 8375 318069-xx series is pin compatible with earlier models like the 8370/8371/8732 and the latters A/B and AB varients.

Other than the DIP based Agnus on the A1000 the 8375 3190544 series is exculisve to the A500+ and the first limmited release of the A600. the 8375 3190544 was also prevailent on a lot of 3rd party chip upgrades and is NOT pin compatible with the other 8375 revisions of Agnus.

31 December 2010, 06:25

I have some confusion about this part:

Agnus (1 MB) 8372A 318069-029 A500 (PAL), A2000 (PAL) (changed after some damage)

I have a Rev 6.2 A2000

The agnus part # is 8372A 318069-029 (9 is floating and some distance from the -02)

Chip date is: 0990

Although you're reporting here this chip is 1MB SysInfo reports it as a 2MB.

Bug in SysInfo or newly discovered information?

Should I bother adding the additional 1MB of RAM to the motherboard or would it help confirm this as a 2MB chip?

-Matt

cosmicfrog · 31 December 2010, 11:17

sysinfo reports a 2MB angus in my a2000 rev 6.2
still havent had time to read the number of angnus

if it is indeed true it makes doing the 2MB chipram mod easier

alexh · 31 December 2010, 13:30

The 8372A 318069-029 _is_ a 1Mbyte part.

99% sure this is a bug / limitation of the SysInfo software.

It must not be possible to recognise that some 8372/8375 Agnus chips are 1Mbyte. Perhaps there is no way to differentiate? After all they are the same silicon, just bonded out differently.

You cannot use a 2Mbyte part directly in an A2000 motherboard without an adapter like a MiniMegi / MegAChip.

rkauer · 01 January 2011, 19:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by alexh

You cannot use a 2Mbyte part directly in an A2000 motherboard without an adapter like a MiniMegi / MegAChip.

Oh, yeah?

alexh · 01 January 2011, 20:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by rkauer

Oh, yeah?

Yeah what?? That hack is a DIY equivalent to the MegAChip / MiniMega adapter.

rkauer · 01 January 2011, 21:43

But the fact the user can hack the board dropping an 8375 Agnus (the only one that works!) directly on the Agnus socket of the A2000.

I still want to hack a rev6 board this way to validate the idea.

Thing is this Agnus is hard to get, even knowing A3000 Amigas use to die for nothing, leaving lots of spare parts...

alexh · 01 January 2011, 22:29

Never seen an 8375 318069-19 in the flesh. I guess as you say they are very rare as A3000 came with a 2Mbyte Agnus so they probably made very few.

The 8372 318069-03 is probably easier to find?

rkauer · 02 January 2011, 01:32

As far as I know, only the early A3000 Agnus is pin compatible with the A500/2000 Agnii, and even then not totally compatible as some signals are missing (read the hack on the link above).

But for the solely purpose of making an A500/2000 capable of 2Mb chip RAM without a plug-in board, then it is perfect.

So the model to search for still is the 8372AB, and maybe the 8375 318069-19.

Like I said, I need to find a pair to hack a pair of boards to validate this.

I know for sure this hack works on the rev6 A2000 as one Australian user did this to both A2000 he have.

AndyLandy · 27 June 2011, 10:32

If it helps, my A3000 is a late-revision board (9.02) and has Agnus part:
C= CSG
8372B
2190 23

I'm led to believe that later-revision A2000s (r6.3-r6.5) have a 2MB Agnus on-board as standard, but only 1MB is populated on the board.

I'd also like to know how much ChipRAM is on r4.x A2000 boards? I've gotten conflicting reports as to whether it's 512k Chip/512k Ranger, or 1MB Chip.

Does the 8371 Agnus even support 1MB Chip? I don't think it does.

8bitbubsy · 27 June 2011, 10:54

8371 supports 512kB chip RAM max, so 4.x boards were populated with 8371 and 512kB chip/512kB fake-fast. I think 4.5 (at least 5.x) came with 8372A which can address 1MB, but I am uncertain if the 4.5 ones were setup with 1MB or with 512/512.

alexh · 27 June 2011, 14:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyLandy

I'm led to believe that later-revision A2000s (r6.3-r6.5) have a 2MB Agnus on-board as standard, but only 1MB is populated on the board.

I don't think this is true. Non of the B2000 motherboards I've looked at can take 2MB Agnus chip directly.

I've seen the very last B2000 motherboards came with 1MB 8375 Agnus chips which is perhaps where the confusion may come from?

AndyLandy · 27 June 2011, 17:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by alexh

I don't think this is true. Non of the B2000 motherboards I've looked at can take 2MB Agnus chip directly.

I've seen the very last B2000 motherboards came with 1MB 8375 Agnus chips which is perhaps where the confusion may come from?

I didn't even know there was a 1MB 8375 Agnus! *sigh*, more C= inconsistencies, I thought it was just the 8372A that was 1MB.

The C2000 motherboards are sometimes claimed to come with "Full ECS Chipset", I've known people say they've had 2MB ChipRAM added to their board without changing the Agnus, but I cannot for the life of me find a photo of an r6.3+ A2000 board.

*edit* -- This photo is of Psodas' r6.3 from Amibay:
http://img710.imageshack.us/img710/6875/img3861o.jpg

C= CSG
318069-02
8372A
1692 23

So, they were still cutting 1MB 8372 Agnuses in early '92. Maybe it is a myth that late-A2000s have 2MB Agnuses.

alexh · 27 June 2011, 23:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyLandy

I didn't even know there was a 1MB 8375 Agnus! *sigh*, more C= inconsistencies

No inconstancies. This is well documented. There are lots of 8375's including 1Mbyte versions.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyLandy

I thought it was just the 8372A that was 1MB.

Nope, 8375 318069-16 & 318069-17 are both 1Mbyte

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyLandy

I've known people say they've had 2MB ChipRAM added to their board without changing the Agnus, but I cannot for the life of me find a photo of an r6.3+ A2000 board.

They must be using a MiniMegi chip.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyLandy

Maybe it is a myth that late-A2000s have 2MB Agnuses.

Not a myth I've ever heard.

rkauer · 29 June 2011, 04:38

There are some A2000 directly capable of 2Mb chip RAM. There a hack floating around guiding A2000 (rev6.x ONLY) to show how you can hack the board.

But it indeed requires an 8372AB Agnus.

hlide · 06 August 2018, 16:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by alexh

Yup, no R2 on it as I thought...

Need more examples of 8375 -16, 17, -18 and -19. Anyone help here?

Plus date codes from ANYONES Agnus to help work out some time lines.

P.S. Amythyst, while you've got your A500+ open, I'd take out the battery, or at least check it as they tend to leak!

The list looks wrong for me:

Agnus (1 MB) 8375VBB / 8375 R1 318069-16 A500 (PAL), A2000 (PAL)
Agnus (1 MB) 8375 318069-17 A500 (NTSC), A2000 (NTSC)
Agnus (2 MB) 8375 R0 318069-18 A500+ (PAL), A600 (PAL)
Agnus (2 MB) 8375 318069-19 A3000 (NTSC), A3000T (NTSC)

It should be:

Agnus (1 MB) 8375 318069-16 A500 (PAL), A2000 (PAL)
Agnus (1 MB) 8375 318069-17 A500 (NTSC), A2000 (NTSC)
Agnus (2 MB) 8375 318069-18 A3000 (PAL), A3000T (PAL)
Agnus (2 MB) 8375 318069-19 A3000 (NTSC), A3000T (NTSC)

See WC2633 here.

alexh · 06 August 2018, 19:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by hlide

It should be:
Agnus (2 MB) 8375 318069-18 A3000 (PAL), A3000T (PAL)

Absolutely. The original entry wasn't made by me, I never found all of the details 1st hand and those rework guides were not online.

Here is another :

https://www.amigawiki.org/lib/exe/fe...us-history.pdf

There are identical threads at other Amiga forums I used back in the day (Amiga.org and/or Amibay.com) which may contain extra information.

graffias79 · 06 August 2018, 19:58

Here's my A500's Agnus chip. This is on a DCE Mini Megi for 2MB chipram.

rvctech · 22 December 2018, 01:54

Hi Alex,
Appreciate your efforts on doing this all those years ago. I still refer to your list today!

If you're still maintaining the list, I'd like to suggest these corrections:

1. 8372 318069-02 -> This appears to be an 8372A rather than just 8372

2. The 1MB 8372 series is always PAL/NTSC switchable through an external pin, therefore there is no need to label it as a "PAL" version.

3. What does "changed after some damage" mean?? ;-) - I know that was on the BBoAH

31 December 2010, 06:25	#42
hexsane Posts: n/a	Agnus 8372A 318069-029 2MB I have some confusion about this part: Agnus (1 MB) 8372A 318069-029 A500 (PAL), A2000 (PAL) (changed after some damage) I have a Rev 6.2 A2000 The agnus part # is 8372A 318069-029 (9 is floating and some distance from the -02) Chip date is: 0990 Although you're reporting here this chip is 1MB SysInfo reports it as a 2MB. Bug in SysInfo or newly discovered information? Should I bother adding the additional 1MB of RAM to the motherboard or would it help confirm this as a 2MB chip? -Matt Last edited by hexsane; 31 December 2010 at 06:45.

31 December 2010, 13:30	#44
alexh Thalion Webshrine Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Oxford Posts: 14,354	The 8372A 318069-029 _is_ a 1Mbyte part. 99% sure this is a bug / limitation of the SysInfo software. It must not be possible to recognise that some 8372/8375 Agnus chips are 1Mbyte. Perhaps there is no way to differentiate? After all they are the same silicon, just bonded out differently. You cannot use a 2Mbyte part directly in an A2000 motherboard without an adapter like a MiniMegi / MegAChip. Last edited by alexh; 31 December 2010 at 13:35.

27 June 2011, 10:32	#50
AndyLandy Registered User Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Southampton / UK Posts: 91	If it helps, my A3000 is a late-revision board (9.02) and has Agnus part: C= CSG 8372B 2190 23 I'm led to believe that later-revision A2000s (r6.3-r6.5) have a 2MB Agnus on-board as standard, but only 1MB is populated on the board. I'd also like to know how much ChipRAM is on r4.x A2000 boards? I've gotten conflicting reports as to whether it's 512k Chip/512k Ranger, or 1MB Chip. Does the 8371 Agnus even support 1MB Chip? I don't think it does. Last edited by AndyLandy; 27 June 2011 at 10:40.

06 August 2018, 19:58	#58
graffias79 Registered User Join Date: Jul 2018 Location: Madison, WI, USA Posts: 69	Here's my A500's Agnus chip. This is on a DCE Mini Megi for 2MB chipram. Attached Thumbnails

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31 December 2010, 11:17	#43
cosmicfrog The 1 who ribbits Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: leek, Staffs, UK Age: 56 Posts: 3,557	sysinfo reports a 2MB angus in my a2000 rev 6.2 still havent had time to read the number of angnus if it is indeed true it makes doing the 2MB chipram mod easier

01 January 2011, 21:43	#47
rkauer I hate potatos and shirts Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Sao Leopoldo / Brazil Age: 58 Posts: 3,482	But the fact the user can hack the board dropping an 8375 Agnus (the only one that works!) directly on the Agnus socket of the A2000. I still want to hack a rev6 board this way to validate the idea. Thing is this Agnus is hard to get, even knowing A3000 Amigas use to die for nothing, leaving lots of spare parts...

01 January 2011, 22:29	#48
alexh Thalion Webshrine Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Oxford Posts: 14,354	Never seen an 8375 318069-19 in the flesh. I guess as you say they are very rare as A3000 came with a 2Mbyte Agnus so they probably made very few. The 8372 318069-03 is probably easier to find?

02 January 2011, 01:32	#49
rkauer I hate potatos and shirts Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Sao Leopoldo / Brazil Age: 58 Posts: 3,482	As far as I know, only the early A3000 Agnus is pin compatible with the A500/2000 Agnii, and even then not totally compatible as some signals are missing (read the hack on the link above). But for the solely purpose of making an A500/2000 capable of 2Mb chip RAM without a plug-in board, then it is perfect. So the model to search for still is the 8372AB, and maybe the 8375 318069-19. Like I said, I need to find a pair to hack a pair of boards to validate this. I know for sure this hack works on the rev6 A2000 as one Australian user did this to both A2000 he have.

27 June 2011, 10:54	#51
8bitbubsy Registered User Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Norway Posts: 1,711	8371 supports 512kB chip RAM max, so 4.x boards were populated with 8371 and 512kB chip/512kB fake-fast. I think 4.5 (at least 5.x) came with 8372A which can address 1MB, but I am uncertain if the 4.5 ones were setup with 1MB or with 512/512.

29 June 2011, 04:38	#55
rkauer I hate potatos and shirts Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Sao Leopoldo / Brazil Age: 58 Posts: 3,482	There are some A2000 directly capable of 2Mb chip RAM. There a hack floating around guiding A2000 (rev6.x ONLY) to show how you can hack the board. But it indeed requires an 8372AB Agnus.

22 December 2018, 01:54	#59
rvctech Registered User Join Date: Dec 2018 Location: Sydney / Australia Posts: 96	Hi Alex, Appreciate your efforts on doing this all those years ago. I still refer to your list today! If you're still maintaining the list, I'd like to suggest these corrections: 1. 8372 318069-02 -> This appears to be an 8372A rather than just 8372 2. The 1MB 8372 series is always PAL/NTSC switchable through an external pin, therefore there is no need to label it as a "PAL" version. 3. What does "changed after some damage" mean?? ;-) - I know that was on the BBoAH

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