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Old 12 May 2006, 13:18   #1
Paul
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Ideas of what to change/do next in WinUAE

Here are a couple of suggestions/ideas for future WinUAE updates

Idea 1:
When in windowed mode you press middle mouse button you can left click the systray icon to open the F12 gui.

When in fullscreen mode when you press middle button, winuae minimises but when you try to left click systray icon it just returns you back to emulation. Is it possible to make it work the same as in windowed mode? (I know you can right click but it would be good if it did open gui when you double left clicked)

Idea 2:
Record to wav/mp3/ogg: How about adding to Output properties a facility similar to video avi output but for Audio only.

When you click Audio you can select Wav, mp3 or ogg format

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Old 17 May 2006, 12:27   #2
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* Easier / more intuitive controller configuration... pretty please! It's actually a real pain to edit the controller settings

It would be so much better to just press a key (keyboard) or a button (controller) to assign it to a function instead of having to scrube throu this huge list that we actually have. And why not separate controller 1 from controller 2? Would be more digest.

* Some new enhanced pixels / filter : I have seen some very nice pixel filter on other emulator, sorry don't have the names in mind at the moment. I'll post them later.

* NTSC fix: Automaticaly strecth the NTSC screen height to ~106.7 % (and vice-versa)... just like on my Amiga =)

* Scalable configuration windows.

* Hide LEDs from the window border when "show LEDs" is enabled.

* A "Basic" and an "Advanced" GUI mode so users who actually do not spend their time tweaking WinUAE can also understand something. =)

Because at that time I don't see how someone who is not VERY familar with the Amiga AND WinUAE can really use it. There is too much options and some of them are really too obscurs.

* In a more general way I really think WinUAE needs to get better on the GUI part, not that it bad but it's a bit bloated and not so intuitive.

Last edited by z00mba; 17 May 2006 at 12:32.
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Old 17 May 2006, 12:36   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by z00mba

* A "Basic" and an "Advanced" GUI mode so users who actually do not spend their time tweaking WinUAE can also understand something. =)

Because at that time I don't see how someone who is not VERY familar with the Amiga AND WinUAE can really use it. There is too much options and some of them are really too obscurs.
Quickstart is the answer here
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Old 17 May 2006, 13:41   #4
Toni Wilen
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Quote:
Idea 1:
DirectDraw "feature". Screen is still there (it is only hidden) and all actions that causes WinUAE to get focus will result in fullscreen window re-appearing. Fixing this needs completely different way of handling ALT-TAB. Maybe I'll rewrite it for Vista if it really has much better API (of course it will stay compatible with older Windows versions)

Quote:
Idea 2:
Audio compression: if someone does it. (without requiring and huge static libraries etc stupid) I am not really interested in that.

Quote:
Easier / more intuitive controller configuration... pretty please! It's actually a real pain to edit the controller settings
Will happen someday. It isn't so easy as you think, WinUAE allows mapping <Amiga-side anything> to <PC-side anything>, not just simple map <PC-side something> to <Amiga-side joysticks> like with console emulators.

Quote:
Some new enhanced pixels / filter : I have seen some very nice pixel filter on other emulator, sorry don't have the names in mind at the moment. I'll post them later.
Three problems:

1: most are designed for small 8-bit console resolutions (maybe 512x256 or so max) and they will be really slow with Amiga resolutions.
2: miss "pitch"/"stride" support (hq2x for example) UAE's filter code requires it.
3: some have incompatible license

Quote:
NTSC fix: Automaticaly strecth the NTSC screen height to ~106.7 % (and vice-versa)... just like on my Amiga =)
Unfortunately this results in scaling artifacts. Basically possible but i'd left it for user to do the scaling because automatic scaling may not be the best for everyone. Maybe build-in "NTSC" filter-preset is good enough solution.

Quote:
Scalable configuration windows.
Windows basic controls don't really support scaling easily and I really hate GUI programming. (and no, I am not going to rewrite it with any nice GUI toolkit either)

Quote:
Hide LEDs from the window border when "show LEDs" is enabled.
Why? Windows border leds can be used for drag&dropping disk images, open the GUI etc..

Quote:
Because at that time I don't see how someone who is not VERY familar with the Amiga AND WinUAE can really use it. There is too much options and some of them are really too obscurs.
Use Quickstart or some frontend.
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Old 17 May 2006, 20:10   #5
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MMU support for WHDLoad

That's it. Kind of MMU support for WHDLoad to be able to log custom chips and detect illegal memory accesses from within HRTMon
(we already talked about this)
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Old 17 May 2006, 21:30   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul
Here are a couple of suggestions/ideas for future WinUAE updates

Idea 1:
When in windowed mode you press middle mouse button you can left click the systray icon to open the F12 gui.
press middle mouse button to "free" it from the "Amiga" screen, then click on 'Power'. Cool, eh?
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Old 17 May 2006, 21:45   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toni Wilen
Quote:
Because at that time I don't see how someone who is not VERY familar with the Amiga AND WinUAE can really use it. There is too much options and some of them are really too obscurs.
Use Quickstart or some frontend.
Umm, that's a bad answer.

I would favor a beginner mode and an expert mode, that is, you do not have to rewrite whole gui, but just MASK OUT the stuff which no beginner needs, and which would only cause additional confusion, such as:

[CPU]
- CPU idle
- More accurate FPU
- JIT OPTIONS!! (who would even *know* what to "adjust" here?)

[Chipset]
- Collision level: keep Sprites & Sprites vs. Playfield and Full ONLY

[ROM]
- Map Rom emulation & ShapeShifter checkboxes
- Cartridge ROM file & Flash RAM file

[Hard drives]
- Add Hard DRIVE (this is for experts only)
- Include network drives

[Display]
- Correct aspect (very ancient option, will usually override *good* (!) settings if enabled)

[Sound]
- Stereo separation
- Interpolation
- Mixing delay
- Audio driver lag compensation

[Game & IO ports]

- Parallel Port
- Serial Port
- MIDI!!

[Input]
- completely! (User may use Game & IO ports settings in basic mode)

[Output]
- completely! (For freaks only)

[Filter]
- completely!

[Disk swapper]
- completely!

[Misc]
- Don't show taskbar button
- SPTI
- Catweasel
- Keyboard LEDs
- Logging!!

"Priority" might be necessary, as to this day I cannot run most demos fluently without 'Above normal' setting, maybe with a 3 GHz power-eating monster it would be possible, but that is not an option for me atm...

Last edited by andreas; 17 May 2006 at 21:51.
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Old 17 May 2006, 22:14   #8
Toni Wilen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andreas
but just MASK OUT the stuff which no beginner needs, and which would only cause additional confusion, such as:
No. There will be toooooo many different opinions and questions and requests to add/remove option X because of reason Y from user Z.
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Old 17 May 2006, 22:57   #9
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Well, your decision. But don't say I haven't warned you in time
Alternatively, let people vote

For beginners I agree with other guys that it's simply TOO cluttered as it is now.
And some options really will hardly ever be used by a beginner. I'm really no (!) beginner, but in several months, I either haven't touched the default settings of Sound or Filter in any minute because there was no need, let alone Input settings: tweaking mouse speed will usually cause old(er) programs to go mad and to malfunction, so if you just CAN-NOT HELP changing it, do change it in expert mode, but leave this out in beginner mode.

And are there soooo many people who would use ShapeShifter every day so that it MUST be displayed at any cost in beginner mode? I think not even two dozen in fact...
And how many people have a Catweasel so that they really MUST have this in beginner mode too? As Catweasel users are usually experienced nonetheless, they would change to expert mode, so no argument to keep it in.

And about Quickstart ... I did try them, most of them at least.
"A1200 - *LOW* compatibility"!
CPU was always at 100% because of Fastest Possible preset. No thanks!
CPU->Chipset to 4 (Bernd's recommended default setting) and CPU calmed down. Some other applications *might* have a right to work parallelly, mightn't they?

I also do not see a point why JIT is on in A1200 *low* compatibility mode, very strange ... with most AGA games and demos, it will only cause side-effects which you maybe do not want.

Lastly: Beginner and expert modes could also be made customizable by user.
This would solve the "different users - different opinions" problem. Windows programs do/did this by INI files with maybe a [beginner] and an [expert] section, with each and every section customizable and pre-defined on fresh installation. You could maybe offer a small number of alternative mode configuration INI files on the WinUAE web page, so that every user can pick his most suitable one. And if he really does not accept ANY of those, he should make his own one. Plain and simple!

(Sorry for the long post...)

Last edited by andreas; 17 May 2006 at 23:11.
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Old 18 May 2006, 03:28   #10
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Quote:
Three problems:

1: most are designed for small 8-bit console resolutions (maybe 512x256 or so max) and they will be really slow with Amiga resolutions.
2: miss "pitch"/"stride" support (hq2x for example) UAE's filter code requires it.
3: some have incompatible license
That's the one I had in mind:
http://scale2x.sourceforge.net/

Now I'm not technical enough to know if it could fit into WinUAE. As when speed is involved, I don't know but for instance the actual DirectX filter is unusable on my system because it's too slow so I just don't use it. So maybe for users for wich it will be too slow they just have to not use it (yeah I'm cruel I know)

License: I didn't even think about it... oups

Quote:
Unfortunately this results in scaling artifacts. Basically possible but i'd left it for user to do the scaling because automatic scaling may not be the best for everyone. Maybe build-in "NTSC" filter-preset is good enough solution.
I hear you.

Quote:
Windows basic controls don't really support scaling easily and I really hate GUI programming. (and no, I am not going to rewrite it with any nice GUI toolkit either)
OK =)

Quote:
Why? Windows border leds can be used for drag&dropping disk images, open the GUI etc..
I didn't know. Anyway that was just a really small detail not really important.

Quote:
Use Quickstart or some frontend.
Quickstart: Yes that was a good start
Frontend: Installing and managing two apps instead, in my mind, isn't really making things easier. And what will happend when the frontend will not support a special game? Or when a new version of WinUAE will be released wich is not compatible with this frontend? etc...

I think andreas stated well what I think about how it should/could be.

NB: Personnaly I don't need such feature, nor to use a front-end.
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Old 18 May 2006, 09:38   #11
Toni Wilen
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Quote:
I also do not see a point why JIT is on in A1200 *low* compatibility mode, very strange ... with most AGA games and demos, it will only cause side-effects which you maybe do not want.
_Low_ compatibility = side-effects etc are possible. I don't see anything wrong with this option.

Maybe you should check filter-panel before posting your suggestion
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Old 18 May 2006, 11:43   #12
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Brill ideas guys!

How about self-executing Configuration game files?

At the moment, selecting a game config file within Windows just opens the Configurations Tab in WinUAE.... but not with the config file I selected. Be great to be able to just to double-click on my newly created game config file and the game boots bypassing WinUAE front-end. Would this feature be difficult to implement?

ps I'm fully aware of the program Lemonade. I just thought it would be good to do self-boot games without the need of other applications being installed and keeping WinUAE as the all-in-one killer emulating app.

Last edited by quahappy; 18 May 2006 at 11:54.
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Old 18 May 2006, 13:44   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toni Wilen
Maybe you should check filter-panel before posting your suggestion
Oh my god... lol

I don't know why I thought it's different than the one in WinUAE (btw it's the filter I use the most). Silly me.

I'm really confused about HQ2x/HQ4x implement not being possible in WinUAE tho. I thought the filter is the vert last layer to apply to the display so I believed it doesn't need anything else than the image datas. Why it's not the case?

I must admit HQ2x/HQ4x offer a great quality. I tested it yesterday for a remix of an old game I'm working on (I'm only doing GFX, not coding) and I managed to process some background image of the game with it. The result was amazing and offer me a very good basis to work on the graphics now.
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Old 18 May 2006, 22:44   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by z00mba
I'm really confused about HQ2x/HQ4x implement not being possible in WinUAE tho. I thought the filter is the vert last layer to apply to the display so I believed it doesn't need anything else than the image datas. Why it's not the case?
WinUAE internally creates following bitmap when in filter-modes:

...........................
........xxxxxxxx........
........xxxxxxxx........

. = empty space.
x = "real" display that only needs filtering. Filtering whole internal display would be 3x slower..

It is needed for size/position adjustments or display would "wrap around" if WinUAE's display window is bigger than emulated window. Of course it is possible to use some copy blits to create same effect but it would only cause even more slow downs...

HQ-filter don't support this kind of display layout. All other filters support this very common feature.
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Old 18 May 2006, 22:57   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quahappy
How about self-executing Configuration game files?
Something like this will happen someday..

In theory you could specify a way to include configuration data with disk images. IMO data must only contain supported Amiga model(s), memory configuration (slowram required? 1M chip ram required etc), Kickstart version (any KS, KS1.x only, must be KS1.2 rev33.166, single or multiple drives supported, etc..)

Problems:

- adf is "standard" and it is impossible to extend it. (regular 880k version, not extended adfs)
- Some games need multiple configurations (for example game that works without AGA but has AGA improvements)

IMHO only working solution is to map image's CRC32/MD5/SHA1/whatever to separate configuration data.

btw, there is already configuration file option to support autodetected KS ROMs using version numbers etc (kickstart_rom=v<ver>[.<rev>] [r<subver>.<subrev>] [<model>])
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Old 20 May 2006, 12:14   #16
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I think BippyM already suggested something like that... To add some sort of "ID3" tag to an adf for aditional information (TOSEC options) but WinUAE startup options is also a brilliant suggestion
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Old 20 May 2006, 18:19   #17
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yeah I did but it was met with resistence!

A simple tag in the file that winuae checks for.. On Amiga side an ADF program could be written that does the same.

The tag could hold all manner of info from length of image (in kb etc) to filname, publisher, developer etc..

Still there is a thread on eab already for this so go read that if interested
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Old 22 May 2006, 09:57   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toni Wilen
IMHO only working solution is to map image's CRC32/MD5/SHA1/whatever to separate configuration data.
hmmm another TOSEC dat-like file for someone to maintain. Still it could be done and if the file was online WinUAE could be set to check it periodically to DL updates if file isnt too big?
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Old 22 May 2006, 18:32   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quahappy
How about self-executing Configuration game files?
You can do this already in Windows by associating the .uae file type with WinUAE, and then disabling "Show GUI" in each config file you save (once you have it exactly the way you want it) to prevent the GUI from appearing when you double click the config. I've been doing this for years, and if your config has the disk swapper panel loaded up with the adf's you want in the proper drives, then everything works like a charm.
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Old 22 May 2006, 22:39   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuckles
You can do this already in Windows by associating the .uae file type with WinUAE, and then disabling "Show GUI" in each config file you save (once you have it exactly the way you want it) to prevent the GUI from appearing when you double click the config. I've been doing this for years, and if your config has the disk swapper panel loaded up with the adf's you want in the proper drives, then everything works like a charm.
Very, very nice Chuckles!

And there's me thinking I've explored all in WinUAE..... just one little box - unticked.

Slam Tilt is now in my Start Menu!
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