English Amiga Board


Go Back   English Amiga Board > Main > Nostalgia & memories

 
 
Thread Tools
Old 08 November 2019, 01:08   #1
markpjd
Games-Coffer

markpjd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: London / England
Posts: 131
Lightbulb Game difficulty between then and now?

Hi all,

So I fired up a couple of emulators today, namely the C64 and WinUAE. I started playing Treasure Island Dizzy on the C64 and was looking at the differences between that version and the Amiga version.

I realised that you get one life in Treasure Island Dizzy, so you could go an hour into the game, die, and that's the end of it! (no save games in those days!).

Which makes me think. Were games actually a lot harder/challenging than the games of today? I'll be honest, I don't play a lot of modern games these days.

Do you think that games of the past required more brain power and endurance?
markpjd is offline  
Old 08 November 2019, 01:38   #2
Cherno
Registered User
Cherno's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Dortmund, Germany
Posts: 762
Quite a complex topic. there are different aspects to it.
Games back then were often times a direct conversion or at least inspired by Arcade games, where a game had to be hard so a player would throw his quarters in into the machine many, many times before he could beat it. This spirit held on even when games became more than one-room-per-level affairs and more complex storylines were introduced. Then there's the fact that videogames were commonly developed by one or two persons, maybe a sound guy as well. There was little in the way of game development best practices and developers were often bad business people so they didn't give customer satisfaction too much thought. As teams became larger, budgets rose and publishers became more involved in the design process to make sure their investment would bring back profits (of course, there were, and are, still more than enough bad games released!). Today, games might be just as hard as back then, but failure is not as punishing since you can often respawn right were your character died, you might even have a quicksave feature, or at least one or more save points throughout a level, The popular "Iron Man" game modes with permadeath are normally only selectable once you have beaten the game on normal difficulty to prevent frustrating a new player who may have chosen it by accident. Roguelikes are a different story but I don't like them anyway

Edit: You could also argue that the "trial and error" gameplay (*cough* Rick Dangerous *cough* Leisrue Suit Larry *cough*) is a thing of the past for good reasons.
Cherno is offline  
Old 08 November 2019, 09:44   #3
Steril707
Tigerskunk!

Steril707's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Amiga Island
Posts: 1,048
Modern games should have a nice difficulty curve.
Means, in the first level you should just get accustomed to the game play. You shouldn't need more than two to three tries to get through the first level.

After that you slowly increase difficulty, until around 2/3s of the game you start to crush the player...
Steril707 is offline  
Old 08 November 2019, 13:45   #4
lordofchaos
TinkerTailorContentMaker

lordofchaos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Bedfordshire
Age: 41
Posts: 1,113
Modern games are definitely easier to finish than the old ones, design and the need for player satisfaction taken a lot more seriously, plus it's a more mature industry with many lessons being adapted and shared.

Reasons for not completing modern games usually = Boredom
lordofchaos is offline  
Old 08 November 2019, 15:49   #5
gimbal
cheeky scoundrel
gimbal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Spijkenisse/Netherlands
Age: 38
Posts: 3,437
Modern AAA games surely, but modern indie games can still bite a chunk out of your bum and then offer it back to you as a snack. By design.
gimbal is offline  
Old 08 November 2019, 15:51   #6
funK
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: ItAlien
Posts: 140
Depends on the game.
There are modern games that still follow the 'simple to learn but hard to master' arcades rule, but unlike many of past games they now are actually fair, so if you've got patience to learn the mechanics, the levels and/or the enemy patterns as soon as you manage to up your skills they suddenly become easier than everything released back then (Soulsborne series & clones, many indie games such as Spelunky, Celeste, Cuphead, ...).
Those kind of games are unfortunately the minority, though, so I agree that most of modern games are basically just interactive movies, at least when played at normal difficulty and below.
funK is offline  
Old 08 November 2019, 16:14   #7
Photon
Moderator

Photon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Eksjö / Sweden
Posts: 4,771
Quote:
Originally Posted by markpjd View Post
Hi all,

So I fired up a couple of emulators today, namely the C64 and WinUAE. I started playing Treasure Island Dizzy on the C64 and was looking at the differences between that version and the Amiga version.

I realised that you get one life in Treasure Island Dizzy, so you could go an hour into the game, die, and that's the end of it! (no save games in those days!).

Which makes me think. Were games actually a lot harder/challenging than the games of today? I'll be honest, I don't play a lot of modern games these days.

Do you think that games of the past required more brain power and endurance?
There are modern retro-looking games or remakes that are infuriatingly difficult, e.g. Jump King. And Tetris/Guitar Hero type games that are Jeff Minter-stressful and unforgiving.

You can also find a challenge in online shooters and Starcraft/Diablo type games that have no real upper limit.

Today, games that hold your hand and/or let you play at your own pace are called 'casual', e.g. Minecraft. You can also play most of them casually, or "go for it".



There are also speedruns, and this is a mode that can be used for any game however basic, because it's like a scoreboard; the game doesn't really matter.


So if someone thinks older games are harder, that's true for some of them, mostly arcade action. The games haven't changed, only you and any peripherals. So check first that you have quick reflexes still, and that you have nothing that impairs you such as a weird or wonky joystick, screen or interface with input lag, or a screen with blurry motion. Emulation adds input lag.
Photon is offline  
Old 08 November 2019, 18:53   #8
th4t1guy
Registered User
th4t1guy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Kansas City, MO, USA
Posts: 624
I think a lot of modern games are designed more around casino/gambling style games where there is a seemingly larger reward for winning, and relatively small penalty for losing.
The win/lose ratio is then adjusted so that dopamine hit you get while winning has the maximum effect and keeps you coming back for more. This is why you see lot of "unlocks", and tier-grouped rewards in gameplay these days.
th4t1guy is offline  
Old 08 November 2019, 19:47   #9
Fiery Phoenix
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Bury, Lancs
Posts: 126
Quick saves have made modern games so much easier
Fiery Phoenix is offline  
Old 08 November 2019, 21:25   #10
markpjd
Games-Coffer

markpjd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: London / England
Posts: 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherno View Post
Edit: You could also argue that the "trial and error" gameplay (*cough* Rick Dangerous *cough* Leisrue Suit Larry *cough*) is a thing of the past for good reasons.
Yes, I have noticed this in quite a few games. There are cases in some games where you would not know that a gap or monster was going to be there, unless you had a crystal ball. However, upon replaying it, you then know the next time how to deal with that situation. I guess this kind of helps your memory
markpjd is offline  
Old 08 November 2019, 21:45   #11
markpjd
Games-Coffer

markpjd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: London / England
Posts: 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by th4t1guy View Post
I think a lot of modern games are designed more around casino/gambling style games where there is a seemingly larger reward for winning, and relatively small penalty for losing.
The win/lose ratio is then adjusted so that dopamine hit you get while winning has the maximum effect and keeps you coming back for more. This is why you see lot of "unlocks", and tier-grouped rewards in gameplay these days.
Very true. Which probably made a whole load of marketing people working for these companies to think.......

*Ah*... *I know*....

PAY-PER-WIN!

but I guess that's a whole other subject in its own right!
markpjd is offline  
 


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Mortal Kombat II - Insane difficulty? lordofchaos support.Games 27 13 December 2017 21:09
Little Dragon 2 - Arcade ZX Spectrum release with high difficulty! Neil79 Retrogaming General Discussion 0 13 April 2015 00:02
What difficulty level do you usually play games on? Shoonay Retrogaming General Discussion 35 05 January 2015 01:05
sound-difficulty GratedTopping support.WinUAE 5 04 October 2013 09:03
What difficulty is needed to see the full ending in Fightin' Spirit? Ironclaw Retrogaming General Discussion 6 19 August 2006 23:57

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 01:37.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Page generated in 0.07297 seconds with 14 queries