04 November 2019, 14:36 | #21 | |
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NumPy for example has excellent and very fast modules that are very well suited for all kinds of heavy calculations. It is a valuable tool for researchers and engineers all over the world. Python is probably best suited for an interactive work-book like environment and helps you to get results fast and makes it easy to try things out ... But Python is not meant to program a game or application. |
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04 November 2019, 14:42 | #22 |
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@ meynaf -
Did you program anything in Python? What is your Python experience?? If no and none, then you are just trolling. May I suggest nice introduction to computer science and programming using Python class @ edx.org (done by MIT) https://www.edx.org/course/6-00-1x-i...using-python-4 Anyone interested in good class that covers many good practice aspects of programming class - this is well up to date class (there is follow up class with more advanced techniques). Free to try / with option to get certificate if interested... |
04 November 2019, 14:47 | #23 |
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@ meynaf
P.S.: are you sure you did read that I wrote Cython and not Python in my statement? If Cython is slow, than every C code is slow ... and that would rule out any language besides assembler. |
04 November 2019, 15:24 | #24 |
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Python can be very fast language - in the sense that you're often able to write a program to solve your problem in considerably shorter time than it is possible in e.g. C++, thanks to the features of the language and a rich choice of powerful libraries especially for scientific applications.
So if it is "fast" for you depends on the ratio of time spend during programming vs. the execution time (real time applications etc. notwithstanding). I really like to use it for data evaluation (and libraries like Numpy o Pandas etc. aren't even particularly slow here), smaller one-off tasks that just need to be solved, interactive programming... or just for prototyping, to check if some algorithm is feasible for my problem before implementing it in some compiled language. And in that role it is very fast for me. |
04 November 2019, 17:15 | #25 | ||
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Do someone need to have done anything but read the docs to know this language isn't better than any other ? Knowing many other languages - with asm in the middle - should suffice anyway. One can't compare without a good reference. What could be your experience in this domain ? I don't need to know, but ask yourself. Quote:
IOW, automatic conversion of something to C doesn't make it as fast as C (in the same way compiling something to asm doesn't make it as fast as asm). Oh, of course i might also say that any language beside assembler is slow but that's not the point |
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04 November 2019, 17:51 | #26 | |
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Also any modules/libraries like NumPy, SciPy etc. contain compiled and optimized functions and are therefor fast. So what is a good programming language in your opinion besides assembler? |
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04 November 2019, 18:53 | #27 | |
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Sure, programming in assembly is far better (?) and all you need is few languages that can be used around it. That is why everything now day is programmed in assembly , right?? We are pass time when programmer's main job was to find a way to run program fast enough to work for specific task or have enough memory/resources to run / be compiled. My only assembly experience is following assy tutorial here on EAB/youtube and it surely is something I like to do as hobby, but would never want to do anything similar as main job. Makes me wonder what you think of Java and Kotlin. Should we program Android and iOS in assy?? |
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04 November 2019, 19:25 | #28 | ||
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04 November 2019, 19:28 | #29 | |||||||
son of 68k
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Does the language itself really matter that much ? No. When you know how to code, unless of severe design mistakes in the language it does not matter. Quote:
I tried to create mine, but all attempts failed. Quote:
But you are overestimating how much i may dislike Python. I don't dislike it more than any other language. I just don't agree to people saying it's a pure wonder : it ain't better than the others. Quote:
Remember that everything today is basically far, very far away, from theoretical max performance the machine is supposed to procure. Quote:
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I won't answer to this. Wouldn't be polite Considering the cpu architecture these have to run on, the answer is a big 'no'. But if you can spend millions of $$$ to build a 68k-based handheld device, then i'd happily do asm on it. |
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04 November 2019, 19:44 | #30 | ||||
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If this is not your major concern, what is it then? Quote:
yes, I think it matters. Quote:
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(I wonder why KI and machine learning don't give us the perfect compilers ... probably because these are just buzz words) I understand the need of something fairly small and fast in the case of Amiga - even accelerated or emulated ones. Still I think Python as a language would be up for the task (see MicroPython and StacklessPython), delivering a useful scripting language in addition to AREXX. |
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04 November 2019, 20:03 | #31 | ||
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04 November 2019, 20:21 | #32 | |||||
son of 68k
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But in practice nothing can really be considered as expressive, easy to read, helpful nor intuitive... It's not without reason code is named "code". Perhaps we could do some kind of code contest, just to show how different languages look like for the exact same task ? Concrete examples always say more than just talking. This would be, however, in another thread as we're already quite OT here. Quote:
However, sometimes a language just plain sucks. I want a language that can be used for any possible task a computer can do. I want a language that is good at bit fiddling. A language that can easily detect arithmetic carry/overflows. A language that does not do things behind my back. One that has an easy way to provide a simple frame buffer instead of having to use dubious external libraries. Quote:
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And then i admit it does not interest me that much. |
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04 November 2019, 20:25 | #34 |
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Excuse my ignorance on this python topic but why not using à langage provided with the OS ?
Is python doing things ARexx can't ? Edit: Damn, Gorf posted before me |
04 November 2019, 20:35 | #35 |
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04 November 2019, 20:37 | #36 | |||||||||
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http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Rosetta_Code I find Python much better in every way than "brainfuck" ... Quote:
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04 November 2019, 20:50 | #37 | |
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It lacks system integration, so AREXX can do some things on AmigaOS Python can not do - unless someone creates a system-module. On MorphOS this has been done for Lua, so there is no reason it can't be done for Python, except probably no-one will ever do so... Python aims at different goals than AREXX, is more "modern" ... main difference would obviously be, that for AREXX everything is a string, while for Python everything is an object. A Python tutorial was already linked above ... try it out in a browser for yourself: https://mybinder.org/v2/gh/ipython/i...er/Index.ipynb |
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04 November 2019, 20:50 | #38 |
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I might go completely OT and suggest lua as scripting language, at least has some ties with AROS, considered its bindings (incomplete) with gadtools (amilua) and zune (zulu)
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04 November 2019, 20:55 | #39 | |
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But this is not a question of either or. |
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04 November 2019, 21:20 | #40 | |||
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And it probably does not allow using own libraries. So no, it hasn't been done before. Probably not difficult And how does a language qualify for being "appropriate" ? Quote:
There are lots of possible tasks, if you really want me to suggest some. Show an IFF image ? Play a Protracker module ? Execute some custom bytecode ? Do some file format conversion ? Or perhaps something simpler, like a custom atoi() function ? Quote:
There is none and it's too bad because i would have a lot of fun beating the crap out of it I haven't said otherwise but you were speaking about compilers. No, but i could if i wanted to. Did you write a python version of your startup-sequence ? |
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