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Old 28 September 2018, 15:05   #2741
AMIGASYSTEM
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Mark sealey your icons have no problem, tested on OS 3.1 + Icon.library 46.500

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Old 28 September 2018, 15:54   #2742
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Hmmm ok...seems like a hardware issue.....I'll ground the Furia and knock off 20meg on the last partition....im using v45.4 library btw
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Old 28 September 2018, 16:30   #2743
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Who needs HAM8 in 2018? I don't know, not me, but it was ThorHAM who asked for it in 2014.
It's been that long already? Wow

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He was looking around here some days ago, but did not give any feedback yet.
I most certainly will once I try the new version. One thing though: HAM6
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Old 28 September 2018, 16:39   #2744
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No sorry Retrofan, but the idea of a wallpaper in HAM colors was just some unrealistic wishful thinking. I guess, that can not work with the existing abilities of the AGA chipset, but I'm not an expert for AGA hardware.
The chipset isn't the problem, but rather the way Workbench works. To render everything properly, you have to keep a lot of extra data around to be able to blit over the backdrop properly. Not much of a performance issue, but getting it to work with Workbench seems challenging, if not impossible, without dirty hacks.
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Old 28 September 2018, 17:41   #2745
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Hmmm ok...seems like a hardware issue.....I'll ground the Furia and knock off 20meg on the last partition....im using v45.4 library btw
Yes, it might be the Furia or the card, maybe they don't like each other.

When I saw your videos I was already wondering at the v45 in the title, but I thought it could just be a typo. I would suggest you to try my library v46.4 instead, although I won't expect the v45.4 to be the culprit.


@Thorham
A new HAM8 version with correct looking system, MWB and mouse colors may come in a few hours, but a HAM6 version could need another 4 years ... The problem with HAM6 is that you have only 16 base colors and on ECS it even needs LowRes screens. How ugly should that look, LowRes icons with 16 base colors?

My opinion is that HAM backdrops and HAM icons would need one independent HAM register for every layer to hold the color of the previous pixel in that layer. I don't believe that there is more than one of these registers available, and that's not enough IMHO.
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Old 28 September 2018, 18:52   #2746
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A new HAM8 version with correct looking system, MWB and mouse colors may come in a few hours
Cool, I'll wait a while and try that version

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The problem with HAM6 is that you have only 16 base colors and on ECS it even needs LowRes screens.
HAM6 does work in hires on AGA, though. Quality should be better than you think in hires

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My opinion is that HAM backdrops and HAM icons would need one independent HAM register for every layer to hold the color of the previous pixel in that layer. I don't believe that there is more than one of these registers available, and that's not enough IMHO.
That's not needed. The HAM pixel corrections can be done in software. Like I said, the problem is with Workbench, and now that I think about it, Intuition.library and Graphics.library.

HAM doesn't have any limitations in terms of layers, other than the quality and speed of the HAM fringing corrections when blitting over a background.

Then there's also the possibility of simply rendering everything as true color and converting the parts of the screen that changed to HAM, but how to make that OS compatible and keep it fast?
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Old 28 September 2018, 21:48   #2747
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Update to icon.library 46.4.501 HM020:

The new HM020 version uses only 48 base colors plus the pens 0-12 now. The system, MWB and mouse pointer colors are set to their default values and are looking as usual again. All 64 pens of the HAM8 palette are still locked and only the mouse colors pen 17-19 are not used for the HAM icons.

Please, install the new FullPalette.prefs file into ENVARC:Sys (nowhere else) and call FPPrefs after IPrefs in your startup-sequence. You can either use MUIScreenModePrefs to select and activate a HAM8 screenmode with 64 base colors or click on one of my screenmode icons, if you have the required monitor drivers already installed.

The funny WBDock tool written by Thomas Rapp is supported in color mapping mode now. This nice little thing makes a lot of fun.

Update to icon.library 46.4.502 HM020:

Nothing new. Just some small code optimizations. Removed a loop that was left over from build 500.


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Quote:
HAM6 does work in hires on AGA, though. Quality should be better than you think in hires
Yes, I know, but even HAM8 with only 27 base colors was already looking poor. HAM6 is probably faster, but HAM rendering causes only a few percent of the overall CPU load in the HM020 code.

Maybe it's possible in theory to avoid HAM glitches of backdrops with software, but only the blitter or copper could do that with more HAM registers on the fly in realtime without too much effort (CPU load). I would at least prefer a hardware solution.

Last edited by PeterK; 29 September 2018 at 03:07.
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Old 29 September 2018, 18:34   #2748
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Something happened from 500 to 502 HAM8, all my OS3.5 format icons are now black silhouettes until I select them, selected icons looks fine. Ideas?

Edit: correction, it seems like original/mwb icons look ok, while all other icons are black.

Last edited by kolla; 29 September 2018 at 18:39.
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Old 29 September 2018, 19:47   #2749
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Hmm, yes the first image of every ColorIcon is just black now (to save the time for colormapping) until it should finally be overwritten with a HAM8 image by my gfx patch.

I've tested a lot here under WinUAE to see whether there are any black icons appearing, but I only see a black RamDisk in the first moment after Workbench opens, which is replaced by the HAM8 image immediately.

So, I need more information about your screenmode and WB version, are CGX or P96 installed or just the basic AGA. Does it happen only for icons on the WB desktop or also in windows? Does it occur only directly after a screenmode change or also after a reboot?

Update:

I just noticed that I get some of these black icons and also problems with the WB menu when I disable FBlit, which I never tried before. Something seems not to be in ChipMem in that case. ... No, the problem is that the system is running out of ChipMem very soon without FBlit installed.

Seems to be only a problem with OS 3.5+ in AGA mode without P96 or CGX installed, then I get the same issue, with or without FBlit. It does not happen on plain OS 3.1, neither on OS 3.9 with P96.

On a plain OS 3.9 without P96 installed I get the same issues that you reported, and even HM020 v500 does not show HAM8 images, only color mapped icons. So what is going wrong with a plain OS 3.9 displaying HAM screenmodes? A plain OS 3.1 can do it and OS 3.9 + P96, too.

What a nice bug is that now?
workbench.library v44+ does not work correctly with HAM8 modes when graphics.library is used directly.
workbench.library v44+ works correctly with HAM8 modes when graphics.library is patched by P96.
workbench.library v40 works correctly with HAM8 modes when graphics.library is used directly, even on OS 3.9 without P96!
Quote:
Kolla: I *think* HAM WB backdrop works with OS3.1 workbench.library and a HAM capable datatype. It was one of the few things that randomly stopped working with OS3.5+, if I remember correctly.
Conclusion: either use WB 3.1 or install P96 to get its graphics.library patches. No FBlit, in the latter case. I have doubts that I can solve this problem in my code.

Last edited by PeterK; 29 September 2018 at 23:12.
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Old 30 September 2018, 01:28   #2750
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Yes, sounds like workbench.library terrritory?
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Old 30 September 2018, 07:51   #2751
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Eeehh... Your new beta is working great with DOPus5 and ...SuperPlus (¿?). Come on. Also WBDock working perfect as you've said (¿?). I see a much better use of the existing colors in my setup. The backdrops in my windows were looking bad to be true, but now they look very nice. Anyway a dedicated wallpaper will be necessary I suposse. I've only tried the one I was using that now looks different but I'll try others.

I'll test more tomorrow as it has been improved too much

My former wallpaper now looks more or less like it was looking in a normal 16 or more colors setup without HAM. To be honest now it looks better.
Screenshot of a DOPus5 setup using SuperPlus:



I don't know if you remember how bad it was looking before. Ahem.. I see that I didn't want to show the backdrops in the windows because they were awful. It's incredible what you've done. Now it isn't that those backdrops look decent; they look like having RTG as you can see

Last edited by Retrofan; 01 October 2018 at 03:32.
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Old 30 September 2018, 09:47   #2752
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Eeehh... Your new beta is working great with DOPus5 and ...SuperPlus (¿?). Come on.
SuperPlus and HighGFX under DOpus5 are giving me lots of recoverable memory gurus, but it works with MemTrailer.

Quote:
Also WBDock working perfect as you've said (¿?). I see a much better use of the existing colors in my setup. The backdrops in my windows were looking bad to be true, but now they look very nice. Anyway a dedicated wallpaper will be necessary I suposse. I've only tried the one I was using that now looks different but I'll try others.
Yes, there is an exception from HAM mode for WBDock now. -- The palette for the backdrops in HAM8_baseCMAP.iff has changed completely, so you need to optimize your colors again. The default MWB colors are integrated into that palette now.

Btw, your screenshot hoster just shows a "bad gateway" error for my connection.
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Old 30 September 2018, 11:36   #2753
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Btw, your screenshot hoster just shows a "bad gateway" error for my connection.
Peter i have no problem viewing screenshot hoster !
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Old 30 September 2018, 12:43   #2754
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Peter i have no problem viewing screenshot hoster !
Yes, now it works here, too. Maybe the gateway was offline for a short time.

Carlo, I know now why you never got HAM8 icons on your OS 3.9. My gfxpatch receives no blitter calls from workbench.library v44+ without P96 installed for HAM8 screenmodes. I'm analyzing this issue at the moment to find a possible workaround.
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Old 30 September 2018, 20:15   #2755
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Update to icon.library 46.4.503 HM020:

Important bugfix: I made a stupid little mistake concerning HAM8 support in my Open() function. The required gfxpatch was only installed for WB 3.0/3.1 or when cybergfx.library was loaded before by P96 or CGX. Thus, on WB 3.5+ without cybergfx,.library my HAM8 conversion for the NewIcons, ColorIcons, OS4 and PNG icons did never work before. I'm sorry for confusing and disappointing many users.
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Old 30 September 2018, 20:19   #2756
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No problem PeterK, every experience however enriches our knowledge.
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Old 01 October 2018, 00:41   #2757
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What I don't understand now is how it worked for me on my MiST with .500 and HAM, without p96 installed. With .502 it works if uaegfx p96 driver is in devs:monitors, will try .503 in the morning
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Old 01 October 2018, 00:50   #2758
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No, the fact that you saw some icons does not mean that it were HAM8 images. I have always a PNG colorwheel icon and one with the complete 16 bit palette with 65536 different colors to check that. There are really big differences to simple colormapped icons. The black images were introduced in 501.
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Old 01 October 2018, 01:07   #2759
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Aha, I see


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Old 01 October 2018, 03:49   #2760
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...Please, install the new FullPalette.prefs file into ENVARC:Sys (nowhere else) and call FPPrefs after IPrefs in your startup-sequence.
Now I don't remember why exactly but I remember that I tried and tried, read some things -there was something in some readme- and I finally left IPrefs after FPPrefs. You know that IPrefs is a delicate thing, it can show many problems depending on when it starts, and I was also trying to introduce Rainboot that depends a lot on that.

Last edited by Retrofan; 01 October 2018 at 03:59.
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