Amiga Inc. will die in the current bad economy? Opinions? - Page 3

blade002 · 20 February 2009, 13:03

If Amiga Inc go bankrupt, nothing is lost because they had nothing to do with the Amiga anyway... so Amiga Inc, we really don't give a frogs fat arse about you.

@Akira: When did you first start using the Amiga and i mean "really" start using one?, I am not trying to be snide here, just curious.

@Yotoxionomai: Why are telling others "don't worry" about the comment you made? Mate, stick by your guns because if thats the way you feel then thats the way you feel, and if anyone wants rant and rave and get all up in your face about it, then you just tell them "bad fucking luck". The Amiga scene has been great over the years and i do understand where you were coming from with your initial comment

haynor666 · 20 February 2009, 13:10

I'm amiga retro fan and I'm not interested what happen to amiga Inc.

wilshy · 20 February 2009, 13:41

Sorry, I believe I need to draw you all back to the point in question here.

Snowman Maker.

Amiga1992 · 20 February 2009, 14:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by blade002

@Akira: When did you first start using the Amiga and i mean "really" start using one?, I am not trying to be snide here, just curious.

I started in 92, never stopped and i still do.
I make music and graphics on a professional scale with it. Who here uses SERIOUSLY?
Can you explain where you were going with the question?

I am a big follower, and USER , of the machine, for 19 uninterrupted years, and I couldn't care less about Amiga Inc., and even less about the zealots that allow it to live on with their blatant lies.

Fact is, the Amiga scene, specially the demoscene, is pretty much stagnant, and hardly anything happens with it except for the hardcore groups that are keeping it real. That's why I put the C64 scene in comparison, which is super active and prolific. Why isn't the Amiga scene as much? I have my theories

Now thank god for WinUAE...

Gordon · 20 February 2009, 14:31

I never realised the c64 scene is bigger than the Amiga. I wander what is the biggest retro scene of them all?

wilshy · 20 February 2009, 15:35

C64 scene is vibing. Some amazing demos, music and still games being released.

[ Show youtube player ] - Edge of Disgrace by Booze. Remember that the video compression fucks the framerate, but it's 50fps on a real C64. Release at the end of last year, best C64 demo to date.

paranoid · 20 February 2009, 17:50

Some of the 64's popularity, I suspect, is from the SID chip. Excellent for the time, and an instant retro sound. And the 64 was probably a first in some ways, for being a decent little 8-bit computer that was insanely popular. If someone is going to reminisce about 80s computing, it's probably the 64. Comparing active scenes between it and the Amiga is apples and oranges.

Granted, one can go over the top, but I don't see Yotoxionomai's comments as too far out there. Amiga fanatics have been around since its conception. And to varying degrees. The demos were special for the Amiga, too, in that it's sound and graphics kept up for many years, while remaining standard, as opposed to a PC demo that needed a 386 when 286s were the norm, or required a Soundblaster Pro or SVGA.

Anyway, perhaps I haven't been paying close attention, but I don't see any "zealots that allow it to live on with their blatant lies."

Amiga1992 · 20 February 2009, 18:18

This has nothing to do with RETRO or NOSTALGIA. The demoscene happens today and every production is made and thought today, and doens't want to "relive old memories".

With this in mind, it's not apples and oranges ay all. Both C64 and ZX Spectrum have a bigger, more active, more prolific scene producing demos, games and tools, without a hint of nostalgia at sight. The Amiga is a computer of the same category (old), and there's a shitload of stuff to do with it, and probably a lot of limitations to break, but hardly anyone does it.

If you don't see the zealots, you haven't kept up with "Amiga" news for the past 10 years

Sensi · 20 February 2009, 18:50

Amiga will die? Its dead. Very dead

EDITED three weeks after Pyromania's post: I meant Amiga Inc, of course, my mistake. Amiga will be here forever, everybody knows that. Amiga Inc. is dead.
Dont wanna quote and post another post.

Pyromania · 20 February 2009, 19:08

@SensibleFan

Amiga will live on even if it's a Virtual Amiga (WinUAE) or new twists (Minimig). Amiga Inc. the company might be toast though. They never had anything to do with the Amiga anyway.

blade002 · 20 February 2009, 19:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akira

I started in 92, never stopped and i still do.
I make music and graphics on a professional scale with it. Who here uses SERIOUSLY?
Can you explain where you were going with the question?

You have a seriously depressing bitter tone mate, i am just trying to figure out your motive behind it. Yeah Yeah, i know, you are going to say you are just stating the facts i cannot handle ..etc..

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akira

I am a big follower, and USER , of the machine, for 19 uninterrupted years, and I couldn't care less about Amiga Inc., and even less about the zealots that allow it to live on with their blatant lies.

Just a slight correction, you started in 92, its 2009, so thats 17 years not 19.. anyway.. thats a small point

, although given the life of the machine, 92 is comparatively late so you would have missed most of the main buzz behind the machine.

Listen, the man is just passionate about a machine he has many memories with just as a man will look back at a classic Car he had that was machined and sounded a certain way for which gives him a feeling like nothing else can because it was part of his youth, and yes you are right, the Demoscene started many years before the Amiga, but i still feel as though the 16 bit machines such as the Amiga made a big impact due to being one of the first home machines which gave true power to home users at an affordable price and helped the Demoscene develop in ways that it had not before.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akira

Fact is, the Amiga scene, specially the demoscene, is pretty much stagnant, and hardly anything happens with it except for the hardcore groups that are keeping it real. That's why I put the C64 scene in comparison, which is super active and prolific. Why isn't the Amiga scene as much? I have my theories

How about the theory that the C64 was a worldwide phenomenon that took even American by storm back in the day and was the biggest selling computer of all time, whereas the Amiga got most of its following from select parts of the world and was not quite the success the C64 was despite the fact it was better than anything around at the time. You say you have your theories, so what are these theories?

Whats really silly here mate is that you love to go on about "Amiga" zealots, yet all you do is go on and on about the C64 so in effect all that makes you is a "C64" zealot but you don't like hearing that do you!? .. No man here is saying "you" can't be passionate about your views so what makes you judge, jury and executioner in reference to the attitudes of your responses. Wouldn't hurt to not respond like a prick

Hey, i love the C64 as well, yes the Amiga did not start the demoscene but it definitely was an influential machine and regardless of its status in the world and on the scene today, it still showed some of the greatest art and pixel work of its time and slandering it does nothing for anyone.

(And before you blow this out of context "I am not saying the Amiga is the MOST influential machine, but it was influential regardless".)

blade002 · 20 February 2009, 20:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akira

C64 and ZX Spectrum - without a hint of nostalgia at sight

You are a crazy man, but i forgive you

Amiga1992 · 21 February 2009, 01:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by blade002

You are a crazy man, but i forgive you

It is evident that, to -you-, using a vintage computer automatically means nostalgia or retro.
All I will say, besides that I don't know why you have a problem with me (I am not biter at all, you don't know me), the demoscene has nothing to do with nostalgia, and that I am not C64 zealot, since I do not think there will be a "second coming" of the C64 in any shape...

And I just said something to Yoto who, hey, he's not nostalgic about Amiga, he uses it TODAY wioth a modern setup -AND- applications.

I think you are the one a bit confused, and I hate the fact that you start your comments with "no offense" when you actually mean o attack.

No grudges, I couldn't care less about anyone getting angry at whatever I say since you don't know me one bit yet you dare call me a prick. I don't remember insulting you.
But one of my pet peeves is misconceptions, and saying that all of this -has- to be nostalgic, is bullshit.

blade002 · 21 February 2009, 06:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akira

It is evident that, to -you-, using a vintage computer automatically means nostalgia or retro.
All I will say, besides that I don't know why you have a problem with me (I am not biter at all, you don't know me), the demoscene has nothing to do with nostalgia, and that I am not C64 zealot, since I do not think there will be a "second coming" of the C64 in any shape...

Yes there are some for whom do not view the C64 or Amiga nostalgically and Yes there are some that do! .. I am caught somewhere in the middle, because if i had the money i would be buying a shit load for my Amiga and C64 (wouldn't mind getting a hold a 1541 Ultimate) but financially that is not the case and i fire it up now only for the game compo on here and for perhaps a few demo's for "nostalgia" and also to consider what they were capable of doing on the Amiga back then with its hardware... I do also plan to get back this year (when things are not too busy for me) into making Music MODS on my A1200 for which i will be taking to the Australian Demo scene Syntax each year.

And just because i might get nostalgic about the Amiga it does NOT mean that i automatically think its going to return, because i know for a fact that it wont and so do you, and MOST of the people on here know that too!!.. its mostly those guys over at Amiga.org that think there is going to be some amazing intervention to bring the Amiga back from the ashes, but they are pissing in the wind.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akira

And I just said something to Yoto who, hey, he's not nostalgic about Amiga, he uses it TODAY wioth a modern setup -AND- applications.

And so would i if i had the cash!, but why doesn't he just use a cheap Windows system and why did he bother spending money on Amiga hardware that was always overpriced and is still quite expensive right now?.. PC hardware is dirt cheap but he chooses the Amiga to use TODAY, so although he may not be nostalgic about it, why use something so old as the Amiga if he is not!? And retro is short for retrospective which is basically what the Amiga and C64 are.. retrospective systems that are no longer being produced today. But if you say he is not nostalgic then he is not nostalgic, fair enough.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akira

I think you are the one a bit confused, and I hate the fact that you start your comments with "no offense" when you actually mean o attack.

When did i say "no offence"? .. are you starting to develop schizophrenia with the written word? So mate, if you want a real attack because it suits your paranoia then by all means i will give you one, i just won't do it on here we will do it over the phone.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akira

No grudges, I couldn't care less about anyone getting angry at whatever I say since you don't know me one bit yet you dare call me a prick. I don't remember insulting you.
But one of my pet peeves is misconceptions, and saying that all of this -has- to be nostalgic, is bullshit.

No i was not calling you as a person in all your entirety a prick, i was saying that were responding like a prick and there are better ways to respond and you did so with no provocation, but If there is provocation then yes it can be justified.

Who said that any of this -has- to be nostalgic!? I never said that anything related to the Amiga -has- to be that way and neither is anybody else? ... Some are and some aren't, and it just so happens you aren't.

So do you still love me or would you rather put a big aluminum baseball bat around my head!?

Lets call it a day and shake on this

, or am i still trying to attack you?

T_hairy_bootson · 21 February 2009, 06:40

The c64 stagnated on the same hardware for 11 years of production or whatever it was. If anyone wants to code a demo or game they have one set of hardware to target and so a lot more will be released.

The amigas prods on the other hand are divided amongst OCS/ECS, AGA & PPC with each different chipset having a much shorter time in the sun. There are still prods comming out on the amiga, not as many as the c64 granted but there is still interest and buzz around as far as I can see on pouet and from talking to some of the local syntax scene guys. We still have active devs pushing out software and keeping it updated for classic amigas.

I can't comment on the ZX spectrum as a few here know I have absolutely no interest in that piece of crap at all.

The amount of kids today who take an interest in the c64, ZX or even amiga scene could probably be counted on one hand. The reason? They never experienced the machine in their youth and therefore have absolutely no interest in a machine they have no nostalgia for.

a.inc can go out of busness for all I care, not because of the rising of the ashes bullshit but because they just havent done anything worthwhile and maybe someone else could. Whether it be a c64dtv/minimig type toy or something cooler like releasing the old kickstart files I don't know... I'll leave that to whoever is running the show.

Akira in your absense the forum has become a lot more tolerant of a wide range of amigans, just be aware there will be OS4.x and next gen PPC hardware topics. These people shouldnt be flamed as zealots and told to piss off to aw.net because some of us arent interested imo. Some of these people have a lot to offer around here.

Being closed minded and flaming these people because you have one set of beliefs makes you look like a "classic zealot".

Not that you have done that though.

Fred the Fop · 21 February 2009, 07:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akira

....
Now thank god for WinUAE...

I remember our arguments about Emulation versus the real thing.

Fred the Fop · 21 February 2009, 07:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by blade002

How about the theory that the C64 was a worldwide phenomenon that took even American by storm back in the day and was the biggest selling computer of all time, whereas the Amiga got most of its following from select parts of the world and was not quite the success the C64 was despite the fact it was better than anything around at the time.

Sadly, mention Amiga here in the US and very few people my age know about it. The Amiga was very small here, as was the Atari ST. The Mac and IBM ruled the roost. Even though both the Amiga and Atari ST kicked their respective asses , at least until Mac and IBM got sexier in the early 90's. The C=64, however, is beloved here. Apple ][e as well.

Paul_s · 21 February 2009, 10:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fred the Fop

Sadly, mention Amiga here in the US and very few people my age know about it. The Amiga was very small here, as was the Atari ST. The Mac and IBM ruled the roost. Even though both the Amiga and Atari ST kicked their respective asses , at least until Mac and IBM got sexier in the early 90's. The C=64, however, is beloved here. Apple ][e as well.

The reason the Amiga was never popular in over in the US is because Doommaster sang his version of 'Only Amiga' on the radio.

Photon · 21 February 2009, 13:50

Amiga Inc dead? Didn't know they were alive.

(just for completeness, didn't see it posted above, you see..:P)

paranoid · 21 February 2009, 18:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akira

This has nothing to do with RETRO or NOSTALGIA. The demoscene happens today and every production is made and thought today, and doens't want to "relive old memories".

With this in mind, it's not apples and oranges ay all. Both C64 and ZX Spectrum have a bigger, more active, more prolific scene producing demos, games and tools, without a hint of nostalgia at sight. The Amiga is a computer of the same category (old), and there's a shitload of stuff to do with it, and probably a lot of limitations to break, but hardly anyone does it.

If you don't see the zealots, you haven't kept up with "Amiga" news for the past 10 years

I don't think a discussion is going to get far with this, but I did want to clear up a few points. The C64 itself is, by definition, retro. Also, I said it was a first. Comparing 8 and 16 bit is apples and oranges. And, really, just because a demo is new doesn't mean it wasn't made by someone that's feeling nostalgic. They certainly aren't using the 64 because it is cutting edge technology.

And I said I didn't see the "zealots that allow it to live on with their blatant lies." I also said fanatics have been around since its conception so I don't see how you made that leap.

I think the problem we're having is you're reading things rather selectively.

20 February 2009, 13:03	#41
blade002 Zone Friend Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Australia Age: 50 Posts: 2,616	If Amiga Inc go bankrupt, nothing is lost because they had nothing to do with the Amiga anyway... so Amiga Inc, we really don't give a frogs fat arse about you. @Akira: When did you first start using the Amiga and i mean "really" start using one?, I am not trying to be snide here, just curious. @Yotoxionomai: Why are telling others "don't worry" about the comment you made? Mate, stick by your guns because if thats the way you feel then thats the way you feel, and if anyone wants rant and rave and get all up in your face about it, then you just tell them "bad fucking luck". The Amiga scene has been great over the years and i do understand where you were coming from with your initial comment Last edited by blade002; 20 February 2009 at 13:10.

20 February 2009, 18:50	#49
Sensi Unregistered User Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: N/A Posts: 1,643	Amiga will die? Its dead. Very dead EDITED three weeks after Pyromania's post: I meant Amiga Inc, of course, my mistake. Amiga will be here forever, everybody knows that. Amiga Inc. is dead. Dont wanna quote and post another post. Last edited by Sensi; 05 March 2009 at 21:27.

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20 February 2009, 13:10	#42
haynor666 retro maniac Join Date: May 2002 Location: Tarnobrzeg/Poland Age: 45 Posts: 1,748	I'm amiga retro fan and I'm not interested what happen to amiga Inc.

20 February 2009, 13:41	#43
wilshy Registered User Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: SouthEast-ish UK Posts: 372	Sorry, I believe I need to draw you all back to the point in question here. Snowman Maker.

20 February 2009, 14:31	#45
Gordon Settler Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Serf City Posts: 1,760	I never realised the c64 scene is bigger than the Amiga. I wander what is the biggest retro scene of them all?

20 February 2009, 15:35	#46
wilshy Registered User Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: SouthEast-ish UK Posts: 372	C64 scene is vibing. Some amazing demos, music and still games being released. [ Show youtube player ] - Edge of Disgrace by Booze. Remember that the video compression fucks the framerate, but it's 50fps on a real C64. Release at the end of last year, best C64 demo to date.

20 February 2009, 17:50	#47
paranoid Phone Zen Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Banned Age: 52 Posts: 234	Some of the 64's popularity, I suspect, is from the SID chip. Excellent for the time, and an instant retro sound. And the 64 was probably a first in some ways, for being a decent little 8-bit computer that was insanely popular. If someone is going to reminisce about 80s computing, it's probably the 64. Comparing active scenes between it and the Amiga is apples and oranges. Granted, one can go over the top, but I don't see Yotoxionomai's comments as too far out there. Amiga fanatics have been around since its conception. And to varying degrees. The demos were special for the Amiga, too, in that it's sound and graphics kept up for many years, while remaining standard, as opposed to a PC demo that needed a 386 when 286s were the norm, or required a Soundblaster Pro or SVGA. Anyway, perhaps I haven't been paying close attention, but I don't see any "zealots that allow it to live on with their blatant lies."

20 February 2009, 18:18	#48
Amiga1992 Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: ? Posts: 19,645	This has nothing to do with RETRO or NOSTALGIA. The demoscene happens today and every production is made and thought today, and doens't want to "relive old memories". With this in mind, it's not apples and oranges ay all. Both C64 and ZX Spectrum have a bigger, more active, more prolific scene producing demos, games and tools, without a hint of nostalgia at sight. The Amiga is a computer of the same category (old), and there's a shitload of stuff to do with it, and probably a lot of limitations to break, but hardly anyone does it. If you don't see the zealots, you haven't kept up with "Amiga" news for the past 10 years

20 February 2009, 19:08	#50
Pyromania Moderator Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 3,375	@SensibleFan Amiga will live on even if it's a Virtual Amiga (WinUAE) or new twists (Minimig). Amiga Inc. the company might be toast though. They never had anything to do with the Amiga anyway.

21 February 2009, 06:40	#55
T_hairy_bootson Workbitch 1.3 Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Melbourne, Australia Age: 46 Posts: 2,084	The c64 stagnated on the same hardware for 11 years of production or whatever it was. If anyone wants to code a demo or game they have one set of hardware to target and so a lot more will be released. The amigas prods on the other hand are divided amongst OCS/ECS, AGA & PPC with each different chipset having a much shorter time in the sun. There are still prods comming out on the amiga, not as many as the c64 granted but there is still interest and buzz around as far as I can see on pouet and from talking to some of the local syntax scene guys. We still have active devs pushing out software and keeping it updated for classic amigas. I can't comment on the ZX spectrum as a few here know I have absolutely no interest in that piece of crap at all. The amount of kids today who take an interest in the c64, ZX or even amiga scene could probably be counted on one hand. The reason? They never experienced the machine in their youth and therefore have absolutely no interest in a machine they have no nostalgia for. a.inc can go out of busness for all I care, not because of the rising of the ashes bullshit but because they just havent done anything worthwhile and maybe someone else could. Whether it be a c64dtv/minimig type toy or something cooler like releasing the old kickstart files I don't know... I'll leave that to whoever is running the show. Akira in your absense the forum has become a lot more tolerant of a wide range of amigans, just be aware there will be OS4.x and next gen PPC hardware topics. These people shouldnt be flamed as zealots and told to piss off to aw.net because some of us arent interested imo. Some of these people have a lot to offer around here. Being closed minded and flaming these people because you have one set of beliefs makes you look like a "classic zealot". Not that you have done that though.

21 February 2009, 13:50	#59
Photon Moderator Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Eksjö / Sweden Posts: 5,602	Amiga Inc dead? Didn't know they were alive. (just for completeness, didn't see it posted above, you see..:P)

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