Dungeon Master V2.0 IPF?

[Supamax]

Originally Posted by Snoopy1234

Shifting or rotating a track in HxC exe is re-aligning the track in relation to the track index markers. Jim Drew, the SCP man is big on this as some hardware reads can cause differences and re-setting the offending track can make the image functional in certain cases. The upload I did of your dump has the 0.1 protection track shifted by +5 points.

Thanks for the explanation .
Not sure I fully understand it but I'd like to test the related software... do you use HxC Floppy Emulator?

It would be interesting to hear if it works for you.

Do you mean in WinUAE or on my real A500/A600? I don't have it at hand, here

[BarryB]

Originally Posted by Supamax

Just some questions about Kryoflux I ever wandered about:

- can I directly load Kryoflux dumps (the ones consisting in multiple files, one for each track/side) in WinUAE? If so, how? By putting them in a dedicated subdirectory?

- CT RAW is a different representation of a "multiple files" KF dump?

- can I directly load Kryoflux dumps (the ones consisting in multiple files, one for each track/side) in WinUAE? If so, how? By putting them in a dedicated subdirectory?

No, WinUAE will treat the xx.x.raw file as a single file and will try to load just that file, which it can't as it's not in a supported format!

- CT RAW is a different representation of a "multiple files" KF dump?

Yes, a CT RAW takes all 168 RAW files (1 RAW for each track) created with a Kryoflux and creates a single file from them, however, not all protections/formats will work as CT RAW and DM is one of those that won't work!

[Supamax]

Originally Posted by lesta_smsc

Uploaded my version of version 2.0 to The Zone! This version runs perfectly under WinUAE and when written to a floppy disk. Hopefully it works for the rest of you!

I tested your image for half an hour and it would indeed seem to work!
I've put it in the 'good candidates' folder!

[Supamax]

Originally Posted by BarryB

- can I directly load Kryoflux dumps (the ones consisting in multiple files, one for each track/side) in WinUAE? If so, how? By putting them in a dedicated subdirectory?

No, WinUAE will treat the xx.x.raw file as a single file and will try to load just that file, which it can't as it's not in a supported format!

Oh, ok .
A xx.x raw file dump can only be used directly by the Kryoflux utility?

Which utility is the best one to convert from the xx.x raw file to a more convenient one (for WinUAE or Greaseweazle's GW.exe etc.)?

- CT RAW is a different representation of a "multiple files" KF dump?

Yes, a CT RAW takes all 168 RAW files (1 RAW for each track) created with a Kryoflux and creates a single file from them, however, not all protections/formats will work as CT RAW and DM is one of those that won't work!

Ok, thanks .

[lesta_smsc]

Originally Posted by Supamax

I tested your image for half an hour and it would indeed seem to work!
I've put it in the 'good candidates' folder!

Excellent! Thanks for the feedback, I tested for around 20 minutes and that was on a real Amiga so I assumed if the image was written properly then the source / raw image was ok.

Hopefully @BarryB and @rhester72 can test it too to confirm and then maybe someone can risk an IPF conversion lol.

[BarryB]

Only the publicly available Disk-Utilities will create IPF's from KF RAW dumps and only then if the format/protection is supported!

HxC will take KF RAW dumps and create HFE files to use in the HxC Floppy Emulator or Gotek with Keir's Flash Floppy firmware, it will also create ADF files for unprotected KF dumps for use in WinUAE!

My SCP dump I made of my v2.2 disk with Greaseweazle Guru'd on me while fighting the Rock Monsters

[Supamax]

Originally Posted by lesta_smsc

Excellent! Thanks for the feedback, I tested for around 20 minutes and that was on a real Amiga so I assumed if the image was written properly then the source / raw image was ok.

I'll gradually test all the images collected, just in case I find other 'good candidates'.

Using your image I still noticed this behaviour, but it could be normal for disk images of this troublesome protection: when clicking on the floppy icon in one charachter's menu, sometimes (40% of the time, maybe) the game asks for the master disk. If you click on Ok it will eventually proceed.
Maybe it doesn't do that on your real Amiga using the recreated original (from your .SCP image).

Also, but I'm probably being paranoid, when changing/adding clothes (i.e. trousers) I see enhancements which remain if I remove the clothes. Must investigate... is it normal?

Originally Posted by BarryB

Only the publicly available Disk-Utilities will create IPF's from KF RAW dumps and only then if the format/protection is supported!

Ok, thanks.
And... for disk analysis which is better, HxC or Keir's utilities? (tough question, I suppose)

My SCP dump I made of my v2.2 disk with Greaseweazle Guru'd on me while fighting the Rock Monsters

Arrrgh

Which one, 3-revs or 5-revs?

[BarryB]

5 revs

HxC will give you an idea if the disk is index-aligned, use the Dummy Disk view to see, best for ADOS disks!!

[lesta_smsc]

Originally Posted by Supamax

Using your image I still noticed this behaviour, but it could be normal for disk images of this troublesome protection: when clicking on the floppy icon in one charachter's menu, sometimes (40% of the time, maybe) the game asks for the master disk. If you click on Ok it will eventually proceed.
Maybe it doesn't do that on your real Amiga using the recreated original (from your .SCP image).

Not noticed that behaviour with the working disk. However, one of the dumps worked ok on WinUAE but when that same dump was written to disk it said insert master disk around the time of FTL logo appearing so it was very early on.

[Snoopy1234]

Originally Posted by Supamax

Oh, ok .
A xx.x raw file dump can only be used directly by the Kryoflux utility?

Which utility is the best one to convert from the xx.x raw file to a more convenient one (for WinUAE or Greaseweazle's GW.exe etc.)?



Ok, thanks .

GW.exe convert can transpose a folder of KF raw.xx files to an scp etc.

[Snoopy1234]

ipf (Keir Disk Utilities) of lesta_smsc scp image returns "Dungeon Master System Error 60" in Hall of Champions.

[Supamax]

Originally Posted by Snoopy1234

ipf (Keir Disk Utilities) of lesta_smsc scp image returns "Dungeon Master System Error 60" in Hall of Champions.

Hmmm, I suppose it's better to leave it in .scp format...

Originally Posted by Snoopy1234

GW.exe convert can transpose a folder of KF raw.xx files to an scp etc.

I didn't know that! Thanks!

[lesta_smsc]

Originally Posted by Snoopy1234

ipf (Keir Disk Utilities) of lesta_smsc scp image returns "Dungeon Master System Error 60" in Hall of Champions.

I'm not convinced an IPF conversion is warranted as unlike SCP, it needs refining before image is valid/useable.

Originally Posted by Supamax

Hmmm, I suppose it's better to leave it in .scp format...

Yes, that is why I didn't bother to convert it.

I'd be interested to know if that error was reproducible on SCP itself?

As mentioned, I have several SCPs of my disk, but the one uploaded seem to run the smoothest (at least for me) from a written disk (the emulated disks seem okay).

[Supamax]

Originally Posted by lesta_smsc

I'm not convinced an IPF conversion is warranted as unlike SCP, it needs refining before image is valid/useable.
[...]
that is why I didn't bother to convert it.

Yes, I agree.
.SCP and .IPF formats remind me of the ZX Spectrum .TZX and .WAV formats.
(Simplifying) .SCP is the digital representation of the floppy disk analogue magnetic flux, just like .WAV is the digital representation of the cassette tape analogue waveform;
and .IPF is an interpreted conversion of .SCP, just like .TZX is an interpreted conversion of .WAV.
If the interpretation is not correct, the resulting file will be missing something.

[dlfrsilver]

Originally Posted by Supamax

Yes, I agree.
.SCP and .IPF formats remind me of the ZX Spectrum .TZX and .WAV formats.
(Simplifying) .SCP is the digital representation of the floppy disk analogue magnetic flux, just like .WAV is the digital representation of the cassette tape analogue waveform;
and .IPF is an interpreted conversion of .SCP, just like .TZX is an interpreted conversion of .WAV.
If the interpretation is not correct, the resulting file will be missing something.

Yes. the IPF as it is cannot handle yet the protection system used. It's not simply Weaks bits used (There are already Amiga games in IPF using Weak Bits protections).... it requires more work on the IPF format to get the support.

as IFW explained it, "in practice the Amiga version checks for the fixed and random bitcells. The ST version can only check for the data bits (the Amiga one does check the clock bits), but does not matter, in principle the result is deterministic weak bits."

[lesta_smsc]

Originally Posted by dlfrsilver

Yes. the IPF as it is cannot handle yet the protection system used. It's not simply Weaks bits used (There are already Amiga games in IPF using Weak Bits protections).... it requires more work on the IPF format to get the support.



as IFW explained it, "in practice the Amiga version checks for the fixed and random bitcells. The ST version can only check for the data bits (the Amiga one does check the clock bits), but does not matter, in principle the result is deterministic weak bits."

From the SCP I've uploaded, are you able to make sense of the quality of the dump? I'm wondering whether doing another run with more revolutions will help in anways although I hope that the disk dump in present state is playable @Supamax ?

Someone needs to longplay that version lol.

[Supamax]

Originally Posted by lesta_smsc

Someone needs to longplay that version lol.

The problem with DM's protections is that one can't be sure until he longplays it till the very end .

[lesta_smsc]

Originally Posted by Supamax

The problem with DM's protections is that one can't be sure until he longplays it till the very end .

And so the journey by @Supamax starts at the entrance of the dungeon... lol

[Supamax]

Originally Posted by lesta_smsc

And so the journey by @Supamax starts at the entrance of the dungeon... lol

[BarryB]

Just a 'heads up'!

Keir has now modified his DM decoder in Disk-Utilities to make an IPF that works under emulation, so let's get testing!!