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Old 13 April 2007, 11:02   #21
lucadip
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Shamino, your answer needs a detailed reply....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shamino
Java is slow as sludge.
Please bring facts, not just your opinions. Java is the most used platform worldwide for Web and Application servers.
Software like Eclipse is written in Java itself, and is _not_ slow.
For sure, I would never develop Quake 5 with Java, but we're talking about Supercars and Gods here, aren't we? And they run great on any pc I used to play them!

Quote:
Plus it means downloading an extra 15Mb, and then having a less secure system once it's installed.
If it was developed natively for MacOs and you used Windoze, how much would it cost you to buy a Mac?

Why is installing a JRE insecure?

Quote:
Why require an interpreter?
Java is not an intepreted language as it was eg Basic on the C64: the source code is compiled into bytecodes which can be run into a virtual machine or compiled to native code at runtime.
And, to answer your question, sw written in java is 100% portable.

Quote:
Open source, how is that dependent on what language it is written in!? That's like saying Pascal is better than C because you can open source Pascal programs, that just doesn't make sense.
You didn't get it, I was not referring to the programs written in Java.
What I meant is that the Java platform itself is 100% open source. Hope it makes sense to you now.

Quote:
Most languages support OOP, which is rather overrated IMHO anyway.


No comment here...

Quote:
Plus, since there is no Java for Amiga the portability of Java programs is thus rather limited.
Yes, is rather limited to a few minor OS, like Linux, BSD, Solaris, MacOs, Windows, .... It's not available for C64, though.

But let's forget all this Java talking and go back to your original question. Which language and platform will you suggest to jotd to develop his (amazing ) remakes?

Honestly, if jotd had not developed his remakes with Java, I would have been happy anyway!
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Old 13 April 2007, 12:01   #22
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>Java is the most used platform worldwide for Web and Application servers.

Not for games, desktop apps, demos, etc. though.

>If it was developed natively for MacOs and you used Windoze, how much would it cost you to buy a Mac?

You would use a Mac emulator of course.

>Why is installing a JRE insecure?

Same reason as installing eg ActiveX, Flash, etc. are insecure.

>Java is not an intepreted language as it was eg Basic on the C64: the source code is compiled into bytecodes which can be run into a virtual machine or compiled to native code at runtime.

Virtual machine = emulator. "Bytecode" != machine code.

>You didn't get it, I was not referring to the programs written in Java.
What I meant is that the Java platform itself is 100% open source.

So are most languages, eg. C.

>Yes, is rather limited to a few minor OS, like Linux, BSD, Solaris, MacOs, Windows, .... It's not available for C64, though.

UNIX, Mac and Windows, big deal, SDL is available for many more platforms including Amiga.

>But let's forget all this Java talking and go back to your original question. Which language and platform will you suggest to jotd to develop his (amazing ) remakes?

Well, C, for instance. Even PureBasic would probably give better performance, and is available on many platforms.
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Old 13 April 2007, 14:37   #23
lucadip
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shamino
>If it was developed natively for MacOs and you used Windoze, how much would it cost you to buy a Mac?

You would use a Mac emulator of course.
You said you don't want to donwload 15 MB for the JRE, so how would you get the emulator (and the OS)?? Would it be for free? Last but not least, the MacOs you would use in your emulator costs a few hundred bucks...

Moreover, you seem to ignore that the JRE is simply an environment where you can _locally_ run java applications like Supercars and, only if you wish, can _also_ be used with a browser to run Applets. Java is not born as a web technology and the JRE is not comparable to a Flash Plug-In.

To sum it up: Jotd's implementation is free, is portable and performs great on my 7 years old pc.
Can't really see any problem with it!

Except that jotd should move on and port a few more games!
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Old 13 April 2007, 14:51   #24
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Hmmm, Java

How about a GP2X Port then ????

Btw. nice work
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Old 13 April 2007, 17:19   #25
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geeze, whats with all this bitching over nothing?
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Old 13 April 2007, 17:34   #26
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Instructions:
Download.
Play.
Play some more.
Thank JOTD for putting in the effort to create this.
Stop bitching.
Play some more.
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Old 13 April 2007, 20:44   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by killergorilla
Instructions:
Download.
Play.
Play some more.
Thank JOTD for putting in the effort to create this.
Stop bitching.
Play some more.
Thanks for all your comments. I'd like to add that I chose Java because it is fast and rather easy to develop games, compared to C++, even if I agree that execution will be approx. 2 times slower.

If it had not been for Java, I would not have been able to develop Supercars 3 during my spare time, and now remaking Gods. With Java and Eclipse compared to a classical C++ development environment, I think that developping a game is 2 or 3 times faster.

Java is slow not because it is interpreted (it is no longer interpreted but compiled at class loading since 1998 thanks to JIT) but to the all-virtual method concept: no method cannot be inlined and even getters and setters require a function call. Also, you cannot avoid a bunch of "new" calls, which calls memory manager recklessly, and in sequence the garbage collector.

There's also a Java proper compiler called Excelsior JET. I've quickly tested it on my games without success (maybe because of the game structure, the lack of JAR files...), but some friend of mine told me that the apps that you can compile are twice as fast, without any source modification.
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Old 16 April 2007, 11:51   #28
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I just downloaded and played this with my brother.. great stuff!! I really like this game and this version is great.

My only quibbles with it are that I don't really like the Supercars 2 type cars.. they look a little odd to me and that the missiles are much faster than in the Amiga version.

Those are only minor things though, I really like this port! Thanks a lot
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Old 16 April 2007, 11:57   #29
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Thanks for this Super Cars version . One thing: you can steer the car in the air, but in Super Cars 2 you can't.
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Old 16 April 2007, 14:39   #30
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@ laffer : come on... I'll deck you outside

... fyi: I made this car model in 3D, thats what JOTD used
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Old 16 April 2007, 21:54   #31
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@Emuchicken: I thin laffer just does not like Supercars 2 car. He can change it to Audi or Mercedes.

About steering in the air: ok, I've got to check, but if you are right, I'll remove it.

I have fixed the sfx bug too (sfx were not played all the time)
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Old 17 April 2007, 02:14   #32
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Awesome work.I still own many amiga games and computers, including original super cars 2
 
Old 17 April 2007, 02:20   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucadip
You said you don't want to donwload 15 MB for the JRE, so how would you get the emulator (and the OS)?? Would it be for free? Last but not least, the MacOs you would use in your emulator costs a few hundred bucks...
No, Apple has released the relevant version of MacOS for free, it's even at their site. Unlike eg. Amino.

Quote:
no method cannot be inlined and even getters and setters require a function call.
Ouch.
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Old 03 May 2007, 17:19   #34
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Hey great game jotd! I downloaded this ages ago but only got around to playing it this evening. Fantastic, I'm really impressed.

Not wanting to reopen the Java debate, but I tried games programming with Java about two years ago (when full screen modes were first introduced in SDK 1.5) and had a crazy time with compatibility and stability. It looks like things have improved a lot since then and it is possible to create really professional looking games now. Great work
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Old 03 May 2007, 18:46   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TikTok
Hey great game jotd! I downloaded this ages ago but only got around to playing it this evening. Fantastic, I'm really impressed.

Not wanting to reopen the Java debate, but I tried games programming with Java about two years ago (when full screen modes were first introduced in SDK 1.5) and had a crazy time with compatibility and stability. It looks like things have improved a lot since then and it is possible to create really professional looking games now. Great work
thanks! I had to drop JRE 6.0 (AKA 1.6) because some stuff I'm doing (partial image copy) is not working properly with JRE 6.0 in full screen mode, although it works 100% with JRE 5.0 and with 6.0 in windowed mode!!

But JRE 5.0 sometimes crashes when opening a full screen window.
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Old 22 July 2014, 00:21   #36
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Sorry for resuming this thread but...
I have downloaded the game but I am not able to start it.
I remember that I already tried to play this game in the past without success...
Is there anybody that was able to play it?

This is the error I receive when I try to start it on my Linux box:

./Supercars3.sh
Exception in thread "main" java.io.FileNotFoundException: cars/4_VW New Beetle/info.sc3 (No such file or directory)
at java.io.FileInputStream.open(Native Method)
at java.io.FileInputStream.<init>(Unknown Source)
at java.io.FileInputStream.<init>(Unknown Source)
at java.io.FileReader.<init>(Unknown Source)
at supercars3.sys.ParameterParser.<init>(ParameterParser.java:278)
at supercars3.sys.ParameterParser.open(ParameterParser.java:312)
at supercars3.game.cars.CarBodyView.<init>(CarBodyView.java:63)
at supercars3.game.screens.OptionsScreenMore.<init>(OptionsScreenMore.java:84)
at supercars3.game.screens.OptionsScreenMain.<init>(OptionsScreenMain.java:102)
at supercars3.game.SCGame.<init>(SCGame.java:59)
at supercars3.game.SCGame.main(SCGame.java:307)

I use Debian 7 64 bit and this is my java:

java -version
java version "1.7.0_55"
Java(TM) SE Runtime Environment (build 1.7.0_55-b13)
Java HotSpot(TM) 64-Bit Server VM (build 24.55-b03, mixed mode)

I also tried with an "embedded" jre1.6.0_30 folder with the same result.
I think that there are some bugs in the 0.5 release but from the author website http://jotd.pagesperso-orange.fr/supercars3/index.html it is not possible to download older releases anymore...

Could anyone send me an older release or help me in some way?
Thanks in advance, I am a great fan of Super Cars and Super Cars 2 and I would like to play this game (I already tried Super Cars International on Dosbox...)


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PS:
Same result with java jre1.5.0_22...

Last edited by liviux76; 22 July 2014 at 00:40.
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Old 22 July 2014, 10:08   #37
gimbal
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Seems to work on Windows. Just to be 100% sure; does that file actually exist? SuperCars3/cars/4_VW New Beetle/info.sc3 ?
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Old 22 July 2014, 10:25   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gimbal View Post
Seems to work on Windows. Just to be 100% sure; does that file actually exist? SuperCars3/cars/4_VW New Beetle/info.sc3 ?
Good to know that in Windows it works... unfortunately I do not have Windows systems.

Yes, that file does exist. I also replaced it with the one found on "3_Mercedes Class C" folder with the same result...
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Old 22 July 2014, 11:08   #39
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Check the permissions of the files - maybe root owns it or the r/w permissions are not set correctly.
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Old 22 July 2014, 12:32   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbenam View Post
Check the permissions of the files - maybe root owns it or the r/w permissions are not set correctly.
Thanks for the suggestion... yesterday I opened the file using my "user account" and read the content so I think that the permissions are correct, anyway I'll check them later since now I am at work...
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