Secondary OS for Amiga 3000 with A3640?

spudje · 01 July 2015, 22:46

So my hopes for a (less expensive than CyberstormPPC) Ultimate PPC expansion for my A3000 seems to have ended up in vapor; no announcement at Amiga30...

So no AmigaOS 4.1 for me.

That got me wondering, is there another OS I could run next to AmigaOS on Amiga 3000 in a relatively decent fashion, with a GUI (no shell-only based OS)? More out of curiosity/experiment than I really want to do a lot with it.

What would be the most recent distro's and versions of Linux, FreeBSD or other that would still run on my A3640? Including a GUI that is responsive enough and ideally supporting Cybervision 64?

Thanks!!!

gulliver · 01 July 2015, 23:11

What I would choose with your setup, will not be only one secondary OS, but just a couple of partitions with different system setups:

1.NetBSD
2.AmigaOS 3.1 (ClassicWB P96) - Some eye candy and plenty of handy programs
3.AmigaOS 3.1 BetterWB - For enhanced performance (it is speedy)
4.AmigaOS 3.9 + BoingBags - For having the latest OS and its built-in packs
5.Aros 68k - just pick a stable cdrom image (not ArosVision, because it is not designed for real amigas)
6. AmigaSYS 4 - Like Amikit but less bloated and designed for real hardware.

I find Amikit is really cool for WinUAE and, Amikit Real is great for AGA amigas with a 68040 and plenty of ram. But I wouldnt choose it for your current machine configuration.

Linux 68k is pretty outdated, I wouldnt touch it. The same goes with OpenBSD. Stick to NetBSD which is currently being mantained and Amiga support is well cared for.

Jope · 02 July 2015, 07:32

Just stick with AmigaOS on Amigas, everything else is only good for a curious peek, then you can delete the partitions and reclaim the space.

Linux and *BSD runs better on a PC, as well as AROS.

spudje · 02 July 2015, 08:26

Thanks guys, I will take a peek at netbsd then! And I was at least going for ClassicWB 3.9 p69, but maybe try some other variants as suggested.

strim · 02 July 2015, 12:18

Keep in mind the latest version of NetBSD requires a lot of RAM. 16MB is the absolute minimum to run anything, 24MB if you want to use X11-based GUI.

It will work on A3000+A3640 but not exactly as a speed demon. What other expansions do you have in that A3000?

spudje · 02 July 2015, 13:06

My daughterboard is full:
- Cybervision 64
- Highway USB
- Ariadne II network
- FastATA 4000 ATA/IDE

I only have 16 MB fastRAM / 2MB chipRAM. So I might have to free up a zorro slot (swap highway & ariadne with X-Surf 100 + Rapidroad, however they have issues with 3640) for additional zorroram?

gulliver · 02 July 2015, 13:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by spudje

My daughterboard is full:
- Cybervision 64
- Highway USB
- Ariadne II network
- FastATA 4000 ATA/IDE

I only have 16 MB fastRAM / 2MB chipRAM. So I might have to free up a zorro slot (swap highway & ariadne with X-Surf 100 + Rapidroad, however they have issues with 3640) for additional zorroram?

To have a free Zorro slot without loosing too much functionality, I would just remove the Ariadne, and use some USB ethernet dongle (they are pretty cheap). I would not choose the X-Surf 100 + Rapidroad approach for the issues you mentioned. What I would certainly try to acquire at some point is a Zoram or BigRam card so as to increase your system´s memory.

Locutus · 02 July 2015, 13:51

Z3 RAM is slow enough to kill performance though, so its doubtful if its really useful.

strim · 02 July 2015, 14:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by spudje

My daughterboard is full:
- Cybervision 64
- Highway USB
- Ariadne II network
- FastATA 4000 ATA/IDE

NetBSD does not support Highway and FastATA 4000

.

When it comes to Zorro IDE controllers, only Buddha and Buddha Flash are supported. When it comes to USB, only Thylacine is supported, but it is really flakey under NetBSD (at least mine).

Quote:

I only have 16 MB fastRAM / 2MB chipRAM. So I might have to free up a zorro slot (swap highway & ariadne with X-Surf 100 + Rapidroad, however they have issues with 3640) for additional zorroram?

X-Surf 100 is supported under NetBSD (xsh driver), but Rapidroad isn't.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gulliver

To have a free Zorro slot without loosing too much functionality, I would just remove the Ariadne, and use some USB ethernet dongle (they are pretty cheap).

Not so good idea, since as I mentioned above, Highway is not supported under NetBSD and using NetBSD without the "net" is kinda pointless.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Locutus

Z3 RAM is slow enough to kill performance though, so its doubtful if its really useful.

Actually, it's good enough under NetBSD when paired with A3640 (not much slower than memory on the main board). And it can be used as swap instead of RAM if necessary (z3rambd driver).

gulliver · 02 July 2015, 14:27

Oh, crap! I thought the Highway was supported under NetBSD. :0

spudje · 02 July 2015, 15:31

Mmm, so I should either look for a SCSI device or other IDE zorro card :/

strim · 02 July 2015, 15:40

Here's a full list of supported hardware:

http://wiki.netbsd.org/ports/amiga/

Retrofan · 02 July 2015, 17:11

You can run AKReal with 16mb ram. Of course having a RTG like you makes things easier, although installing drivers for RTG won't be straight.
A3640? 25 or 50Mhz? It will work fast with 50Mhz, it would die with 25.

"This is your last chance. After this, there is no turning back. You take the blue pill—the story ends, you wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the AKReal pill—you stay in Wonderland, and I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes. Remember: all I'm offering is the truth. Nothing more."

mech · 02 July 2015, 17:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by spudje

So my hopes for a (less expensive than CyberstormPPC) Ultimate PPC expansion for my A3000 seems to have ended up in vapor; no announcement at Amiga30...

So no AmigaOS 4.1 for me.

That got me wondering, is there another OS I could run next to AmigaOS on Amiga 3000 in a relatively decent fashion, with a GUI (no shell-only based OS)? More out of curiosity/experiment than I really want to do a lot with it.

What would be the most recent distro's and versions of Linux, FreeBSD or other that would still run on my A3640? Including a GUI that is responsive enough and ideally supporting Cybervision 64?

Thanks!!!

Get rid of the fastATA, why aren't you using the fast,good 3000 scsi which has low cpu overhead?(make sure u have a wd33c93 rev 8 or the amd version 33c93a scsi chip).

If you want a CF for a hard drive ,get a acard 7720U scsi to ide bridge.

Add a zoram,contrary to what people say, having ram,even slow, is better than no ram, it works fine. of course a 060 accelerator with fast scsi and 128Mb would be better-or a warpengine 3040...

You can pop in a 33mhz or 40mhz 68040 chip into the A3640 and clock it 35-40mhz,its quite a difference. the PALS/GALS on it are good to 50mhz i believe.

spudje · 02 July 2015, 17:54

I tried Amikit real on my a1200, didn't like it. Way too flashy, too much embossing, etc. I didn't succeed to get it to look like the nice flat green design of the uae version.

Retrofan · 02 July 2015, 18:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by spudje

I tried Amikit real on my a1200, didn't like it. Way too flashy, too much embossing, etc. I didn't succeed to get it to look like the nice flat green design of the uae version.

Thanks a lot for telling. Nice idea, I will give another option so it will look just the same or very similar -I think I will keep WBStartup++ but you can disable it- with RTG.

nogginthenog · 02 July 2015, 21:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by gulliver

1.NetBSD
2.AmigaOS 3.1 (ClassicWB P96) - Some eye candy and plenty of handy programs
3.AmigaOS 3.1 BetterWB - For enhanced performance (it is speedy)
4.AmigaOS 3.9 + BoingBags - For having the latest OS and its built-in packs
5.Aros 68k - just pick a stable cdrom image (not ArosVision, because it is not designed for real amigas)
6. AmigaSYS 4 - Like Amikit but less bloated and designed for real hardware.

No Linux? I ran Linux on my A4000 back in the day and it was pretty nice. I'm pretty sure Geert Uytterhoeven is still maintaining m68k.

FYI this was a great introduction to Linux for me. There was no proper distribution, I had to roll my own from source.

Mrs Beanbag · 02 July 2015, 21:58

Amiga Unix?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amiga_Unix

Retrofan · 02 July 2015, 22:07

Where can I download Amiga Linux/Unix to try it?

The most recent news was WIP -a month ago- Delicate Linux.

amadama · 02 July 2015, 22:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Retrofan

Where can I download Amiga Linux/Unix to try it?

The most recent news was WIP -a month ago- Delicate Linux.

Amiga Unix downloads and info here:
http://amix.failsure.net/tiki-index.php

01 July 2015, 22:46	#1
spudje Registered User Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Netherlands Posts: 1,406	Secondary OS for Amiga 3000 with A3640? So my hopes for a (less expensive than CyberstormPPC) Ultimate PPC expansion for my A3000 seems to have ended up in vapor; no announcement at Amiga30... So no AmigaOS 4.1 for me. That got me wondering, is there another OS I could run next to AmigaOS on Amiga 3000 in a relatively decent fashion, with a GUI (no shell-only based OS)? More out of curiosity/experiment than I really want to do a lot with it. What would be the most recent distro's and versions of Linux, FreeBSD or other that would still run on my A3640? Including a GUI that is responsive enough and ideally supporting Cybervision 64? Thanks!!!

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01 July 2015, 23:11	#2
gulliver BoingBagged Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: The South of nowhere Age: 46 Posts: 2,358	What I would choose with your setup, will not be only one secondary OS, but just a couple of partitions with different system setups: 1.NetBSD 2.AmigaOS 3.1 (ClassicWB P96) - Some eye candy and plenty of handy programs 3.AmigaOS 3.1 BetterWB - For enhanced performance (it is speedy) 4.AmigaOS 3.9 + BoingBags - For having the latest OS and its built-in packs 5.Aros 68k - just pick a stable cdrom image (not ArosVision, because it is not designed for real amigas) 6. AmigaSYS 4 - Like Amikit but less bloated and designed for real hardware. I find Amikit is really cool for WinUAE and, Amikit Real is great for AGA amigas with a 68040 and plenty of ram. But I wouldnt choose it for your current machine configuration. Linux 68k is pretty outdated, I wouldnt touch it. The same goes with OpenBSD. Stick to NetBSD which is currently being mantained and Amiga support is well cared for.

02 July 2015, 07:32	#3
Jope - Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Helsinki / Finland Age: 43 Posts: 9,861	Just stick with AmigaOS on Amigas, everything else is only good for a curious peek, then you can delete the partitions and reclaim the space. Linux and *BSD runs better on a PC, as well as AROS.

02 July 2015, 08:26	#4
spudje Registered User Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Netherlands Posts: 1,406	Thanks guys, I will take a peek at netbsd then! And I was at least going for ClassicWB 3.9 p69, but maybe try some other variants as suggested.

02 July 2015, 12:18	#5
strim NetBSD developer Join Date: May 2012 Location: Warsaw, Poland Posts: 411	Keep in mind the latest version of NetBSD requires a lot of RAM. 16MB is the absolute minimum to run anything, 24MB if you want to use X11-based GUI. It will work on A3000+A3640 but not exactly as a speed demon. What other expansions do you have in that A3000?

02 July 2015, 13:06	#6
spudje Registered User Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Netherlands Posts: 1,406	My daughterboard is full: - Cybervision 64 - Highway USB - Ariadne II network - FastATA 4000 ATA/IDE I only have 16 MB fastRAM / 2MB chipRAM. So I might have to free up a zorro slot (swap highway & ariadne with X-Surf 100 + Rapidroad, however they have issues with 3640) for additional zorroram?

02 July 2015, 13:51	#8
Locutus Registered User Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Finland Posts: 1,175	Z3 RAM is slow enough to kill performance though, so its doubtful if its really useful.

02 July 2015, 14:27	#10
gulliver BoingBagged Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: The South of nowhere Age: 46 Posts: 2,358	Oh, crap! I thought the Highway was supported under NetBSD. :0

02 July 2015, 15:31	#11
spudje Registered User Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Netherlands Posts: 1,406	Mmm, so I should either look for a SCSI device or other IDE zorro card :/

02 July 2015, 15:40	#12
strim NetBSD developer Join Date: May 2012 Location: Warsaw, Poland Posts: 411	Here's a full list of supported hardware: http://wiki.netbsd.org/ports/amiga/

02 July 2015, 17:11	#13
Retrofan Ruler of the Universe Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Lanzarote/Spain Posts: 6,185	You can run AKReal with 16mb ram. Of course having a RTG like you makes things easier, although installing drivers for RTG won't be straight. A3640? 25 or 50Mhz? It will work fast with 50Mhz, it would die with 25. "This is your last chance. After this, there is no turning back. You take the blue pill—the story ends, you wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the AKReal pill—you stay in Wonderland, and I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes. Remember: all I'm offering is the truth. Nothing more."

02 July 2015, 17:54	#15
spudje Registered User Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Netherlands Posts: 1,406	I tried Amikit real on my a1200, didn't like it. Way too flashy, too much embossing, etc. I didn't succeed to get it to look like the nice flat green design of the uae version.

02 July 2015, 21:58	#18
Mrs Beanbag Glastonbridge Software Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Edinburgh/Scotland Posts: 2,243	Amiga Unix? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amiga_Unix

02 July 2015, 22:07	#19
Retrofan Ruler of the Universe Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Lanzarote/Spain Posts: 6,185	Where can I download Amiga Linux/Unix to try it? The most recent news was WIP -a month ago- Delicate Linux.

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