25 August 2015, 16:31 | #321 |
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I remember that (more then 10 years ago) the teacher used Python as language for the course. The thing with tab/space and indent was very annoying. Trying to hunt the invisible error. I just thought how stupid is that.
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25 August 2015, 16:33 | #322 |
Glastonbridge Software
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try makefiles...
a line indented by spaces, and a line indented by tabs, mean different things |
25 August 2015, 16:53 | #323 | |
Total Chaos forever!
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Quote:
I've posted on UltimateAmiga.co.uk about my plan to make a gaming library. There are a lot of independent stretch goals once the main objective is met. See the post here and see the milestones available here. Toss a coin into the hat on https://www.bountysource.com/ and I'll find the time to do it faster! |
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25 August 2015, 16:58 | #324 | |
Phone Homer
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25 August 2015, 17:10 | #325 |
Total Chaos forever!
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ScrollingTrick was written in C as example code. It was never designed to be reusable. (In fact, I couldn't write it in AmigaE no matter how hard I tried because the library mode is broken beyond repair in the compiler.)
Why am I doing this in C? It compiles better than AmosPro, supports inline Assembly better than AmosPro and most importantly, can bang the hardware without having to disable all the high-level features of AmosPro and litter my code with Exec library calls and wierd banks whose only purpose is to emulate structure functions that are natively supported in C. Why as a shared library? It can be used from any language you choose, as many times in the same code as you choose. Many languages (including Assembly and AmigaE) have utilities for importing shared library support from the FD file (FD2Pragma for example). But best of all, just by swapping the shared library for one written for graphics cards, you instantly have graphics card support without even trying! |
25 August 2015, 17:50 | #326 |
Phone Homer
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Ok its not good to poo poo Amiga projects so good luck, Its not for me and I think your take some of the Fun away thats why I get a bit worked up.
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25 August 2015, 17:53 | #327 |
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i don't know how it takes any fun away, to provide the sort of high-level functionality that AMOS provides to other languages
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25 August 2015, 17:58 | #328 |
Phone Homer
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I think the bounty is to add wrap around and some other stuff to Amos and other languages.
I think once you start doing this your just end up with command line backbone in theory this is ok but games might not have individuality. But like I say I shouldnt knock it. |
25 August 2015, 18:07 | #329 |
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well we already get a lot of backbone games anyway, unfortunately backbone is very slow and clunky, so it could only be an improvement there.
but i thought the point was to provide such basic things as scrolling playfields, a bob engine, music playroutines and sound effect engine &c.. you'd still need to program the actual game itself. |
25 August 2015, 18:21 | #330 | |
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Modern compilers will of course store parameters in registers where available before touching the stack, but I'm not sure how often that sort of thing was done back in the day - it's quite an old method. There are also other methods available now with these days of large CPU caches to mitigate this speed penalty, but for things like AMOS they couldn't be taken advantage of. D. |
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25 August 2015, 18:25 | #331 |
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yeah yeah fair enough i do know how function calls work at the low level, but pushing a couple of 32 bit integers on the stack really doesn't account for how slow AMOS's procedure calls are, there must be something else going on there.
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25 August 2015, 19:11 | #332 | |
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@Boo Boo: Whatever you say, the Amiga development scene needs this boost. At the moment, there is no pathway for someone to easily get into Amiga programming and master the hardware at their own pace. AMOS is slow and a dead-end in terms of learning; Blitz teaches some concepts about Amiga hardware but is still a dead-end (as well as doing its best to alienate everyone with its IDE). The only thing left is learning low-level hardware tricks from scratch. That's a big ask if you're short on time. I hope I've got this wrong, but you seem to like the fact that learning Amiga programming is made as difficult as possible, with no leg-ups, no means of learning while having fun - just a hard slog where everyone has to learn to reinvent the wheel. |
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25 August 2015, 19:17 | #333 |
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I have no real preference for language - I dont see basic as a dead language if anything its coming back but thats not the point. I have no problems with C,E or Asm whatever. What im saying is have a bit of pride and write the routines yourself - Like the old school demo scene or the guys working on Rygar.
Amos often gets the blame for peoples shortcomings is this not half the problem - people will still complain I need more done for me. Last edited by Retro1234; 25 August 2015 at 19:26. |
25 August 2015, 19:31 | #334 | |
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That's just speculation though; I've not read the Amos source code. D. |
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25 August 2015, 19:33 | #335 | ||
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Quote:
Quote:
Code:
print "Hello world!" if user.state=available if(user.state==available) print("Hello world!"); // C languages Code:
name:="BASIC" if user.level=beginner else "C++" name=(user.level==beginner)? "BASIC" : "C++"; // C languages |
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25 August 2015, 19:39 | #336 | |
Phone Homer
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25 August 2015, 19:55 | #337 | |
Code Kitten
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Libraries just abstract part of the work needed to make a game and how you compose them is up to you. Frameworks impose you a particular philosophy of game creation and design. These are two very different creatures. The alternative to using libraries is to rewrite all code from scratch every time. Libraries just gather useful functions together in a coherent set so that previous work does not need to be re-done. I say let's all hug Samurai Crow! |
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25 August 2015, 20:01 | #338 |
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Even c and asm use existing libraries.
This is more inline with Samurai_crows project. Its not really much different than SDL, opengl, etc. (Only I suspect less of a fully fledged api). Different kettle of fish to something like backbone. As Mrs. Beanbag said, you still have to code it yourself. As for blitz, well, fewer restrictions there as it let's a user use existing APIs.... Cgx, p96, ahi, SDL, opengl,.... whatever. edit: seems ReadOnlyCat beat me to it by a matter of seconds edit2: despite continuing to join in the convo. I still think the last few pages warrant a separate thread Last edited by beezle; 25 August 2015 at 20:07. |
25 August 2015, 20:08 | #339 |
Phone Homer
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I doubt we will see this but I've been an amigan a long time and heard all this before. But you take away the collision and scrolling your not writing the game yourself realy.I don't care about language or libs etc - The goal is to take away everything
Last edited by Retro1234; 25 August 2015 at 20:15. |
25 August 2015, 20:54 | #340 |
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I don't really understand your last post, and this is over-simplifying things a little because thus far it seems you don't understand, but where do you think commands come from?
They come from functions in libraries. Even in Amos. |
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