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Old 16 August 2018, 20:42   #101
eXeler0
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foebane View Post
The way things turned out, we can only read this and cry.

If that had happened, the PA RISC based Amiga would have a different struggle vs X86 and we already know how the PPC vs X86 wars ended..
Even the CD64 would have struggled.. With performance matching the PS1 but probably crappy software line up.. To keep price down they'd probably not include the mentioned "AGA on a chip" just to be able to run old software in emulation mode.. (Remember, this is the company that put 1kB memory for save games on the CD32) ;-)
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Old 16 August 2018, 22:42   #102
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Originally Posted by eXeler0 View Post
If that had happened, the PA RISC based Amiga would have a different struggle vs X86 and we already know how the PPC vs X86 wars ended..
Even the CD64 would have struggled.. With performance matching the PS1 but probably crappy software line up.. To keep price down they'd probably not include the mentioned "AGA on a chip" just to be able to run old software in emulation mode.. (Remember, this is the company that put 1kB memory for save games on the CD32) ;-)
that war inst over PPC still alive
maybe not in your desktop but in general
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Old 20 August 2018, 17:06   #103
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I am a complete hardware noob...

Would it be possible for Commodore at that time to develop custom chip that would help 3D stuff run much faster on (slower) Motorola processors? Something better then Akkiko. Maybe something like PS 1 had.

Amiga always had that multitask multiprocessor advantage, and some custom stuff that could push 3D, could be at that time something revolutionary.
The Hombre chipset was supposed to tackle the arrival of 3D acceleration in consoles, but it would have been a clean break from the traditional Amiga architecture:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amiga_Hombre_chipset
Different CPU, no Planar support, Windows NT, legacy compatibility only via emulation, developed in collaboration with HP...

For just running Doom however, a faster bus, faster RAM, a faster CPU as standard, and chunky mode would probably have been enough. Pretty major changes, but not impossible. The PC went through such an evolution between the mid 80's and early 90's (while the Amiga remained fairly stagnant).

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Originally Posted by zardoz View Post
Apple had a pretty tough time of it in the mid 90s too, no idea if they were on the brink. Was it the iMac and the iPod that turned it round for them?

It's probably useful to compare Apple's and Commodore's fates - niche computer makers squashed by the PC juggernaut on one side and Japanese consoles on the other. Is it that Apple cultivated a brand? It's not tech. or engineering that got Apple through but marketing.

An earlier suggestion for the A500 / A600 to go downmarket is the only way I can see C surviving that, if they had carved themselves out a niche market as the cheap / first / bedroom computer.
Ironically, it was Microsoft who saved Apple. They invested $150 million in Apple months before they were about to go bankrupt (around '97). They also developed Microsoft Office for MacOS, which was a huge deal that made the Mac more accepted in offices and schools, as Office had become completely dominant by that time. Internet Explorer was also made available for MacOS. It wasn't an act of kindness (though Bill Gates and Steve Jobs were friends), Microsoft also saw it as a way to expand their market to new platforms. Microsoft was a software company after all, and they had more software products than just Windows.
The iPod didn't come out until 2001, so this (combined with clever marketing like the colorful iMac) kept Apple afloat for those difficult years.

Could something similar have happened with the Amiga and Commodore? Sadly, yes. Had Commodore allowed Sun Microsystems to produce the A3000UX under license, they could have gained a foothold in the Unix Workstation market, leading to some much needed infusion of cash...
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Old 20 August 2018, 17:16   #104
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Originally Posted by Bruce Abbott View Post
Meh. Give me an 8 bit demo that does things which should be impossible on a machine with no Blitter or Copper or sprites.

[ Show youtube player ]
Impressive stuff, I notice there is also a making off document over at pouët. Which I always love to read, so thanks for pointing out this little gem

Last edited by roondar; 20 August 2018 at 17:18. Reason: poüet, pouët..
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Old 20 August 2018, 21:31   #105
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Could something similar have happened with the Amiga and Commodore? Sadly, yes. Had Commodore allowed Sun Microsystems to produce the A3000UX under license, they could have gained a foothold in the Unix Workstation market, leading to some much needed infusion of cash...

This and releasing in the Japanese marketplace, they had a Commodore Japan so translating the OS shouldnt have been a problem.
The only competition would have been the X68000 and that was quite a bit more expensive.


Personally,
The A1200 should NOT have been styled like the A500/A600
The A1200 and A4000 should have shared the SAME motherboard!


1. The casing on the A1200 should be smaller in height than the A4000 with enough space to fit the Floppy Drives/HDD and no space for the full Riser/Expansion card in the middle.
2. The top of the casing can be removed and turned into an A4000 with the purchase of the riser card and top part of the casing.
3. Various CPU options available from 68020 upwards.
Remember, many of these were Xmas gifts or saving pocket money/weekend jobs not everyone could afford the high end and there has to be an ENTRY point somewhere


I think moving to 32bit outweighed the higher clocked 16bit CPU.
Can you run an A4000 with a 68000 CPU? I guess it could be possible, anyone tried just for the kicks?
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Old 21 August 2018, 15:16   #106
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If we are rewriting history let me put my spin on it and suggest that the A500+ should of had the AGA chipset as that for me makes more sense in terms of the upgrade AGA brought. The A600 should have been the "new" A500 released as a base model along side the A500+ (if that makes sense) and the CD32 should have come 1 year earlier and just be called Amiga CD or something else but drop the 32bit thing as while technically correct the games wouldn't live up to that.

Other than that I personally wouldn't mess with the hardware but I would have focused on a new computer, possibly totally dropping the Amiga name and bring that to the fore in terms of a new 3D chipset.

I often look at the other consoles of the time and think to myself that regardless of the move commodore made the PC market would have killed them on the computing end and the playstation would have killed them on the console end so despite what we may dream I don't think anything we can dream would have extended the life of this budget computer company much past the mid 90s. It would have taken a massive shake up and move into one or the other. Computer or Games Console but even that may not have been enough and maybe would have been to much of a step for a company such as commodore to take.
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Old 21 August 2018, 16:01   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foebane View Post
The way things turned out, we can only read this and cry.
If Commodore's plans with Hombre, PA-RISC and Winows NT had materialised, Amiga users would indeed have been crying.
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