18 February 2003, 16:02 | #1 | |
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Ram
There was something I never would have thought about as I didn’t think it mattered until I read this posted by Syko.
Quote:
Also Why can’t I select any Fast RAM unless I set chip RAM to 2MB? Any help would be appreciated to see if a correction is required here: http://jambo.abime.net/howto.php?view=2 Thanks |
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20 February 2003, 18:48 | #2 |
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As i stated somewhere around the "teaching Toni W., how Amiga memory allocation SHOULD be made", Z3 fastram is a not much used thing, and its not true, that CPU have a fast acess to it - the acess go trought Z3 bus, what slow-things down considerably.
Thats why it never get used. ppls should use fastram - but since you can set only 8MB of it (even you emulating full 68020 or 68EC040 (emulator needs a correction there) ), what is not enought, its curently the only one way to do it - unless Toni W. take my recommendations seriously enought and change the max. 8MB of fast to max. 128MB of fast, with priority +30 and also report it at proper 32bit fastram - because programs (some of these) use even chipram, when see slow-fastmem... Then come time, when you should change your recommendations |
20 February 2003, 19:56 | #3 |
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I still don't see the point. All RAM is exactly the same speed under JIT-mode, there is no need for different types of fast RAM under emulation. Z3-RAM was originally most likely selected because it supports very large RAM sizes.
You are still trying to do something that UAE is not designed to do. (emulating specific A3000 or A4000 configuration) Also stop complaining. There is quite a big difference between complaining and constructive critisism. Finally, don't forget that UAE/WinUAE sources are available for free |
20 February 2003, 20:23 | #4 |
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Okey, dokey, but for Amiga, about 128MB of ram at max is enought, so, its not need for Z3 ram because of "very large sizes"
And futhermore, fastram is more common for Amiga users ...not to mention that Z3 adresspace is a little bit obscure And im sorry, i trying to conconstructive, did not i pointed out interesting and very easily fixable quirks? And please dont tell me, that im trying to do something, for what is not WinUAE designed to - its just nonsens. Everybody have into Amiga fastram. No-one Z3 expansion ram, or WTF it is So, allowing us a little bit more of fastram, when 020+ is used - its not that crazy or abusive, it is? Then im sorry! ...but do you planing to correct the mistakes, like reporting the 68EC040 as 68040, well? |
20 February 2003, 20:29 | #5 | |
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20 February 2003, 20:35 | #6 |
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Thanks Burseg! That's what I wanted, constructive comment. I've never had a A1200 so wasn't sure of the right settings.
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20 February 2003, 20:59 | #7 |
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Burseg - actually, even some AGA demos requiring very quite close to 2MB of chipram - but with P96 its really not need to use more that 2MB - because when display is into fastram and RTG ram, it dont eat chipmem and then...
Its one of the benefits, even on real amiga, to use RTG gfx - bye bye "not enought chip-ram" problems |
20 February 2003, 21:05 | #8 | ||
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20 February 2003, 21:06 | #9 |
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Most demos don't use the RTG shite, so one can stick that nice P96 up a donkey's arse.
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20 February 2003, 21:33 | #10 |
old Amiga fanatic
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Toni, well, i do NOT want to confuse anyone
Just allow, pretty please, more that 8MB of fastram, when user select a 68020+ Limit it to 128MB and map it to $08 000 000 - $10 000 000 Thats all. It dont confuse anyone, at least i hope so! Do you think that this is good idea? Ah, im sorry, yes, EC is 040 W/O everything, just like cripled 24bit adreses of EC020 and 030 cpus... T he 040 CPUs (actually, 060 too, just 030 is diferent) is sorted that way: 68040 - full, including FPU/MMU 68LC040 - no FPU only (EC aka EConomic), sadly i have 2 that ones, 33Mhz, want it? For free... 68EC040 - no FPU and MMU (LC aka LowCost - crap ) ...but the suggestion for EC come from conclusion, that LC040 have an active MMU too... (tought Thomas R. have to fix for me (and others too, ofcourse) one bug to make the MMU init work on LC040 ones, but thats betatesting ) ...witch UAE very sadly lacking off... So, the very most precise naming for WinUAE is: 68EC040+FPU ...but maybe you can add also just the EC040 - no fpu - tought it probably did not make much sense... ...just as another suggestion - what about to report an FPU as 68882? IIRC 68881 dont difer from 68882, its just slower - but feel free to prove me wrong Akira - true, but - shitie? :eek And actually, every the modern ones, starting as long ago, as 1997, using RTG, when available And with not bad results, at least on decent Z3 bus and fast GFX card (CV64 (not 3D!) or PIV recommended - CV64 is actually faster, when come to pure writing speed, thanks to the chip is a VLBUS one, witch dont need the Zorro2PCI bridge, cause VLBUS is quite similar to Zorro ). |
20 February 2003, 22:04 | #11 | |
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B O L L O X??? I downloaded loads of new demos and they don't even say "hey, there's an option for rtg". I bet next thing you say is "that's because the coders sucked" |
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20 February 2003, 22:05 | #12 |
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Actually being able to select regular fast ram up to 64 or maybe 128mb would be more realistic. Otherwise an emulated EC020 amiga can't have more than 2+8+1 ram which it not the case with real amigas.
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20 February 2003, 22:29 | #13 | ||
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Quote:
I think it would be possible to have extra ~1-1.5MB of RAM at "empty" space between custom chips and KS ROM but that can't be too useful.. Quote:
Edit: fixed RAM amounts.. Last edited by Toni Wilen; 21 February 2003 at 08:01. |
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20 February 2003, 22:41 | #14 | |
old Amiga fanatic
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Akira - most demos did not mention it, but do it
You will realize, when you run the demo and have a RTG system installed. Hey, evel Euskal party invitations have a RTG support build-in! Burseg - im pretty good aware of the limitation of the cripled EC 24bit adressing, thats why i mention, that it have to be awailable only when there is selected a real 020+ Toni Wilen - Quote:
Well, cut the cheese - lets face it, there is no possible reason (since under emulation all the "ram" is same fast) to anyone want 24bit fastram - lest force 32bit fastram, when come to nonEC 020+ cpus and - Burseg was right - even 64MB will be fine (i curently using only 32MB and its fine) - or128 - it IMHO did nto matter, do it? |
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21 February 2003, 10:51 | #15 |
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I have decided to change settings to:
* Chip - Set to 2 MB * Fast - Somewhere around 4 to 8 MB * RTG (graphics card) - Somewhere between 4 to 32 MB |
21 February 2003, 12:27 | #16 | |
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21 February 2003, 12:33 | #17 |
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Because that has a 68030 on board with totally different address space specs?
What is the most you can stick in an '030 Blizzard card btw? I have 8mb currently. |
21 February 2003, 12:35 | #18 |
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It might be, but then again, WinUAE doesn't have an option to have more than 8mb fast regardless of the processor!
I only have 32mb ram modules available and they work with 1230-IV. I've got 2x32=64mb on my 040/PPC 603e Amiga-hardware says, 128mb is possible on a 1230-IV 603e manual also mentions the same amount. |
21 February 2003, 12:55 | #19 | |
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Quote:
68881/68882: I think the only real difference was speed which is currently irrelevant under emulation. I think it is quite pointless to implement cycle-exact FPU emulation |
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21 February 2003, 13:12 | #20 |
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Memory, memory...
Echo/Burseg - any full (not EC!) 020/030 cpu (LC and EC 040/060 as wel) can handle 4G of adressspace (32bit). How the space is maintained is up to AmigaOS specs.
Mostly there is a 128MB limit, but with Blizzard seried, when you add a SCSI kit, you can stick 128MB module into it, what with 64MB into Blizzard itself can show as 192MB of ram Mine Blizz+scsi kit has got 2x 64MB 50nS ram modules, getting 128MB of ram. Toni Wilen - yes, there is no big diference, except the very confusing naming "Z3 fastram" - most long time Amiga users never ever hear about it at all! And i wont call is Z2-fast at all! Hell, simply fast-ram! And its already there, just pretty please increase the limit of it to 128MB, when 020+ is choosen, thanks! (together with correcting the adressing space) 68881/68882 - i think too, but im lazy to check manuals, so, i could be proven wrong And no, i dont asked for this, i asked for reporting the FPU as 68882 instead of 68881, cause the speed is more close to 68882 Acutally, its much faster, but thats sure closely to 68882 that "1", right? And its better to implement a MMU, that realy pointless exact cycle fpu emulation You are so damn right there! |
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