Best Backup Strategy

16 July 2012, 23:45

Hi. Long time lurker and Amiga user. But as a new poster I thought it best to post here.

I have an A1200 with ACA1230/28 and a Compact Flash as a hard disk. Runs brilliantly. I'm on Workbench 3 as I want to run a classic system.

It occurred to me that it would be an idea to back up the copious amount of data I have on my "HD" so I purchased a PCMCIA to Compact Flash adaptor from Amiga Kit.

Managed to LHA my Workbench partition using the Easy ADF software backup option to the PCMCIA CF card. Took a couple of hours. So I know it works.

However the other partitions on my CF card are larger. Specifically 2GB each. I tried to back one up..........

24 hours later (yes, really!) the poor old Amiga was was still working away. Obviously this wasn't the best strategy.

Truth be told I don't need the compression. I just need to be able to do a direct exact copy (like xcopy of old on the PC or Carbon Copier on the mac) to a CF card on the PCMCIA slot. Drag and drop didn't seem to work well.

So is there an Amiga app for Workbench 3 that will do the job for me, perhaps also giving useful info so I know how far it has got?

Any tips so that I can create regular easy backups via PCMCIA CF card?

Thanks.

fitzsteve · 17 July 2012, 00:17

Backups via PCMCIA are really slow, it's no good for large amounts of data as you have found.

Best option for this kind of backup would be an accelerator with SCSI such as the Blizzard 1230MkIV + SCSI kit & external drive in case but I see you already have a nice ACA1231.

So in your case my advice would be to mount the CF card by the rear expansion slot for SCSI or under the trapdoor in the space left from the ACA using longer IDE cable then you can easily remove the CF and backup with WinUAE in Turbo Mode.

Once you have your backups on the PC it's much easier to restore and prep future CF's too.

There are also CF-IDE adapters that you can mount above the PCMCIA slot (requires that you file the slot out a bit though)

This will mean you can have access to the CF all the time

http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=57678

wXR · 17 July 2012, 00:24

is there something like rsync for amiga?

17 July 2012, 00:45

PCMCIA access is indeed slow, but the LHA'ing option probably isn't helping.

I have been trying to copy one directory at a time but that is rather labour intensive.

I don't mind it being slow. Backups will only be occasional. But 24 hours + (that is when I gave up) seems excessive. And the problem is I had no indication of how far it had got.

What is needed is a manual copier that tells you what it's up to. Something we take for granted today when we drag and drop files on Windows or OSX.

Ideally I don't want to be pulling apart the Amiga again. I've just got it how I want it.

Thanks.

Leffmann · 17 July 2012, 01:04

If that CF in the card slot is using an Amiga filesystem then you can just clone all the files like this on the command line:

Code:

copy DH0: CF0:DH0 all clone quiet

Should be a little bit faster than using LHA at least.

The key to doing this in a fast way is of course to do incremental backups and only transfer the files that have changed or been added since last time, but I don't know any program that does this.

17 July 2012, 11:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leffmann

If that CF in the card slot is using an Amiga filesystem then you can just clone all the files like this on the command line:

Code:

copy DH0: CF0:DH0 all clone quiet

Think the CF card is FAT since my Mac can happily read and write to it.

I'm in a slightly odd situation where I got hold of a version of Workbench that was already setup on a CF card which saved me having to do it myself. As such it has utils and stuff installed that I don't have much idea about. So I assume it has something that means its happy using FAT volumes because it seemed odd that the Mac was happy to read and write to it.

But since the Amiga is happily using the CF card like any other volumes, I guess the command line might indeed work. Will try it later.

Thanks.

daxb · 17 July 2012, 13:29

For regulary backups I would recommend a "mirror" backup tool. I know MirrorCopy by Jan Hendrik Schulz and BackUp by Daniel Westerberg (both on Aminet). First backup is just a copy and tooks some time. Further backups should be much faster.

Retrofan · 17 July 2012, 19:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by daxb

For regulary backups I would recommend a "mirror" backup tool. I know MirrorCopy by Jan Hendrik Schulz and BackUp by Daniel Westerberg (both on Aminet). First backup is just a copy and tooks some time. Further backups should be much faster.

So, do you mean that it just update them with the changes?

daxb · 17 July 2012, 20:41

Yes, it scans source and target for equal files. So only changed data will copied to target. More info about you can find in the docs.

xc8 · 17 July 2012, 20:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by chinnyhill10

....
I have an A1200 with ACA1230/28 and a Compact Flash as a hard disk. Runs brilliantly. I'm on Workbench 3 as I want to run a classic system.

...

Put that card on your PC and "dd" as image...

18 July 2012, 02:17

Found a program on Aminet called "Backup" by Denill715. Have set it up and seems to be working so far.

The big bonus is that its showing me exactly what it's doing in terms of data copied and what file is being copied at the current time. So at least I have some indication of what is going on.

Will leave the old girl on overnight and will see how far she's got in the morning.

Cheers.

melbourneben! · 18 July 2012, 04:46

You could use TAR rather than LHA, atleast then it wouldn't compress and probably save you time.

18 July 2012, 16:24

So, 12 hours to copy a partition. It seemed to work although for 60,000 odd files it had 65,000 "errors" in the log. It doesn't specify what "errors" are and so far the copies seem intact. Hmmmmm.

fitzsteve · 18 July 2012, 18:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by chinnyhill10

So, 12 hours to copy a partition. It seemed to work although for 60,000 odd files it had 65,000 "errors" in the log. It doesn't specify what "errors" are and so far the copies seem intact. Hmmmmm.

Is the max transfer setting on the CF card correct? It should be 0x1FE00 and you can see this under advanced partitioning options within HDToolbox.

Be careful when using HDToolbox as you can quite easily delete a partition and if you save changes you'll be in trouble!

If you have an incorrect Max Transfer setting any files over 256kb could corrupt when copying and explain the errors (the software might be trying to verify files)

Cammy · 18 July 2012, 18:48

Why didn't anyone suggest an uncompressed LHA? It's much faster to archive than a compressed one, it's what I always use to backup the Amigas.

Open a Shell and change directory to the root of the partition you want to backup, then type this:

LHA -eraxz a CF0:Backup

It will make an uncompressed 1:1 copy of your hard drive partition with all metadata intact. To extract it, type this:

LHA -xa x CF0:Backup.lha

If you haven't already, use the AddBuffers command to give CF0: more buffers to make it go faster:

AddBuffers CF0: 330

Should be enough.

19 July 2012, 00:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cammy

Why didn't anyone suggest an uncompressed LHA? It's much faster to archive than a compressed one, it's what I always use to backup the Amigas.

Thanks, am trying that now.

Having an Amiga with a hard disk is a new experience for me. Until I got the CF card, I purely had a dual floppy system which is what I used back in the day. Now I am discovering the wonders of Workbench!

I had all sorts of stuff for my Amiga. Scanner, Vidi, sampler, etc. But a hard disk of a useful size was about as obtainable as a jet pack!

The advantage of LHA is that the Mac can't spew hidden files all over the directory system when I copy the files back onto here for safe keeping!

Will keep you guys posted as to if the backup succeeds. At the moment there's just lots of flashing!

Cheers.

daxb · 19 July 2012, 12:25

It seems you have a general hardware/software problem. You may test with Check4GB. PCMCIA isn`t good choice for backup large amount of data as already mentioned here. Already mentioned was using WinUAE (fastest backup). Normaly data devices (HD, CF) are connected to internal IDE port (two devices can be connect if I`m not wrong). More speed you will get by a IDE/ATA controller like IDE-Fix, FastATA, ... where you can connect 4 devices. Make sure that your system works (filesystem, MaxTransfer, 4GB support, etc.) before you start a next backup session.

20 July 2012, 23:42

The backup did succeed and seems to be fine. However it took 26 hours!

Now contemplating if I just take the back off to clone the other partition!

Cheers.

Cammy · 21 July 2012, 02:00

How many buffers do your drives have? That is quite slow for 2GB to be backed up on a 28Mhz 030. I suppose the filesystem you might be using could slow it down too, but it always helps to add buffers to the partitions before doing a lot of disk access. I find 350 all up is a decent number of buffers to get things done.

In any case, after you have backed up I recommend reformatting the CF drive with PFS3 if it's not already. This is the fastest filesystem for your Amiga, faster even than SFS.

16 July 2012, 23:45	#1
chinnyhill10 Posts: n/a	Best Backup Strategy Hi. Long time lurker and Amiga user. But as a new poster I thought it best to post here. I have an A1200 with ACA1230/28 and a Compact Flash as a hard disk. Runs brilliantly. I'm on Workbench 3 as I want to run a classic system. It occurred to me that it would be an idea to back up the copious amount of data I have on my "HD" so I purchased a PCMCIA to Compact Flash adaptor from Amiga Kit. Managed to LHA my Workbench partition using the Easy ADF software backup option to the PCMCIA CF card. Took a couple of hours. So I know it works. However the other partitions on my CF card are larger. Specifically 2GB each. I tried to back one up.......... 24 hours later (yes, really!) the poor old Amiga was was still working away. Obviously this wasn't the best strategy. Truth be told I don't need the compression. I just need to be able to do a direct exact copy (like xcopy of old on the PC or Carbon Copier on the mac) to a CF card on the PCMCIA slot. Drag and drop didn't seem to work well. So is there an Amiga app for Workbench 3 that will do the job for me, perhaps also giving useful info so I know how far it has got? Any tips so that I can create regular easy backups via PCMCIA CF card? Thanks.

17 July 2012, 01:04	#5
Leffmann Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Sweden Posts: 2,269	If that CF in the card slot is using an Amiga filesystem then you can just clone all the files like this on the command line: Code: copy DH0: CF0:DH0 all clone quiet Should be a little bit faster than using LHA at least. The key to doing this in a fast way is of course to do incremental backups and only transfer the files that have changed or been added since last time, but I don't know any program that does this.

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17 July 2012, 00:17	#2
fitzsteve Professional slacker! Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Kent, UK Age: 44 Posts: 6,683	Backups via PCMCIA are really slow, it's no good for large amounts of data as you have found. Best option for this kind of backup would be an accelerator with SCSI such as the Blizzard 1230MkIV + SCSI kit & external drive in case but I see you already have a nice ACA1231. So in your case my advice would be to mount the CF card by the rear expansion slot for SCSI or under the trapdoor in the space left from the ACA using longer IDE cable then you can easily remove the CF and backup with WinUAE in Turbo Mode. Once you have your backups on the PC it's much easier to restore and prep future CF's too. There are also CF-IDE adapters that you can mount above the PCMCIA slot (requires that you file the slot out a bit though) This will mean you can have access to the CF all the time http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=57678

17 July 2012, 00:24	#3
wXR Registered User Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: New York Posts: 552	is there something like rsync for amiga?

17 July 2012, 00:45	#4
chinnyhill10 Posts: n/a	PCMCIA access is indeed slow, but the LHA'ing option probably isn't helping. I have been trying to copy one directory at a time but that is rather labour intensive. I don't mind it being slow. Backups will only be occasional. But 24 hours + (that is when I gave up) seems excessive. And the problem is I had no indication of how far it had got. What is needed is a manual copier that tells you what it's up to. Something we take for granted today when we drag and drop files on Windows or OSX. Ideally I don't want to be pulling apart the Amiga again. I've just got it how I want it. Thanks.

17 July 2012, 13:29	#7
daxb Registered User Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Germany Posts: 3,303	For regulary backups I would recommend a "mirror" backup tool. I know MirrorCopy by Jan Hendrik Schulz and BackUp by Daniel Westerberg (both on Aminet). First backup is just a copy and tooks some time. Further backups should be much faster.

17 July 2012, 20:41	#9
daxb Registered User Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Germany Posts: 3,303	Yes, it scans source and target for equal files. So only changed data will copied to target. More info about you can find in the docs.

18 July 2012, 02:17	#11
chinnyhill10 Posts: n/a	Found a program on Aminet called "Backup" by Denill715. Have set it up and seems to be working so far. The big bonus is that its showing me exactly what it's doing in terms of data copied and what file is being copied at the current time. So at least I have some indication of what is going on. Will leave the old girl on overnight and will see how far she's got in the morning. Cheers.

18 July 2012, 04:46	#12
melbourneben! Registered User Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: adelaide Posts: 44	You could use TAR rather than LHA, atleast then it wouldn't compress and probably save you time.

18 July 2012, 16:24	#13
chinnyhill10 Posts: n/a	So, 12 hours to copy a partition. It seemed to work although for 60,000 odd files it had 65,000 "errors" in the log. It doesn't specify what "errors" are and so far the copies seem intact. Hmmmmm.

18 July 2012, 18:48	#15
Cammy Registered User Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Tasmania, Australia Age: 39 Posts: 1,189	Why didn't anyone suggest an uncompressed LHA? It's much faster to archive than a compressed one, it's what I always use to backup the Amigas. Open a Shell and change directory to the root of the partition you want to backup, then type this: LHA -eraxz a CF0:Backup It will make an uncompressed 1:1 copy of your hard drive partition with all metadata intact. To extract it, type this: LHA -xa x CF0:Backup.lha If you haven't already, use the AddBuffers command to give CF0: more buffers to make it go faster: AddBuffers CF0: 330 Should be enough.

19 July 2012, 12:25	#17
daxb Registered User Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Germany Posts: 3,303	It seems you have a general hardware/software problem. You may test with Check4GB. PCMCIA isn`t good choice for backup large amount of data as already mentioned here. Already mentioned was using WinUAE (fastest backup). Normaly data devices (HD, CF) are connected to internal IDE port (two devices can be connect if I`m not wrong). More speed you will get by a IDE/ATA controller like IDE-Fix, FastATA, ... where you can connect 4 devices. Make sure that your system works (filesystem, MaxTransfer, 4GB support, etc.) before you start a next backup session.

20 July 2012, 23:42	#18
chinnyhill10 Posts: n/a	The backup did succeed and seems to be fine. However it took 26 hours! Now contemplating if I just take the back off to clone the other partition! Cheers.

21 July 2012, 02:00	#19
Cammy Registered User Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Tasmania, Australia Age: 39 Posts: 1,189	How many buffers do your drives have? That is quite slow for 2GB to be backed up on a 28Mhz 030. I suppose the filesystem you might be using could slow it down too, but it always helps to add buffers to the partitions before doing a lot of disk access. I find 350 all up is a decent number of buffers to get things done. In any case, after you have backed up I recommend reformatting the CF drive with PFS3 if it's not already. This is the fastest filesystem for your Amiga, faster even than SFS.

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