The perfect gaming ingredients

Dastardly · 16 August 2002, 00:29

Taking bits a pieces from different games, What ingredients do you think would make the perfect game?

IMO...

The originality of LEMMINGS
The pure playability of SPEEDBALL 2
The longevity of FRONTIER
The atmosphere of SHADOW OF THE BEAST
The mind bending of CADAVER
The humour of SECRET OF MONKEY ISLAND
The simplicity of RAINBOW ISLANDS

Mix all these ingredients together and IMO you get the perfect game.

Amiga1992 · 16 August 2002, 01:14

I'd add the technical advancement of something like Kid Chaos or Elfmania.

But as a very last item.

I'd say the simplicity of RI goes in the field of playability, really.

And today, I rather have a fast arcade game than something as long-lasting as Frontier. It should have, though, immense replay value, through the unlocking of stuff, or whatever.

I go back to Sonic 2 on the Megadrive all the time, even after many years of its release and my first play at it, and it's not as complex as Frontier.

Unknown_K · 16 August 2002, 01:33

The perfect game has to be fun, have an addicting soundtrack, varied and harder levels as you progress, and something cool that no other game had ever done before or at least the way the game had used it. Also lately killer realistic graphics + fast multiplayer fun have been added to the obove requirements.

I loved the original centipede and still play it through emulation on the PSX/Dreamcast/Mame or on my 2600 if I am bored. But the 3d remake of centipede sucks ass. The speed/twitch of the original was lost. Simply making it 3d wasnt Cool, and since the concept had been done before it wasnt fresh.

Done underestimate the soundtrack either... I used to have the music from doom2 going through my head alot, just like the sounds of Mrs Packman when I left the arcades.

Twistin'Ghost · 16 August 2002, 02:46

Quote:

Originally posted by Unknown_K
The perfect game has to be fun, have an addicting soundtrack, varied and harder levels as you progress, and something cool that no other game had ever done before or at least the way the game had used it. Also lately killer realistic graphics + fast multiplayer fun have been added to the obove requirements.

I loved the original centipede and still play it through emulation on the PSX/Dreamcast/Mame or on my 2600 if I am bored. But the 3d remake of centipede sucks ass. The speed/twitch of the original was lost. Simply making it 3d wasnt Cool, and since the concept had been done before it wasnt fresh.

Done underestimate the soundtrack either... I used to have the music from doom2 going through my head alot, just like the sounds of Mrs Packman when I left the arcades.

The problem with game soundtracks is that if you spend any amount of time playing the game, the music becomes as redundant as listening to Top 40 radio. The old arcade games work for me. As for "lately killer realistic graphics + fast multiplayer fun"...I don't find these to be ingredients for a perfect gaming experience. Not by a long stretch. The best video/computer games so far have managed without realistic graphics (if you call jerky 3D, plastic-faced, expressionless characters on blurry landscapes realistic). Like Lemmings, for example. I think a more realistic ingredient should be escapism. We play the games to escape. Even if games were realistic, the novelty would wear thin fast. Regarding the multiplayer suggestion, to be a perfect ingredient, it should support single player just as well. Sometimes I just want nothing to do with this species and having to interact with others in a gaming environment flushes the escape I seek. Hence, multiplayer is just a variable.

Now I shall go play a round of Galaga.

Amiga1992 · 16 August 2002, 03:28

Quote:

Originally posted by Twistin'Ghost
The best video/computer games so far have managed without realistic graphics (if you call jerky 3D, plastic-faced, expressionless characters on blurry landscapes realistic).

I just don't see the fun in realism... Not to say any of today's games are realistic, despite what most people think (unless they all live in LSD all day and they are not sharing it).

Realism sucks. I play a game to get away from reality for a while and zap some aliens.
If you want realism, make a footy game where you start playing as a kid, but you suck, so nobody picks you for playing, and you have watch the game from outside and cry to momma. THAT'S REALISM FOR YOU!

The trend of trying to make games more "realistic" is utterly disgusting.

Djay · 16 August 2002, 03:58

i think publishers are unwilling to realise a non-realistic game because so-called realism is now the norm... sure there are a few games being released that, use old methods, but they think "if its not 3d is someway its not worth doing)

Sad but true

Since Spacewar, game creators have (to a point) used as much of the machines capacity as possible... they can't think of any new genres so they just make 3d games

i agree with Akira, more replay value is needed... earning extra levels etc, is now sometimes more important than completing the game!!!

Amiga1992 · 16 August 2002, 04:05

Quote:

Originally posted by Djay
Since Spacewar, game creators have (to a point) used as much of the machines capacity as possible...

On teh consoles this trend kind of continues, but not on the PC! on the PC the mentality is "make them upgrade their ram/vidcard/processor to play the game" instead of "let's see how much can we push this thing with these limited specs"

I preffer fixed specs becasue of this.

Unknown_K · 16 August 2002, 05:00

I said realism because I like having a real physics model for fps type games. Being able to toss a grenade and knowing it can bounce down a stairwell instead of sticking to the first place it hits. I think the texture mapping and lighting adds something to Unreat Tournament/Quake type games.

Well you dont have to upgrade your video card every 6 months when the next generation comes out to play games, but you probably will (or have to) by the 3rd or 4th generation. I think the card makers are going to run out of new features that will be used in the next couple of years and product cycles will slow down just like they did for soundcards after most makers went bust. Yes gaming on the PC is expensive as far as upgrades go, but like I said you dont have to get every new thing out to enjoy the games you like. I am getting tired of the games that are just all graphics thats why I am here in an EMU forum because I like alot of the older games that were 1v1 against the computer. Quake/UT without the online play against real people would have died off a long time ago because it gets boring. I love the capture the flag maps where you need a plan and teamwork to win.

As far as the PC game scene is getting cookie cutter because not too many companies want to spend millions in development on a title that has a good chance of bombing because its different. Sequels work for them because they have a known audience.

For replay value include a level/map editior in the game and see what the users come up with. That really worked for doom type games.

I stick with my opinion for online play, especially for rts type games that I like. Any game thats not a single player games will always be more fun against a human aponent then a lame computer generated one.

Amiga1992 · 16 August 2002, 05:05

Quote:

Originally posted by Unknown_K
I said realism because I like having a real physics model for fps type games. Being able to toss a grenade and knowing it can bounce down a stairwell instead of sticking to the first place it hits.

Well dunno, I never threw a grenade!(see what I mean?

)

Quote:

I am getting tired of the games that are just all graphics thats why I am here in an EMU forum because I like alot of the older games that were 1v1 against the computer.

At last we agree at something!

Only gaming going on on my PC is emu-related. But I haven't been using the PC for games for about 2 years already. When I want to game, I hook up one of me oldies. Now I can play most of the recent PC stuff, but I dont want to. And emulators now perform swiftly but, again, I dont want to.

Finish up that retro computer collection and you'll start thinking a lot different

Ah, I forgot. This is not an EMU forum, this is an AMIGA forum. That's why I'm here

Unknown_K · 16 August 2002, 05:41

Well the topic was perfect games requirements, didnt think it was specific to the Amiga.

Also what works for one type of game might not work for another.

I dont care weather you agree with me or not, but I value everybodies opinion on the matter because it points out things about a subject you might not have thaught of. Just as long as we all dont think our OPINIONS are FACT, we will all get along.

Shatterhand · 16 August 2002, 05:56

He, the perfect game? That's something hard to explain...

It depends of the kind of game you're playing. But for me, the main thing is: It has to be TESTING me, it has to be some kind of challenge, and it has to entertain me for some reason.

What make Tetris, Pacman , Rally-X or Tempest nice to play? They don't have much variation, but they are fun because you are always thinking fast, reacting fast, changing your strategy "on the fly", adaptating yourself to the situations in the game, situations that change at every second.

But you also have lemmings, chip's challenge, games where you can stop, take a deep breath, and think about the solution. You have to THINK, and that's something that have been entertaining people for ages (Why someone would enjoy doing cross-words?)

In games like Frontier or Elite, you can feel like you are living something else, something that could only exist in fantasy books, and you are free to do whatever you want in this new world. You can be a criminal, or you can be a federation soldier. You can break up from the problems of the real world, and just enjoy being something else for a while.

In R-Type, Battle Squadron , Xenon 2 or Apidya, you don't want to think, you don't want to believe you are in another world, all you want to do is blast some stuff, and dodge some bullets. Yeah, you just shout "shoot me", and dodge everything. You turn off your brain and let your reflexes talk by yourself. You test your skill at the maximum.

You have games like Monkey Island or Beneath a Steel Sky, where you have a great story running, and you can interact with the story.. you are PART of the story, it's just like being inside a movie.

Damn, I could be writing stuff like that for hours, and still I couldn't get to the point of what makes a good game. There are so many things that makes a game good. Does it need to be original, simple, complex. long, short, or anything? No, it doesn't. If you try to mix all this together, you probably won't get a good game (Actually, I think you would get a perfect $$$ money.. just look at the ads: The originality of X game, the gfx of Y game...). The only thing a game need to be good is to be FUN to play. And I mean REALLY fun, the kind of fun that makes you forget for a few minutes that there's a world outside of you, it makes you shout at your computer while playing it, it makes you celebrate when you win, it makes you laugh at the computer when you do a good move, it makes you shake while you play it, and when all is over, it makes you feel like the game is like a friend of yours.

He.. and I scored 0% in the geek test ,huh?

Drake1009 · 16 August 2002, 07:10

What I find good in gaming is wether the game feels thought over and how it plays.

If it's a game which has a simple concept, some challenges which aren't impossible and which isn't too hard getting to know what goes on the screen then it's good for me.

Games get repetitive, and their answer is new graphics and nothing else. Not a good solution.

No truly original game ideas come up lately.

Amiga1992 · 16 August 2002, 07:54

Quote:

Originally posted by Unknown_K
I dont care weather you agree with me or not, but I value everybodies opinion on the matter because it points out things about a subject you might not have thaught of. Just as long as we all dont think our OPINIONS are FACT, we will all get along.

Oh please, let's be friends, I never typed a reply in the EAB as long as the ones in the Amiga development thread. i'm tired!

You can dress a Sailor Mars costume if you want to. I'll be Chibimoon.

Shatterhand · 16 August 2002, 08:10

The concept of "Repetitive" is something I would like to talk about.

Take a game like Rally-X (I just LOVE this game). The concept is simple, and the levels are all the same. Yet I think the game is more refreshing than the latest FPS.

Probably because it's FAST, and while it's repetitive, you NEVER use the SAME strategy to win, unlike FPSs. Like I said in the above post, is the kind of game that you are always changing your strategy to what's happening in the screen. And the random factor of it makes that 2 games are never the same. (The flags are never in the same place). If you don't know Rally-X, you could take Tempest or Dig-Dug or even Tetris as an example.

alkis21 · 16 August 2002, 09:42

Quote:

Originally posted by Dastardly
Taking bits a pieces from different games, What ingredients do you think would make the perfect game?

IMO...

The originality of LEMMINGS
The pure playability of SPEEDBALL 2
The longevity of FRONTIER
The atmosphere of SHADOW OF THE BEAST
The mind bending of CADAVER
The humour of SECRET OF MONKEY ISLAND
The simplicity of RAINBOW ISLANDS

Mix all these ingredients together and IMO you get the perfect game.

Well you know me, I think Kick Off 2 is #1 when it comes to pure playability, longevity and simplicity.. that's why I think of it as the perfect game. I totally agree about the originality of LEMMINGS, I'd change the rest to:

The atmosphere of UNINVITED
The mind bending of MANHUNTER NEW YORK & SAN FRANCISCO
The humour of LEISURE SUIT LARRY 3 (Ok maybe I don't go out much)

And technics-wise:

The graphics of SIMON THE SORCERER II
The sound of AGONY

Now that I think of it, if we mixed all the above we'd probably have a crappy and confusing game.. just like most of today's PC games that try to squeeze all the genres in one.

16 August 2002, 09:46

The most realistic game that can be ever made might be a space shooter, or a fps in which the game refuses to let you continue, or let you restart or let you execute the program ever again, or even let you turn off the computer since you are dead anyway. If you blow it, the monitor will turn dark and will remain so.

Unknown_K · 16 August 2002, 10:25

When I think of realism I think of the physics model in the game. the environment has to look real to the period its suposed to be in. The environment should set the correct mood of the game, the sound and lighting should also.

I like the way Unreal tournament looks compared to the cartoony way quake 3 looks if that helps at all.

Are 2d games pretty much dead these days, everything is going 3d and I dont see the point of it in alot of games (RTS type anyway)

Drake1009 · 16 August 2002, 11:10

Quake 3? Cartoony? No no no. you're wrong. It's just ugly, has nothing to do with cartoony.

And yes, only a few games now a days are released in 2D. A shame since some games really would work so much better in 2D.

Amiga1992 · 16 August 2002, 17:59

Quote:

Originally posted by Unknown_K
Are 2d games pretty much dead these days, everything is going 3d and I dont see the point of it in alot of games (RTS type anyway)

*Bzzzzzzkkkkkkk!!!*

You are all forgetting about the GBA. THE platform for 2D.

Teh PS2 is getting a nice array of 2Ders too.

Fred the Fop · 16 August 2002, 22:02

7 buddies and a bunch of joints, and Genesis with NHL 93-95 or Madden 92-95.

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16 August 2002, 00:29	#1
Dastardly Into the Wonderful Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: England Age: 49 Posts: 2,335	The perfect gaming ingredients Taking bits a pieces from different games, What ingredients do you think would make the perfect game? IMO... The originality of LEMMINGS The pure playability of SPEEDBALL 2 The longevity of FRONTIER The atmosphere of SHADOW OF THE BEAST The mind bending of CADAVER The humour of SECRET OF MONKEY ISLAND The simplicity of RAINBOW ISLANDS Mix all these ingredients together and IMO you get the perfect game.

16 August 2002, 01:14	#2
Amiga1992 Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: ? Posts: 19,645	I'd add the technical advancement of something like Kid Chaos or Elfmania. But as a very last item. I'd say the simplicity of RI goes in the field of playability, really. And today, I rather have a fast arcade game than something as long-lasting as Frontier. It should have, though, immense replay value, through the unlocking of stuff, or whatever. I go back to Sonic 2 on the Megadrive all the time, even after many years of its release and my first play at it, and it's not as complex as Frontier.

16 August 2002, 01:33	#3
Unknown_K Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Location: Ohio/USA Age: 55 Posts: 1,380	The perfect game has to be fun, have an addicting soundtrack, varied and harder levels as you progress, and something cool that no other game had ever done before or at least the way the game had used it. Also lately killer realistic graphics + fast multiplayer fun have been added to the obove requirements. I loved the original centipede and still play it through emulation on the PSX/Dreamcast/Mame or on my 2600 if I am bored. But the 3d remake of centipede sucks ass. The speed/twitch of the original was lost. Simply making it 3d wasnt Cool, and since the concept had been done before it wasnt fresh. Done underestimate the soundtrack either... I used to have the music from doom2 going through my head alot, just like the sounds of Mrs Packman when I left the arcades.

16 August 2002, 03:58	#6
Djay 95th User Join Date: May 2001 Location: Brighton/UK Age: 48 Posts: 3,120	i think publishers are unwilling to realise a non-realistic game because so-called realism is now the norm... sure there are a few games being released that, use old methods, but they think "if its not 3d is someway its not worth doing) Sad but true Since Spacewar, game creators have (to a point) used as much of the machines capacity as possible... they can't think of any new genres so they just make 3d games i agree with Akira, more replay value is needed... earning extra levels etc, is now sometimes more important than completing the game!!!

16 August 2002, 05:00	#8
Unknown_K Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Location: Ohio/USA Age: 55 Posts: 1,380	I said realism because I like having a real physics model for fps type games. Being able to toss a grenade and knowing it can bounce down a stairwell instead of sticking to the first place it hits. I think the texture mapping and lighting adds something to Unreat Tournament/Quake type games. Well you dont have to upgrade your video card every 6 months when the next generation comes out to play games, but you probably will (or have to) by the 3rd or 4th generation. I think the card makers are going to run out of new features that will be used in the next couple of years and product cycles will slow down just like they did for soundcards after most makers went bust. Yes gaming on the PC is expensive as far as upgrades go, but like I said you dont have to get every new thing out to enjoy the games you like. I am getting tired of the games that are just all graphics thats why I am here in an EMU forum because I like alot of the older games that were 1v1 against the computer. Quake/UT without the online play against real people would have died off a long time ago because it gets boring. I love the capture the flag maps where you need a plan and teamwork to win. As far as the PC game scene is getting cookie cutter because not too many companies want to spend millions in development on a title that has a good chance of bombing because its different. Sequels work for them because they have a known audience. For replay value include a level/map editior in the game and see what the users come up with. That really worked for doom type games. I stick with my opinion for online play, especially for rts type games that I like. Any game thats not a single player games will always be more fun against a human aponent then a lame computer generated one.

16 August 2002, 05:41	#10
Unknown_K Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Location: Ohio/USA Age: 55 Posts: 1,380	Well the topic was perfect games requirements, didnt think it was specific to the Amiga. Also what works for one type of game might not work for another. I dont care weather you agree with me or not, but I value everybodies opinion on the matter because it points out things about a subject you might not have thaught of. Just as long as we all dont think our OPINIONS are FACT, we will all get along.

16 August 2002, 05:56	#11
Shatterhand Warhasneverbeensomuchfun Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Rio de Janeiro / Brazil Age: 41 Posts: 3,450	He, the perfect game? That's something hard to explain... It depends of the kind of game you're playing. But for me, the main thing is: It has to be TESTING me, it has to be some kind of challenge, and it has to entertain me for some reason. What make Tetris, Pacman , Rally-X or Tempest nice to play? They don't have much variation, but they are fun because you are always thinking fast, reacting fast, changing your strategy "on the fly", adaptating yourself to the situations in the game, situations that change at every second. But you also have lemmings, chip's challenge, games where you can stop, take a deep breath, and think about the solution. You have to THINK, and that's something that have been entertaining people for ages (Why someone would enjoy doing cross-words?) In games like Frontier or Elite, you can feel like you are living something else, something that could only exist in fantasy books, and you are free to do whatever you want in this new world. You can be a criminal, or you can be a federation soldier. You can break up from the problems of the real world, and just enjoy being something else for a while. In R-Type, Battle Squadron , Xenon 2 or Apidya, you don't want to think, you don't want to believe you are in another world, all you want to do is blast some stuff, and dodge some bullets. Yeah, you just shout "shoot me", and dodge everything. You turn off your brain and let your reflexes talk by yourself. You test your skill at the maximum. You have games like Monkey Island or Beneath a Steel Sky, where you have a great story running, and you can interact with the story.. you are PART of the story, it's just like being inside a movie. Damn, I could be writing stuff like that for hours, and still I couldn't get to the point of what makes a good game. There are so many things that makes a game good. Does it need to be original, simple, complex. long, short, or anything? No, it doesn't. If you try to mix all this together, you probably won't get a good game (Actually, I think you would get a perfect $$$ money.. just look at the ads: The originality of X game, the gfx of Y game...). The only thing a game need to be good is to be FUN to play. And I mean REALLY fun, the kind of fun that makes you forget for a few minutes that there's a world outside of you, it makes you shout at your computer while playing it, it makes you celebrate when you win, it makes you laugh at the computer when you do a good move, it makes you shake while you play it, and when all is over, it makes you feel like the game is like a friend of yours. He.. and I scored 0% in the geek test ,huh?

16 August 2002, 07:10	#12
Drake1009 Registered User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Denmark Posts: 2,284	What I find good in gaming is wether the game feels thought over and how it plays. If it's a game which has a simple concept, some challenges which aren't impossible and which isn't too hard getting to know what goes on the screen then it's good for me. Games get repetitive, and their answer is new graphics and nothing else. Not a good solution. No truly original game ideas come up lately.

16 August 2002, 08:10	#14
Shatterhand Warhasneverbeensomuchfun Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Rio de Janeiro / Brazil Age: 41 Posts: 3,450	The concept of "Repetitive" is something I would like to talk about. Take a game like Rally-X (I just LOVE this game). The concept is simple, and the levels are all the same. Yet I think the game is more refreshing than the latest FPS. Probably because it's FAST, and while it's repetitive, you NEVER use the SAME strategy to win, unlike FPSs. Like I said in the above post, is the kind of game that you are always changing your strategy to what's happening in the screen. And the random factor of it makes that 2 games are never the same. (The flags are never in the same place). If you don't know Rally-X, you could take Tempest or Dig-Dug or even Tetris as an example.

16 August 2002, 09:46	#16
oldpx Posts: n/a	The most realistic game that can be ever made might be a space shooter, or a fps in which the game refuses to let you continue, or let you restart or let you execute the program ever again, or even let you turn off the computer since you are dead anyway. If you blow it, the monitor will turn dark and will remain so.

16 August 2002, 10:25	#17
Unknown_K Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Location: Ohio/USA Age: 55 Posts: 1,380	When I think of realism I think of the physics model in the game. the environment has to look real to the period its suposed to be in. The environment should set the correct mood of the game, the sound and lighting should also. I like the way Unreal tournament looks compared to the cartoony way quake 3 looks if that helps at all. Are 2d games pretty much dead these days, everything is going 3d and I dont see the point of it in alot of games (RTS type anyway)

16 August 2002, 11:10	#18
Drake1009 Registered User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Denmark Posts: 2,284	Quake 3? Cartoony? No no no. you're wrong. It's just ugly, has nothing to do with cartoony. And yes, only a few games now a days are released in 2D. A shame since some games really would work so much better in 2D.

16 August 2002, 22:02	#20
Fred the Fop flaming faggot Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Versailles Age: 55 Posts: 2,808	7 buddies and a bunch of joints, and Genesis with NHL 93-95 or Madden 92-95.

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