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Old 10 October 2010, 14:49   #1
thomas
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Native display is scaled although it shouldn't be

Run WinUAE, select any quickstart config (preferredly one with text on the boot screen, i.e. Kick 2.0+, or add a HDD), click on start. Pixels are missing, although the display should fit.

The first hardcopy shows what winuae displays, the second one shows the same screen taken with an Amiga program from within the emulation. One can clearly see the difference.

Happens in windowed and fullscreen mode.
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Attached Files
File Type: uae WB31.UAE (12.0 KB, 91 views)
File Type: txt winuaebootlog.txt (12.5 KB, 113 views)
File Type: txt winuaelog.txt (8.7 KB, 112 views)
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Old 10 October 2010, 14:53   #2
Toni Wilen
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Working as designed. Default filter setting is to enable scaling to selected display mode (because everyone is always confused when they see tiny Amiga screen in the middle..)

Create default.uae that includes settings you want.
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Old 10 October 2010, 16:16   #3
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This is actually EXACTLY the problem I am struggling with in my thread here: http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=55687

Will look into default.uae. Is there some noscale=true setting one could apply, then, I take it?
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Old 10 October 2010, 16:20   #4
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Originally Posted by menace View Post
Will look into default.uae. Is there some noscale=true setting one could apply, then, I take it?
Just go to the filter panel and select 'none' in the topmost combobox. If you want to change it 'manually', search for 'gfx_filter' in your config and set it to 'no'.
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Old 10 October 2010, 16:26   #5
Toni Wilen
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Unfortunately there is no default that is perfect for everyone..

I become annoyed with all those reports that ask why on my 1920x1080 resolution screen I only have tiny Amiga graphics in the middle..

EDIT: perhaps apply scaling only in fullscreen if defaults are still enabled. or something..

Last edited by Toni Wilen; 10 October 2010 at 16:33.
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Old 10 October 2010, 17:17   #6
thomas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toni Wilen View Post
Working as designed. Default filter setting is to enable scaling to selected display mode (because everyone is always confused when they see tiny Amiga screen in the middle..)

Create default.uae that includes settings you want.
There is no filter. Filter is set to none. I want no filter. I just want a normal display without missing pixels. 640x512 centered in 800x600 display like I use it since version 0.8.8. (Filter would use interpolation which would at least look better than that.)

I cannot find any setting which influences this behaviour. Looks like "scale small resolutions" on RTG panel, but this does not change native display.
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Old 10 October 2010, 17:24   #7
Toni Wilen
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It really is working as designed

Set those "FS" values back to 1x in filter panel. (This should have been changed to use "Fullscreen (TV)" setting now that FS is only backwards compatibility setting. But I forgot.)

D3D only does interpolation if bilinear filter is enabled.
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Old 11 October 2010, 05:14   #8
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Funny that you're saying bilinear filter.

Thomas' first (left) screenshot DOES indeed look as if bilinear filter was active!
Just those typical artifacts I have to fight with when doing HOL screenshots. Looks VERY familiar, these thin I's and stuff.
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Old 11 October 2010, 08:16   #9
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Originally Posted by andreas View Post
Just those typical artifacts I have to fight with when doing HOL screenshots.
Hmm, never had problems with that. Just set the filter to 'none' or 'null' without any scaling and you will never see that effect.
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Old 11 October 2010, 12:11   #10
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@TCD
Hah, the actual fun begins once you have to hardcopy NATIVE Amiga interlaced screens w/thin fonts - another entirely different field. A lot of Oxford Softworks games in HOL are really pivotal examples to demonstrate that characteristic. Bilinear filter on will give better results than filter disabled in these (though special) cases, trust me on that.

(No, this screenshot was done by someone else but me. )

Last edited by andreas; 11 October 2010 at 12:19.
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Old 11 October 2010, 12:56   #11
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Ah, I see. Luckily we can now have them in Hi-Res (640x512) instead of being forced to to have a filtered Lo-Res one. I did a lot of text-adventures already that use the same screenmode.
Btw : Fixed
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Old 11 October 2010, 14:10   #12
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Originally Posted by Toni Wilen View Post
Set those "FS" values back to 1x in filter panel.
Ok, that did it. How should it occur to me that even if everything is set to default (= disabled) on the filter panel, that the size and position sliders apply nevertheless?

Additionally, you preach all the time that 720x568 is what comes next to the Amiga's native display size. So if I set window size to 720x568 (default), why does it need to scale? Which size does it scale to?

Quote:
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Funny that you're saying bilinear filter.

Thomas' first (left) screenshot DOES indeed look as if bilinear filter was active!
No. Bilinear filter would mean interpolation and looks rather nice. What the screenshot shows is the simplest nearest neighbour algorithm.


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Hmm, never had problems with that. Just set the filter to 'none' or 'null' without any scaling and you will never see that effect.
Yes, that's what I expected. But it does not work this way, because screen size is set to "FS" whatever that means.
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Old 11 October 2010, 14:24   #13
Toni Wilen
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Ok, that did it. How should it occur to me that even if everything is set to default (= disabled) on the filter panel, that the size and position sliders apply nevertheless?
Default does not mean disabled. Direct3D mode can always scale. (D3D is much more flexible than directdraw but GUI does not really know it)

Quote:
Additionally, you preach all the time that 720x568 is what comes next to the Amiga's native display size. So if I set window size to 720x568 (default), why does it need to scale? Which size does it scale to?
Something close but not same (yeah, it should be same but no one noticed until now..)

I guess everyone who posts here have some kind of default.uae...
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Old 11 October 2010, 14:28   #14
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Yes, that's what I expected. But it does not work this way, because screen size is set to "FS" whatever that means.
Guess it means 'fill screen' (/me waits for Toni to correct him ). I have null filter and 1x set in my default.uae, so I didn't notice that 'FS' is set now.
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Old 11 October 2010, 14:38   #15
Toni Wilen
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FS is fullscreen but fillscreen works fine too

I can see that FS being default wasn't such a good idea after all.. (but it was not noticed because no one, including me, really tested it without default.uae..)
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Old 11 October 2010, 23:12   #16
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Originally Posted by TheCyberDruid View Post
I did a lot of text-adventures already that...
Just out of plain curiosity, which ones? I mean, are they preserved anywhere? I guess they were homebrew stuff (or maybe you're a well known text adv author and I just didn´t know ) They are also probably written in german so I woiuldn't understand a word, anyway

And before I get charged with topic-stealing , just to show you that weird things do happen, since I upgraded to 2.3.0 I had the same issue with the opposite symptom, instead of missing pixels I had doubled ones:





First pic shows the funny effect, and the second one is the right display after doing the FS thing. Thanks everybody both for spotting the trouble and the fix!

--
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Old 11 October 2010, 23:16   #17
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Originally Posted by rockersuke View Post
Just out of plain curiosity, which ones? I mean, are they preserved anywhere? I guess they were homebrew stuff (or maybe you're a well known text adv author and I just didn´t know ) They are also probably written in german so I woiuldn't understand a word, anyway
I should have added a 'screenshots' there, shouldn't I? I meant : I did a lot of text-adventure screenshots... I actually started a text-adventure (in AmigaBASIC of course ), but that never went past the first room

Edit : Just so that you have an idea what I'm talking about
http://hol.abime.net/797 -> 320x256 version of a Hi-Res screen
http://hol.abime.net/3545 -> How it should look like
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Old 12 October 2010, 00:08   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCyberDruid View Post
I should have added a 'screenshots' there, shouldn't I? I meant : I did a lot of text-adventure screenshots... I actually started a text-adventure (in AmigaBASIC of course ), but that never went past the first room

Edit : Just so that you have an idea what I'm talking about
http://hol.abime.net/797 -> 320x256 version of a Hi-Res screen
http://hol.abime.net/3545 -> How it should look like

Oooops! sorry, I should have guessed I'm making, for my own purposes, a catalog of Amiga-specific text advs and related tools tracing anything I can spot at Lemon, HOL, Aminet, PD compilations, IF-Archive, etc... and your "lot of text adventures" just tinkled the wrong bell!

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Old 15 October 2010, 10:56   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCyberDruid View Post
Ah, I see. Luckily we can now have them in Hi-Res (640x512) instead of being forced to to have a filtered Lo-Res one.
Phhh...Tell me about it.

Quote:
I did a lot of text-adventures already that use the same screenmode.
Btw : Fixed
I noticed. Good work The former ones really looked hor-ri-ble (to say the least).
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