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Old 16 August 2019, 00:44   #1
ProdigalAmigan
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External Gotek Cortex/FlashFloppy causes havoc!

Hello fellow Amigans!

I've posted about this before but at that time I did not understand what I was dealing with really. Making a new thread for this and hoping I can figure it out with your help.

I have the following floppy drive setup:

DF0: Internal (Duh!)
DF1: Cumana CAX-354
DF2: Cumana CAX-354 (Gave up on the RocTec Slim for now...)
DF3: Gotek Cortex & F-F in reused External Floppy Enclosure

Now as long as I have the Gotek disconnected completely DF0-DF2 works perfectly both for reading and writing to floppy. When I connect the Gotek (regardless of which one) it reads perfectly from the Gotek but if you try to copy from the Gotek to DF1-DF2 the floppy (known good) reports errors when formatting or copying to and end up 'Unreadable'. (Same thing if you try to format a disk for example in DF1-DF2 when DF3 is connected)... didn't try DF0 ...

Disconnecting the Gotek again the floppy can be formatted again and used. I thought there was something wrong with the Gotek drive I had so bought a new one with FlashFloppy firmware. Did not improve things.

Could this be the external enclosure controller not playing nice with the Gotek(s) or could it be that I plugged something in the wrong way around?
The floppy cable is notched and the connector on the Gotek is also notched, so I assumed plugging it in that way would be correct.

However I did read online that it could be it's supposed to go in the other way around despite the notch:

"Do you have the 34 pin connector around the right way? You might find that that "helpful" notch on the gotek is the opposite needed for the Amiga."

But then I'm thinking if I plugged things in the wrong way around it wouldn't work at all when I'm plugging it in. And I don't want to risk blowing something up trying things... How can one be 100% certain things are getting plugged in the right way? I'm usually not worried to try things but the Amiga is something else.

I'm REALLY at my wits end with this now. Does anyone know if there is a way to make this work or ... is it hopeless? I guess I could just plug the Gotek when I need to access ADF files on the Amiga to install something and then leave it disconnected at all other times.

Any and all help with this is much appreciated!

//ProdigalAmigan

Last edited by ProdigalAmigan; 16 August 2019 at 00:49. Reason: Adding a little something. Again.
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Old 16 August 2019, 02:20   #2
R4M
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Maybe the enclosure is defective and responds when any SEL line is active. I would first try to only connect the Gotek and remove drives 1 and 2, and then check with Sysinfo, which drives the system detects. Maybe also test with https://github.com/keirf/Amiga-Stuff . If that does not show anything suspicious, swap enclosures and see if the behavior with all 4 drives connected stays the same.
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Old 16 August 2019, 02:40   #3
ProdigalAmigan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R4M View Post
...swap enclosures and see if the behavior with all 4 drives connected stays the same.
Thanks R4M for the suggestions. Good stuff. I would try this as you suggest but unfortunately I don't have another external enclosure/case to try.... I'm just hoping to pinpoint just what is the problem with this thing....
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Old 16 August 2019, 03:33   #4
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Well, you could disassemble one of your two external floppy drives.... A bit of work, but the only way to make sure, that your Gotek enclosure is working correctly.
Ok, maybe another way would be to disconnect your Gotek, turn on your computer, and after the system booted, connected the Gotek. Now the OS doesn't know about the Gotek and therefore should leave it alone. Now exercise the other three drives and watch for activity of the Gotek. If it becomes active, it reacts to other SEL lines and you have to change the jumpers of the enclosure or the Gotek, or the enclosure is defective.
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Old 16 August 2019, 22:29   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R4M View Post
Well, you could disassemble one of your two external floppy drives.... A bit of work, but the only way to make sure, that your Gotek enclosure is working correctly.
I would absolutely do this if it wasn't for the fact that the two known good external drives I have are the Cumana CAX-354. I found a Youtube video of a guy mounting a Gotek in one of those enclosures and he had to actually solder to get it to work as the connector didn't match up. So that's not going to happen.

Quote:
Now exercise the other three drives and watch for activity of the Gotek. If it becomes active, it reacts to other SEL lines and you have to change the jumpers of the enclosure or the Gotek
If this happens (activity on the Gotek when DF0-DF2 is being exercised), what exactly do I need to change on the Gotek for it to work?

//ProdigalAmigan
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Old 16 August 2019, 23:49   #6
R4M
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You can look for jumpers on the enclosure and switch between S0 and S1 in the Gotek. If everything else failes, you can disconnect SEL1 and SEL2 from the enclosure, by either cutting the cables or desoldering the pins at the connector.
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Old 17 August 2019, 00:09   #7
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On the Gotek there should be one jumper at S0 or S1. If there's a jumper at M0 you should probably remove it. If it is connected, the Gotek is active whenever the motor signal is on, which could cause your problem.
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Old 17 August 2019, 00:28   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R4M View Post
On the Gotek there should be one jumper at S0 or S1. If there's a jumper at M0 you should probably remove it. If it is connected, the Gotek is active whenever the motor signal is on, which could cause your problem.
Thank you for your kind help. Right now the Gotek has its jumper set at S0, with no jumper set for MO. I read somewhere that the jumper should be set at S0 and that the board inside the external enclosure would handle it.

Another strange thing I have noticed is that even if I move the switch in the back of the enclosure to the disabled position the Gotek still lights up. It does not seem to be actually *doing* anything then (but still interfering with DF1-DF2 as far as corrupting writing to these drives when it is plugged in)....

Could it simply be that my Amiga doesn't like having a third external drive attached? But then again that sounds strange as it works just fine with two external drives....

I have an Escom 1D4 Amiga 1200 (Escom floppy fix removed and using it with a "real" Amiga internal drive).

//ProdigalAmigan
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Old 17 August 2019, 01:03   #9
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The jumper at S0 causes the Gotek to respond if SEL0 is active. It depends on the enclosure, if this is the correct setting. Have you tried to disconnect df1 or df2? Would be interesting to see what changes.
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Old 17 August 2019, 21:39   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R4M View Post
The jumper at S0 causes the Gotek to respond if SEL0 is active. It depends on the enclosure, if this is the correct setting. Have you tried to disconnect df1 or df2? Would be interesting to see what changes.
Now I have tried switching the jumper to sit at S1 position instead. The end result then is that the Gotek shows up as DF3:Unreadable. Will try removing the other external drives and see what happens then. Or just one of them.

//ProdigalAmigan
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Old 18 August 2019, 13:38   #11
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Do you have a a500 or 2000?
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Old 18 August 2019, 13:44   #12
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Correct me if I am wrong, but isn‘t the max drivenumber df2 on the gotek?
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Old 18 August 2019, 14:33   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ModMumpitz View Post
Correct me if I am wrong, but isn‘t the max drivenumber df2 on the gotek?
The Gotek can be configured for S0 or S1 which will mean it will respond to either SEL0 or SEL1 of the interface/cable connected to it. Depending on where it is in the drive daisy chain that could range from DF0 to DF3.

EDIT: I drew this up to help remind me of how it all connects together:


Last edited by solarmon; 18 August 2019 at 15:35.
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Old 18 August 2019, 19:58   #14
ProdigalAmigan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ModMumpitz View Post
Correct me if I am wrong, but isn‘t the max drivenumber df2 on the gotek?
Hello Mumpitz!

I have an Amiga 1200 (Escom revision but with the Escom floppymod removed!) I was not aware that the Gotek would be limited to functioning as DF2 drive as the highest. I didn't think that would matter. The Amiga can have a max of 1x Internal and 3x external floppy drives as far as I know.
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Old 18 August 2019, 20:01   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solarmon View Post
The Gotek can be configured for S0 or S1 which will mean it will respond to either SEL0 or SEL1 of the interface/cable connected to it. Depending on where it is in the drive daisy chain that could range from DF0 to DF3.
As things are set up now I have the Gotek as DF3.
Though as I explained having it connected up together with the other drives introduces write errors when writing to DF1-DF2 (and possibly DF0 as well). None of these issues are seen as soon as I disconnect the Gotek.

It is simply jumpered as S0, no jumper on the MO pins.

Tried switching to S1 to see what would happen but that did not work well. Renders the Gotek to show any disk as DF3:Unreadable...

Last edited by ProdigalAmigan; 18 August 2019 at 21:16.
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Old 18 August 2019, 21:26   #16
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Hmmm made progress but ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by R4M View Post
Have you tried to disconnect df1 or df2? Would be interesting to see what changes.
Now I have tried something else. I disconnected DF2 and plugged in the Gotek in its place. THEN it works absolutely perfectly!!!! Reading/Writing the whole shebang....

I then tried setting things up as such:

DF1: CUMANA CAX-354
DF2: GOTEK
DF3: CUMANA CAX-354

-- At which point the DF3 drive started going nuts much like the Gotek did when hooked up as DF3 --

So with only DF1 and DF2 external drives everything works fine.
With a third DF3 drive that one goes nuts. Nothing wrong with the drive, just the position in the chain....

Any clues anyone??
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Old 18 August 2019, 22:12   #17
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I've just done a similar test with my A500+ (Rev 8A), I've connected up three external floppy drives:



I've got a Gotek as the internal drive as DF0: and loaded up Workbench 1.3 (even though I've got a Kickstart 2.0.4), and the drives all read OK:



I then used an physical Chinon floppy drive as DF0: and loaded up X-Copy III, and it is able to format a floppy in DF1: OK:



And read it back using Checkdisk+:



(ignore the errors as the floppy got some damage at the end of it).

I suspect you might have some trace issues. I would check that SEL3 is OK and not shorting with anything else. Use http://www.amigapcb.org/ to help identify the SEL3 and other traces:



Also, try swapping the Even and Odd CIA chips and see if it has the same or different behavior.
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Old 18 August 2019, 23:02   #18
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Maybe the signal quality deteriorates because of the total length of the cables. I would suggest to play with the cables. Maybe there is a permutation of your cables that works well.
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Old 18 August 2019, 23:10   #19
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Also, try swapping the Even and Odd CIA chips and see if it has the same or different behavior.
Ignore that, I just realised now you stated you got an Amiga 1200.
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Old 18 August 2019, 23:16   #20
ProdigalAmigan
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Eek Oh noes...!

Quote:
Originally Posted by solarmon View Post
I suspect you might have some trace issues. I would check that SEL3 is OK and not shorting with anything else. Use http://www.amigapcb.org/ Also, try swapping the Even and Odd CIA chips and see if it has the same or different behavior.
Solarmon, first of all - thank you for taking the time to post to this thread to let me know of your results.

However if it actually has to do with the traces on the motherboard itself or a faulty CIA chip I'm in deep dodo as I don't have the necessary knowhow, nor fine motor skills to do any sort of soldering inside of my Amiga.

When I bought the Amiga on eBay I had the seller send it off to a contact of his (in the U.K) to do a full recapping and to remove the Escom floppy modification so that it would work as "normal".

I then had to have the machine sent off again to have the E127R fix done so that I could run my Amiga in multisync mode (using a BenQ BL702A now a BL912) WITHOUT it throwing graphics glitches after a while.... (this was domestically in Sweden after I realized the Amiga needed more ... fixes done to it)...

So worst case scenario I would have to send the machine off to have work/fixes done on it again.... It's expensive and time consuming and I don't trust the Swedish postal service any further than I can throw them (which isn't very far) so I might just stick with 2x drives and switch the third one in and out as needed.

Is there a way to find out what the problem is before deciding how to proceed (using some diagnostic software or a method simple and safe enough that I can do it?)
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