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Old 15 January 2021, 11:31   #81
stevsurv
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Wow! Where did DOOM go??
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Old 15 January 2021, 17:17   #82
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I will gladly betray Doom and PC, by playing Dread on Amiga.
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Old 15 January 2021, 18:17   #83
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If you want real blasphemy, I have Doom running in RTG at 800x600, full music at full FPS in WinUAE with JIT on along with Doom II, Quake, Quake 2, Hexen, Heretic, Wolfenstein, Duke 3D, Strife, Blake Stone. Not sure why, I did it because I can.
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Old 15 January 2021, 20:32   #84
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I purchased a Vampire 2 to play Doom on my Amiga. Worth every penny
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Old 16 January 2021, 12:56   #85
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I agree, a 1000 case to put all my tech in would be golden, because it's back-end only. You can't just slot anything in at the front, it's static and the only to add a drive is to saw away at it, which is blasphemy.
Forgive me father, for I have sinned.
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Old 16 January 2021, 15:06   #86
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Forgive me father, for I have sinned.
Like daubing a moustache on the Mona Lisa.
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Old 16 January 2021, 15:24   #87
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i don't feel like betraying amiga when playing doom an amiga. if commodore wouldn't have fucked up, amiga might have been able to run software like doom if it had an up to date chipset... so no, it's not doom's fault. it's mehdi ali's (and his henchmen) fault who killed commodore.

btw. is there already any playable version of dread available?
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Old 16 January 2021, 17:25   #88
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The Amiga was dead by the time DooM went Open Source (12-23-97).
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Old 16 January 2021, 23:02   #89
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The Amiga was dead by the time DooM went Open Source (12-23-97).
Only if you were a quitter.
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Old 17 January 2021, 01:29   #90
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if commodore wouldn't have fucked up,
...they would have magically increased sales to the same level as PCs, convincing the iD team to port Doom to the Amiga? You're dreaming.

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The Amiga was dead by the time DooM went Open Source (12-23-97).
Not just the Amiga. Where was Atari, Acorn, Sinclair, Amstrad, Tandy, Sharp... Apparently they all 'fucked up'.
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Old 17 January 2021, 01:35   #91
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I recently bought a Mediator for my towerized A1200 so that I can better play Settlers 2 on mac emulation. How does my betrayal to the Amiga rank?
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Old 17 January 2021, 16:03   #92
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...they would have magically increased sales to the same level as PCs, convincing the iD team to port Doom to the Amiga? You're dreaming.
what does this have to do with dreaming?
if commodore wouln'd have fucked up (if there weren't idiots like mehdi ali), amiga might have had a proper up to date chipset as powerful as pcs were in 1993/94. with proper up to date technology amiga would have been able to run games like doom. in this case there would still have been a proper userbase and of course not as many software creators would have left amiga for "better" platforms...
there's no "dreaming". stop insulting people.
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Old 17 January 2021, 17:07   #93
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The Amiga could always run Doom if you'd spent the money on the upgrades needed. It's just id didn't believe enough users had the hardware capable of it and were fully paid up members of the numpty club that believed all Amiga's were 1mb A500's. This is totally backed up by the fact that within hours of the sourse code being released the Amiga had fully playable versions running on an 030 (a processor released in 1987).
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Old 17 January 2021, 17:13   #94
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I recently bought a Mediator for my towerized A1200 so that I can better play Settlers 2 on mac emulation. How does my betrayal to the Amiga rank?
Blind guess - 33% betrayal level
(not for me though, but for the purists )
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Old 17 January 2021, 18:25   #95
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I am one of the original owners of the A1000. Most of the users here in the U.S. were equally concerned about developing it for productive use. That failed and the Europeans saved it for a while as a gaming platform. In the end that is why pc computing took over and never looked back. People needed productivity machines with higher end graphic displays etc.

Doom didn’t do any of this.
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Old 18 January 2021, 00:29   #96
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It is something I’ve thought over and had to admit is the truth.
Games on Amiga have always been creative, addictive, fun. Their playability was at the top of all machines I had before.
When Doom came out a lot of the young generation went to PC only because they could play Doom but Doom is a fantastically boring game!
And seeing the Amiga community making all these efforts to port Doom on Amiga just to say « see? It works here too! » was just a nonsense, a waste of time and a waste of good energy that has hijacked game developers from creating new fun games.
The Amiga had so much better things to offer than the only brute power you need to play Doom... it could have reinvented itself but fell in the trap of following instead of leading again. Indeed that was the end of it.
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Old 18 January 2021, 01:32   #97
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It is something I’ve thought over and had to admit is the truth.
Games on Amiga have always been creative, addictive, fun. Their playability was at the top of all machines I had before.
When Doom came out a lot of the young generation went to PC only because they could play Doom but Doom is a fantastically boring game!
And seeing the Amiga community making all these efforts to port Doom on Amiga just to say « see? It works here too! » was just a nonsense, a waste of time and a waste of good energy that has hijacked game developers from creating new fun games.
The Amiga had so much better things to offer than the only brute power you need to play Doom... it could have reinvented itself but fell in the trap of following instead of leading again. Indeed that was the end of it.
It's not that easy.. Maybe a lot of people found Doom boring. But a whole lot of people didn't. But the point is that when this tech arrived.. "BSP Pseudo 3d" it literally added another dimension to game makers to get creative.
Soon after Doom there were the other games that "unlocked the potential" of this new tech... Like Dark Forces. Even Mac got its "Marathon".. The consoles at the time.. Atari Jaguar had Alien Vs Predator.. 3do had some FPS crap.. the general feel was that every modern machine can play those kind of games except the Amiga.
I wasn't much of a Doom fan either tbh, but I was still downloading every tech demo that showed texture mapping on the Amiga.. remember "Poom"? or "TexDemo".. but playing DukeNukem on LAN back in 1996 was the thing that settled it for me.. it was sooo much fun and that point more enjoyable than anything I had played on Amiga. So from that point on it was never going to be the same again. The new tech was enabled by the superior power in PCs (and the fact you could easily use PCs in LAN in a school or work environment, meaning you didn't even have to own one yourself, just get friendly with the admins at school or work and voila..) and that was that. The gaming world had changed forever.
I still hated using Windows PCs, and I held on to my expanded A1200 until 1998 or so.. before finally succumbing to the PC "experience". (And it too Windows 2000 to shut me about about how crappy Windows is ;-)
But to summarize, Doom can't be ignored when discussing how fast the Amiga was killed off as a notable platform among developers and users around the world.
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Old 18 January 2021, 01:42   #98
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I am one of the original owners of the A1000. Most of the users here in the U.S. were equally concerned about developing it for productive use. That failed and the Europeans saved it for a while as a gaming platform. In the end that is why pc computing took over and never looked back. People needed productivity machines with higher end graphic displays etc.

Doom didn’t do any of this.
Bingo. In the US, the Amiga was a top-tier productivity computer with capabilities that weren't even possible on competing machines, for any price, past specialised hardware worth ten to twenty times the cost of an Amiga. But it didn't sell as well as needed to move beyond OCS and predictably retain their share of the market. European consumers embraced the Amiga as a games machine in additon to the creative side and Commodore enjoyed that sucess much like the C64 before. So you'd think the need for a new chipset and the healthy European market would be a no brainer. Introduce AGA in 1990 and/or AAA in 1992 and continue that success.

But if you don't move past those initial capabilities, a machine now five years old in 1992, you get left behind and from 1990 onwards, the PC evolved and accelerated away with high-colour graphics, CD audio, early GPUs and cheaper hard drives. Commodore had an uncanny knack of ignoring their customer base, engineers and competitors and prioritise milking every last dollar out of a successful system, rather than getting a running start with a new chipset and keeping the Amiga going and building on its excellent reputation.

But it is what it is.
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Old 18 January 2021, 01:43   #99
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I am one of the original owners of the A1000. Most of the users here in the U.S. were equally concerned about developing it for productive use.
Yes, and Commodore knew that. They put a lot of effort into making the Amiga more than just a games machine.

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That failed and the Europeans saved it for a while as a gaming platform. In the end that is why pc computing took over and never looked back. People needed productivity machines with higher end graphic displays etc.
Yes, but it didn't fail due to not having high end graphics - it failed simply because it wasn't IBM compatible. The vast majority of PC business applications in the 1980's and early 90's ran in text mode, and many PCs in the 80's only had monochrome cards because that was all they needed. Where was the Amiga supposed to fit in that market?

One might be justified in saying that Commodore 'fucked up' by trying to make the Amiga into something it wasn't originally meant to be, but I am glad they did.

Here is photo of the A1200 I ran in my shop in the 1990's. As well as demonstrating the computer's capabilities and playing games etc., it also performed many business tasks. The multisync monitor was useful for word processing and desktop publishing etc. On the shelf is an Iomega Zip 100 drive for doing backups, and a CD Writer used for (among other things) making discs for customers. It was also hooked up to a MODEM for sending and receiving faxes, a laser printer, and a flatbed scanner. On screen you can see a photo of mine (taken at a local airshow) which I had just scanned into the computer.

I ran that setup for many years and it performed flawlessly throughout, as well being a pleasure to use. We also had an A2000 which ran a 2 line bulletin board, and in later years I used my A3000 to run an accounting package, do emails and browse the Net (via Ethernet to ADSL). None of this would have been possible if Commodore had stuck to the Amiga's original design concept. Imagine trying to run your business on a Sega Megadrive, a 3DO, or a Playstation!
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Old 18 January 2021, 01:53   #100
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Here is photo of the A1200 I ran in my shop in the 1990's. As well as demonstrating the computer's capabilities and playing games etc., it also performed many business tasks. The multisync monitor was useful for word processing and desktop publishing etc. On the shelf is an Iomega Zip 100 drive for doing backups, and a CD Writer used for (among other things) making discs for customers. It was also hooked up to a MODEM for sending and receiving faxes, a laser printer, and a flatbed scanner. On screen you can see a photo of mine (taken at a local airshow) which I had just scanned into the computer.
What a beauty of a set-up, to think how many 1200s were binned as soon as the family household got their first decently running triple-MHz PC in the late '90s. Tragedy.
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