Intuition window WinAPI integration?

[Mequa]

I believe the AROS version of E-UAE has a similar feature, but I'm wondering if it would be possible to implement this in WinUAE.

Basically, I'm wondering if it would be possible (on a RTG desktop or otherwise) for Amiga Intuition-based windows to be displayed as draggable WinAPI windows separate from the emulated Amiga desktop. These would retain their Amiga "skin" (by not using the Windows borders), and functions such as drag and resize would be integrated appropriately with Windows API functions. The Amiga (or RTG) display itself could be in a separate minimisable window (which may or may not also contain such other windows). Finally, the windows could be either unscaled (perhaps too small) or scaled/doubled/filtered etc. as appropriately selected.
This would likely be achieved through a combination of modification to the WinUAE source, and Amiga-based integration software which is run with Workbench, and able to pass the Intuition data (via WinUAE) to WinAPI and vice versa.

From my very limited understanding of Amiga Intuition, the windows are represented as rectangular (blitted?) screen areas. I'm not sure if the windows would have to be non-overlapping on the Amiga desktop for such an integration feature to work.

Similar features are found in various virtual machines, such as Microsoft's "Windows XP Mode" on Windows 7 Professional (which includes these integration features in Windows Virtual PC). I see no reason why an emulated environment couldn't perform a similar feat.

I'm not sure if Toni has any interest in working on such a feature, however AFAIK it could potentially be implemented by anyone with enough working knowledge of Amiga Intuition, WinAPI and C/C++. However, would anyone else be interested in such a feature?


P.S. As a picture is worth a thousand words (apparently), I included a quick mock-up of what such a feature might look like. (Only the clocks would match )

[Toni Wilen]

I have already replied years ago (didn't find the post): not possible without RTG technical documentation or sources (it is kept hostage somewhere)

Stupid "pass-though" mode is not acceptable, it is never ever going to work properly.

I guess AROS 68K version might make it possible..

[Mequa]

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

not possible without RTG technical documentation or sources (it is kept hostage somewhere)

If this feature is available with AROS x86's version of UAE, one possible way this could be made to work on Windows (without WinUAE) may be for someone to write an integration feature for AROS x86 for a virtual machine such as VMWare (or an open source equivalent), similar to that found in Microsoft's "Windows XP Mode" and (AFAIK) also available on VMWare with other guest OS's, which would enable AROS x86 windows (and by extension emulated AmigaOS windows) to be treated as WinAPI windows.

If such integration software is produced, and if AROS x86 supports UAE window integration, this would enable full integration of AmigaOS windows with MS Windows.

Now, if such software is (theoretically) ever developed, and its primary sources available, I was wondering how difficult it would be to reverse engineer its window integration features for WinUAE, even without access to RTG documentation.

[Cammy]

Aros uses J-UAE, not E-UAE. Janus-UAE is far more advanced than E-UAE, and the window and menu integration works quite well.

[Mequa]

From what I've heard, AROS's UAE patches the Amiga Kickstart ROMs at startup to enable native AROS code, which as well as speeding up window functions, allows window and menu integration and other cool features.

I was wondering if the kind of VM integration features I detailed above (if open source) could provide a possible "back door" towards implementing window (and screen) integration in WinUAE, with a closed-source and undocumented RTG.

Toni, I greatly appreciate the hard work you put into WinUAE, but never say "not possible".

[mihcael]

This sounds a little more similar what aros does in the Linux and Windows hosted versions of aros. It runs more like a program of the host OS then a virtual machine!

The filesystem and grahpics systems are provided by the host which does give a massive speed boost!

Im not very familiar with them but it might be worth looking into.

[Mequa]

Janus-UAE sounds pretty good, but are there any plans to sync it with the latest WinUAE as has been done with P-UAE by GnoStiC? It makes sense for AROS to be the definitive platform for Amiga emulation (next to WinUAE that is).

Perhaps such a sync could make the features I described for WinUAE one step closer?

[oRBIT]

"VirtualBox" (and other) emulators/virtual machine-programs on PC has a seamless mode. Which means, the emulated systems application appears on the hosts' desktop just like any other program which makes the emulation transparent (more or less).
Wouldn't this be a cool feature for WinUAE? Imagine running "HippoPlayer" on your Windows Desktop.

[TCD]

Merge time : http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=55847

[Mequa]

If this has been moved from "request.UAE Wishlist" to "support.WinUAE", I'm wondering if it would make more sense to lock the other thread (leaving the link to here)?

Edit: Or delete the other thread (as it appears has been done)

[andreas]

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

I have already replied years ago (didn't find the post): not possible without RTG technical documentation or sources (it is kept hostage somewhere)

maybe it was
this (loosely related) thread?

This one, though only remotely related, also refers to non-existing public documentation for RTG stuff.