New Amiga motherboards from Jens

[delshay]

old memory part number HYB514800AJ-70. new part number can't check as I don't have motherboard here but I think it's the same in this posting but for sure ends in -60 and motherboard is working when last checked.

can't find PDF docs for above part, but I can find HYB514800BJ-xx.

PDF docs shows xx=access time (ns) but the faster part is pretty much useless on A1200 motherboard.

[Mrs Beanbag]

fitting a faster RAM chip on an A1200 motherboard will not make any difference

[delshay]

It was just a experiment where I tried to overclock & main focus was on 25Mhz EC020. ...Did not want to loose the parts, so I just stuck everything on A1200 motherboard.

[Olecranon]

Very interesting and cool news. A couple things jump out at me though.

1) Does the new board really need to be a drop in replacement for an Amiga 500/1200 "case"? Why not make it ATX or micro ATX form factor? The idea of stuffing a new board into a poorly ventilated 30 yr old yellowed plastic case makes me cringe.

2) It needs to support modern keyboards and mice. Again, what is the purpose of supporting 30 yr old keyboards and mice? Does someone have a warehouse of NOS Amiga 500/1200 keyboards for replacement? No...

3) Just add the flicker fixer with an HDMI output onto the motherboard and bump the base price accordingly. Have the 15kHz as an option.

My wish list in a nutshell would be to have an Amiga 1200 based motherboard that I could drop into a modern case of my choosing. I want to use a new and easily replaceable USB or PS2 keyboard and mouse of my choosing, and I want to be able to plug it into any modern LCD flat screen monitor or TV.

[Amiga4000]

Originally Posted by Olecranon

Very interesting and cool news. A couple things jump out at me though.

1) Does the new board really need to be a drop in replacement for an Amiga 500/1200 "case"? Why not make it ATX or micro ATX form factor? The idea of stuffing a new board into a poorly ventilated 30 yr old yellowed plastic case makes me cringe.

2) It needs to support modern keyboards and mice. Again, what is the purpose of supporting 30 yr old keyboards and mice? Does someone have a warehouse of NOS Amiga 500/1200 keyboards for replacement? No...

3) Just add the flicker fixer with an HDMI output onto the motherboard and bump the base price accordingly. Have the 15kHz as an option.

My wish list in a nutshell would be to have an Amiga 1200 based motherboard that I could drop into a modern case of my choosing. I want to use a new and easily replaceable USB or PS2 keyboard and mouse of my choosing, and I want to be able to plug it into any modern LCD flat screen monitor or TV.

Finally! A voice of common sense reality!

[eXeler0]

Originally Posted by Olecranon

Very interesting and cool news. A couple things jump out at me though.

1) Does the new board really need to be a drop in replacement for an Amiga 500/1200 "case"? Why not make it ATX or micro ATX form factor? The idea of stuffing a new board into a poorly ventilated 30 yr old yellowed plastic case makes me cringe.

2) It needs to support modern keyboards and mice. Again, what is the purpose of supporting 30 yr old keyboards and mice? Does someone have a warehouse of NOS Amiga 500/1200 keyboards for replacement? No...

3) Just add the flicker fixer with an HDMI output onto the motherboard and bump the base price accordingly. Have the 15kHz as an option.

My wish list in a nutshell would be to have an Amiga 1200 based motherboard that I could drop into a modern case of my choosing. I want to use a new and easily replaceable USB or PS2 keyboard and mouse of my choosing, and I want to be able to plug it into any modern LCD flat screen monitor or TV.

A lot of "ifs"... but there is an ongoing kickstarter for new cases and hopefully soon another two for keycaps and keyboards respectively.. If they are successful the the above arguments carry less weight.. but if they fail, you have a point. However, to -at this point- suddenly make an entirely new ATX friendly design probably isnt gonna happen. But maybe it's possible to add a bunch of "ATX compliant screw holes"...

The HDMI out of the box option has already been discussed a lot - and arguments shot down.. as for modern keyboards.. there are adapters available...so again.. same thing..

[crazyc]

Originally Posted by Olecranon

Very interesting and cool news. A couple things jump out at me though.

1) Does the new board really need to be a drop in replacement for an Amiga 500/1200 "case"? Why not make it ATX or micro ATX form factor? The idea of stuffing a new board into a poorly ventilated 30 yr old yellowed plastic case makes me cringe.

2) It needs to support modern keyboards and mice. Again, what is the purpose of supporting 30 yr old keyboards and mice? Does someone have a warehouse of NOS Amiga 500/1200 keyboards for replacement? No...

3) Just add the flicker fixer with an HDMI output onto the motherboard and bump the base price accordingly. Have the 15kHz as an option.

My wish list in a nutshell would be to have an Amiga 1200 based motherboard that I could drop into a modern case of my choosing. I want to use a new and easily replaceable USB or PS2 keyboard and mouse of my choosing, and I want to be able to plug it into any modern LCD flat screen monitor or TV.

Isn't winuae the better option for what you want then?

[roondar]

Originally Posted by Olecranon

Very interesting and cool news. A couple things jump out at me though.

1) Does the new board really need to be a drop in replacement for an Amiga 500/1200 "case"? Why not make it ATX or micro ATX form factor? The idea of stuffing a new board into a poorly ventilated 30 yr old yellowed plastic case makes me cringe.

2) It needs to support modern keyboards and mice. Again, what is the purpose of supporting 30 yr old keyboards and mice? Does someone have a warehouse of NOS Amiga 500/1200 keyboards for replacement? No...

3) Just add the flicker fixer with an HDMI output onto the motherboard and bump the base price accordingly. Have the 15kHz as an option.

My wish list in a nutshell would be to have an Amiga 1200 based motherboard that I could drop into a modern case of my choosing. I want to use a new and easily replaceable USB or PS2 keyboard and mouse of my choosing, and I want to be able to plug it into any modern LCD flat screen monitor or TV.

I don't know. I spend quite some effort to get an A1200 back in a standard wedge case after having a tower based one for quite a while. For me the wedges/original cases just 'feel' much more like a 'real' Amiga.

Same for the joysticks and keyboard (not mice though, I've replaced that with a PS2 one ages ago).

If there are more people like me it seems that the option for using Original cases should be there.

That said, I do agree on the video part - a full HDMI compatible (i.e. including 50Hz modes) output feels like it should be standard.

[eXeler0]

Originally Posted by roondar

That said, I do agree on the video part - a full HDMI compatible (i.e. including 50Hz modes) output feels like it should be standard.

If youre willing to pay the extra cash for modern output then Im sure someone will bundle the mobo with the modified version of Indivision.
So then it comes back to the argument... why remove the choice for those who want a different solution..

[Olecranon]

Originally Posted by eXeler0

If youre willing to pay the extra cash for modern output then Im sure someone will bundle the mobo with the modified version of Indivision.
So then it comes back to the argument... why remove the choice for those who want a different solution..

My argument is that it should be cheaper if the option that 99% of the people view as a "must have" is simply included. This should be especially true if the components are included on the motherboard instead of having a separate production run for the modules.

I'm from the U.S. Maybe my estimate on how many people would actually want 15kHz output is slanted to near ZERO since we don't have CRT TV's with scart connectors. To me, the idea of trying to use a 30 year old 13" CRT RGB monitor makes as much sense as using a 30 year old KB/Mouse.

I understand that people want the retro experience, but this is a perfect opportunity to bring the AGA amiga into the 21st century while leaving behind the old decaying components that have no replacement/repair options.

[demolition]

A HDMI output onboard would be very nice indeed, but not if it is simply an Indivision AGA MkII that has been integrated since it is not very useful for gaming. It should be a solution which can do pure progressive 50Hz -> 50 Hz without any deinterlacing and frame rate conversion to make it useful for gaming.

It will also be easier get people to pay more for stuff if it comes in additions (good example: Pandora). If everything is added from the start, the price would be too steep for most people, whereas if you can start cheaper, you can slowly add stuff on to it as you accumulate spare cash (whatever that means).

[eXeler0]

Originally Posted by Olecranon

My argument is that it should be cheaper if the option that 99% of the people view as a "must have" is simply included. This should be especially true if the components are included on the motherboard instead of having a separate production run for the modules.

I'm from the U.S. Maybe my estimate on how many people would actually want 15kHz output is slanted to near ZERO since we don't have CRT TV's with scart connectors. To me, the idea of trying to use a 30 year old 13" CRT RGB monitor makes as much sense as using a 30 year old KB/Mouse.

I understand that people want the retro experience, but this is a perfect opportunity to bring the AGA amiga into the 21st century while leaving behind the old decaying components that have no replacement/repair options.

There are modern LCD monitors that handle 15kHz. I have a BenQ BL702A and it works just fine. You can find them on Amazon for a lot less that the price of Indivision. And with RGB to VGA adapters + a VGA switch box you can let several Amigas share it. I have no real use for Indivision.
Future FPGA accelerators promise HDMI output, when that happens Ill get one of those, but again.. wont need indivision..

[dJOS]

Originally Posted by eXeler0

There are modern LCD monitors that handle 15kHz. I have a BenQ BL702A and it works just fine. You can find them on Amazon for a lot less that the price of Indivision. And with RGB to VGA adapters + a VGA switch box you can let several Amigas share it. I have no real use for Indivision.
Future FPGA accelerators promise HDMI output, when that happens Ill get one of those, but again.. wont need indivision..

This may be the case in Europe but those LCD's agree bloody expensive once you ship them to the USA or Australia.

[eXeler0]

Originally Posted by dJOS

This may be the case in Europe but those LCD's agree bloody expensive once you ship them to the USA or Australia.

There might be other models available. There is no official specification that states that the BL702A is capable of 15kHz. Sometimes, these are found by trial and error. Anyhoo, if you take a look at the recently released ACA1221, it will give you a hint how Jens does thing atm. He's trying to keep base price low while keeping the options of later upgrades. If you have the cash and want the feature then nothing is stopping you, really.
Of course we'd all want RTG with HDMI and other fun stuff, but the reality of the situation seems to be that anything but a very scaled down mobo will simply end up costing too much to appeal to more than a select few...

[Nostromo]

Quoting from the Amiga Reloaded Wiki:

"Another alternative is the special version of Indivision AGA MK2, which can be installed as the second alternative: This will give you a VGA and an HDMI output for the Amiga Reloaded. The price of this option will be lower than the price of the Indivision AGA MK2 product for the A1200, as this one does not have to deal with the space constraints of the original Commodore board."

Any ideas if it will support HDMI@50hz? Would be awesome to play on a normal TV

[alenppc]

60 Hz only HDMI is also useful for this side of the world since most North-American TVs won't display 50 Hz signal even over HDMI (as illustrated by issues with imported playstations for example).

[Nostromo]

Yes but on THIS side of the world we'd prefer 50hz

1. Because our TVs support 50hz
2. Because running games that have been programmed to run at 50hz at 60hz is just wrong

[demolition]

True, a 60Hz picture from a PAL Amiga is better than no picture at all, but only marginally.

I thought that supporting 24/50/60 Hz was mandatory for HDMI. Perhaps with some frame rate conversion towards the panel, but at least capable of showing a picture.

[Nostromo]

True, a 60Hz picture from a PAL Amiga is better than no picture at all, but only marginally.

Yep, only 10hz better than no picture!

I thought that supporting 24/50/60 Hz was mandatory for HDMI. Perhaps with some frame rate conversion towards the panel, but at least capable of showing a picture.

Well in case of a panel which supports 60hz only sure... but why force it on all Europeans when we can play at a super sexy smooth 50hz frequency

[eXeler0]

Will the success or failure of the current A1200 case kickstarter have an effect on those of you who are considering a "reloaded" mobo?

Or are most of you fine with slaughtering your current machines and put the mobo in it? Personally Id never dismantle my original 1200 which has been with me since '93.
Is the plan that most ppl will buy a replacement A500 case off ebay and put the reloaded mobo into that.. or what?