Quick and stupid scandoubler questions...

[Amiga1992]

I just stopped to think about this... I am planning to get an internal scandoubler for my A1200 (I heard it was cake to connect it), so I can stop buying dying 1084 monitors :P Besides, I have a nice 17" multisync that works a treat in Productivity modes...

But I was thinking... let's say one day I want to take the Amiga and connect it to the TV through the Composite video output... will the machine output through it at 30Khz too, or will it retain its usual 15 Khz frequency? Perhaps installing a scandoubler means I can never use a TV again? Or perhaps the scandoubler only affects the Amiga Video port and not the RF or Composite ports? Should I buy an extenal instead? Will this external unit work with my A600 too?

Oh, so many questions! People who own one of these beauts, please enlighten this scandoubler newbie

Thanks in advance.

[Miggy2TheMax]

Originally posted by Akira
I just stopped to think about this... I am planning to get an internal scandoubler for my A1200 (I heard it was cake to connect it), so I can stop buying dying 1084 monitors :P Besides, I have a nice 17" multisync that works a treat in Productivity modes...

But I was thinking... let's say one day I want to take the Amiga and connect it to the TV through the Composite video output... will the machine output through it at 30Khz too, or will it retain its usual 15 Khz frequency? Perhaps installing a scandoubler means I can never use a TV again? Or perhaps the scandoubler only affects the Amiga Video port and not the RF or Composite ports? Should I buy an extenal instead? Will this external unit work with my A600 too?

Oh, so many questions! People who own one of these beauts, please enlighten this scandoubler newbie

Thanks in advance.

Well I own a external scandoubler and it plugs into the RGB port and outputs VGA... Therefore it only effects the output of the RGB port. Using that logic I cannot see why an internal scandoubler should effect RF or composite ports, it wouldn't make sence.

[blackcornflake]

I can confirm that this is the case.

I have an internal scandoubler/flicker-fixer, which outputs to a 'PC' monitor through its own 15-pin VGA socket.

I must admit that, since fitting it, I hadn't used a TV with my Amiga. Just tried it - perfect! Simultaneous monitor output is OK too. Cool!

[Amiga1992]

So you say, that it doesnt make the Amiga's video port output 30Khz, but provides its own port?

Where the HECK am I supposed to put that extra port in my A1200? I am not in for drilling holes anywhere :P I already have the 23-pin to 15pin VGA adapter thingy, so I thought it'd use that.

More info greatly apreciated, mates What about using an external scandoubler with my A600 too? Is it possible?

[Miggy2TheMax]

Originally posted by Akira
So you say, that it doesnt make the Amiga's video port output 30Khz, but provides its own port?

Where the HECK am I supposed to put that extra port in my A1200? I am not in for drilling holes anywhere :P I already have the 23-pin to 15pin VGA adapter thingy, so I thought it'd use that.

More info greatly apreciated, mates What about using an external scandoubler with my A600 too? Is it possible?

Hi Akira,

I knew it... ICD make internal flicker fixers and they still have a web page. Take a look at:

http://www.icd.com/amiga/index.html#ffv2

One of the features listed on the web page:

Flicker Free Video 2 does not
interfere with the regular video output.

So atleast that proves it for ICD flicker fixer. I would be suprised if there was any flicker fixer out there that would stuff around with the video output.

Be warned.. when browsing the ICD page, don't look at their prices

edit: Akira, just noticed your question about using a scandoubler on your A600. I have an external scandoubler and I have tested it on 500,600 and 1200 so you should have no worries using it between your amigas. But be warned, you dont want to keep on plugging and unplugging the scandoubler .. it wears out the plug... or atleast that is how I wore out a plug on my 520 modulator... hope that helps..

btw, you should rename this thread to "Quick Scandoubler questions...", as there are no such things as stupid questions! Cheers.

"Be warned.. when browsing the ICD page, don't look at their prices"

Indeed! :hoo Obviously they're looking for rich buyers!

[blackcornflake]

@Akira: First thing, don't buy that piece of crap ICD are overcharging for. Perhaps buy from Power, for less money and a better model.

As for fitting: in a tower, the port sits in a backplane. Desktop A1200 - just run the lead from the unit out through the back of the case and connect the port to the monitor. No need for 23 to 15 pin adaptor.

If you don't like the idea of a lead running out of the A1200 case, maybe an external unit would be a better buy. It depends on whether you ever intend to buy a tower case. Once an internal unit is installed it is invisible: its output port simply replaces the existing Amiga ones. Nothing protruding from the back of the Amiga, as would be the case with an external model.

Your choice, dude!

Those guys at power claim to sell hardware they do not have in stock! They don't answer your mails and when you cancel your order in the end, they don't update the page and your order still shows as "pending". I'm extremely unsatisfied with them.

[Amiga1992]

Well, I do not plan to tower this A1200. if I ever buy a second A1200, perhaps (I might go for buying just an A1200 motherboard, I dont feel like throwing away a nice old case!)

I think I wil get an external, since it works for the 600 too!! or perhaps I should save up o 250 dollars and buy an XRGB2 :drool:

Thanks a million for your answers!

[blackcornflake]

@Burseg: Hmm, strange. Doesn't sound very professional on their part. I myself have not had any problems with Power in 5 years though, hence my recommendation.

Still, vote with your wallet.

There are many alternative distributors of DCE (ScanMagic designers) products.

@Akira: :welcome

Perhaps they are having problems to serve international customers. Magix is having the same problems that I do.

[Codetapper]

OK guys, my 1084 just died tonight and I like Akira am not prepared to buy another 10 year old monitor hoping that it will last another few years... So if somebody could answer these questions for me I would be very grateful! (btw I own a plain Amiga 1200 (no tower!) with 50Mhz 68030 and an internal 3.5" hard drive):

1. Does an external scandoubler require power? My system often freezes when I turn it on, so I have to turn it on then off then on before it gets enough juice into it. (I am using an A500 PSU btw). I also do not want the hassle of UK power supplies or adapters etc (NZ uses 240V like Australia).

2. Does *ANY* PC monitor work with a scandoubler or I still have to find one which syncs low enough? With newer monitors coming out all the time I'm not keen on buying a scandoubler to find I have to buy old(ish) PC monitors to feed it!

3. Can somebody recommend a LEGIT shop which will sells one? (I live in New Zealand remember!) Preferably for me I'd rather have somebody buy it in a real shop, test it and send it to me in the post and I pay them via Paypal or whatever payment they like. It'd be too easy for a dodgy online shop to steal my cash, ignore emails and say "it must have gotten lost in the mail" and hope that little old New Zealand Amiga user is a twit and can't chase it up being 10,000 km away.

4. This is probably a really stupid question but since I've only ever run my Amiga Workbench in 640x256 mode, do ALL games running in standard PAL 320x256 format run fine through a scandoubler and PC monitor? My main reason for getting one is so I can continue to crack/HD install games and not run 24 bit gfx packages in some special Workbench display mode.

If anyone is willing to help I would be grateful!

[blackcornflake]

blackcornflake to da rescue!

1. No extra power required for an external scandoubler. Nor for an internal one, which will fit into a desktop A1200, making it a viable alternative. Internal gives marginally better results, and should be cheaper, as no digital - analogue - digital conversion is necessary.

2. Every monitor I have tried so far works perfectly. I'm on a Mitsubishi Diamondtron (circa 1999) one at the mo. I can think of no reason why any standard SVGA monitor would not work.

3. An Aussie shop, AnythingAmiga, offer an external model for AUS$199. Not too bad.

If you prefer, I can make the purchase on your behalf at a UK shop, like Eyetech, and post the bad boy to you.

4. All 320x256 modes are fine, as are all other Amiga modes. Micro Machines has never looked so good.

Edit: If possible, buy a scandoubler unit without a flicker-fixer, as this will be cheaper and still do what you want.

There seems to be a common misconception that the two things are the same, as illustrated in this thread. Not the case at all - the flicker-fixer is there solely to sort out interlaced screen modes, which you state you do not use.

[Codetapper]

Thanks for that quick reply blackcornflake! I've gotten in touch with AnythingAmiga and they replied with this:

"The scandoubler shown on the website is a DCE model which is currently out of stock. I do now have stock of Eyetech external scandoubler flicker fixers which to be truthful are a much better item than the DCE, this will definetly work with your 1200 and will run with any PC monitor, price is a little dearer than the DCE's."

Has anyone on this board had any dealings with this Aussie outfit? They seem OK, fast email reply and accept Paypal.

If I had the flicker fixer I could have a much cooler Workbench (bigger disassemblies etc) - I was just making sure that it wasn't ONLY for workbench use. I assume the flicker fixer is some kind of automatic thing, if you run a lowres screen it doesn't do anything and if you open an interlace one then it kicks in and you don't have the horrid flicker?

One last thing, external vs internal? Is the quality loss going from digital -> analog -> digital noticable? I don't really want to open up my 1200, rip out the shielding and muck around in there if possible (my cousin is a sparky so he in theory could do it) unless there is a much better picture...

[Miggy2TheMax]

Originally posted by Codetapper
Thanks for that quick reply blackcornflake! I've gotten in touch with AnythingAmiga and they replied with this:

"The scandoubler shown on the website is a DCE model which is currently out of stock. I do now have stock of Eyetech external scandoubler flicker fixers which to be truthful are a much better item than the DCE, this will definetly work with your 1200 and will run with any PC monitor, price is a little dearer than the DCE's."

Has anyone on this board had any dealings with this Aussie outfit? They seem OK, fast email reply and accept Paypal.

If I had the flicker fixer I could have a much cooler Workbench (bigger disassemblies etc) - I was just making sure that it wasn't ONLY for workbench use. I assume the flicker fixer is some kind of automatic thing, if you run a lowres screen it doesn't do anything and if you open an interlace one then it kicks in and you don't have the horrid flicker?

One last thing, external vs internal? Is the quality loss going from digital -> analog -> digital noticable? I don't really want to open up my 1200, rip out the shielding and muck around in there if possible (my cousin is a sparky so he in theory could do it) unless there is a much better picture...

Yes, the flicker fixer automatically detects the screen mode you are using switches between scan doubling and pass thru mode, so all screen modes come up looking very nice. The games come up looking sharp, Ops .. I mean for productivity its great too

I have an external scan doubler and the screen qaulity is AWSOME, you will never want to go back to a 1084s. I cannot see how an internal scan doubler will come with better quality .. the screen just jumps out with sharpness. Its great!

Just a caution note about scandoubler working with _every_ PC monitor. I have tried using the scandoubler with a 1710AV monitor with no luck, the monitor would not even sync on the signal.. But having said this, I've used the doubler on other types of PC monitors (Acer/compaq) and it works ok. I think the 1710 didn't like any resolutions below 640x480 or something .. really silly like that.

Tell us how you go with the scan doubler once you get one!

P.S: I've had no dealings with "anythingamiga". If you do buy from them tell us how you go. I like their price on the 4 way IDE interface thing.