2ND button joystick on a real Amiga

Fabie · 19 November 2009, 09:21

I have rebuild a Logitech pad to work on my A1200
and I have added a 2nd button joystick

(pin 9 + ground)

but it does not works on all games

it works perfect on Turrican 1 ,2 and 3, and on Rtype 1 & 2

but pin 9 + ground doesn't works on games like BCkid,Bubble & squeak,Aladdin and Lionheart and maybe others

my question is this:

what schematic for the 2nd button joystick is the genuine for all games?

what should be added there? a resistor? a diode?

s2325 · 19 November 2009, 09:30

Are you sure these games have second button option?

TCD · 19 November 2009, 09:56

Yes, all of them have a 2 button joystick setting in the options.

pmc · 19 November 2009, 10:14

I know this sounds obvious - and is possibly stupid (too lazy to check the HRM at the moment and find out

) but my guess would be that the games that the second button doesn't work on don't perform the same check in their code for a press of that second button as the games that it does work on...

Edit: To clarify, what I mean is: Is there only one standard defined signal that can come from the joyports that should be regarded as "second joytick button has been pressed"

TCD · 19 November 2009, 10:22

Hmm, R-Type and Turrican just support the second button (no need to go to the options). I wonder if it's that simple...

Fabie · 19 November 2009, 10:37

PMC,

you can't check on the code of that games how the 2nd button joystick works
************
and according to my A1200 manual page F-8:
(Mouse/game controller ports)

pin 9 is button 2

Retro1234 · 19 November 2009, 10:41

Ive had problems with both BcKid and Aladdin with a sega pad - these problems have gone away with latest Whd Slaves.

Toni Wilen · 19 November 2009, 10:41

Some games forget to initialize POTGO register (Paula io-register) and only work under KS 1.x..

KS 1.x always enables both joystick port direction bits. KS 2.x+ only enables mouse port (right mouse button = 2nd firebutton)

Fabie · 19 November 2009, 10:50

btw,

I think that some games were designed to work with the megadrive or mastersystem pad or maybe any other strange joystick or pad
and that games not use the standart 'amiga 2nd button schem

however Im sure that they make use of pin 9 thorugh a resistor or through a diode or any other way

so....the point of this is.... find a way to make your own 2nd button schem that will work on all games

Fabie · 19 November 2009, 10:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

Some games forget to initialize POTGO register (Paula io-register) and only work under KS 1.x..

KS 1.x always enables both joystick port direction bits. KS 2.x+ only enables mouse port (right mouse button = 2nd firebutton)

OK I understand

so ....if I softkick Kicstart 1.3 on my A1200 using relokick or rekick and then run that games from floppy....2nd button will work?

Retro1234 · 19 November 2009, 10:59

Aladdin was realy fucked up -
your not using WHDload? - Can you use WHDload?

Fabie · 19 November 2009, 17:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boo Boo

Aladdin was realy fucked up -
your not using WHDload? - Can you use WHDload?

The only way to run Aladdin on my A1200 is whdload cause prodigy crack doesn't work
My A1200 is a rev 1.D1 and has a strange bug and Aladdin does not works from floppy

back to the point,using whdload the 2nd button on Aladdin partially works,but there's a delay issue between you give up apples

Retro1234 · 19 November 2009, 17:33

I guess if your using Aladdin slave 1.4+ then this is not a software issue.

Photon · 19 November 2009, 19:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

Some games forget to initialize POTGO register (Paula io-register) and only work under KS 1.x..

KS 1.x always enables both joystick port direction bits. KS 2.x+ only enables mouse port (right mouse button = 2nd firebutton)

^ Here's the answer.

Second joystick button is a simple physical pin connection, so it's not easy to mess that up.

Toni, does reset on those kickstarts actively set the wrong direction on softreset? If not, one could make a simple reset patch.

I'm pretty sure I can use both firebuttons on kick 2.0 on my A500 - but let me check one of those games above. I wouldn't be surprised if it doesn't, I usually kickswitch into 1.3 or 1.2 when I know I want to play games/watch demos.

Toni Wilen · 19 November 2009, 19:12

At least 3.1+ always rewrites POTGO when it reads status of mouse buttons. (I guess this must have something to do with included CD32 pad support etc?)

AFAIK KS 1.x does it only once during reset.

Hungry Horace · 19 November 2009, 19:38

maybe some of these game read CD32-Blue button instead of the normal 2nd button check? i cant be sure, but that might cause a few problems with some.

Fabie · 19 November 2009, 20:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hungry Horace

maybe some of these game read CD32-Blue button instead of the normal 2nd button check? i cant be sure, but that might cause a few problems with some.

that games do not read Blue CD32 button
they were made before CD32 release

Im sure they look for C button of the megadrive Pad...however I haven't a megadrive pad so I can't confirm that

Retro-Nerd · 19 November 2009, 20:31

Bubble & Squeak and Lionheart work indeed with a Sega Mega Drive C-button, but my Tecno Plus pad not.

Fabie · 19 November 2009, 20:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Retro-Nerd

Bubble & Squeak and Lionheart work indeed with a Sega Mega Drive C-button, but my Tecno Plus pad not.

thanks for the info

can you check also if the games Yojoe and BCkid 2nd button works with your megadrive pad?

Retro-Nerd · 19 November 2009, 20:38

BC Kid doesn't work with the MD pad, but with the Tecno Plus. Not sure about YoJoe, have to test it.

19 November 2009, 09:21	#1
Fabie Banned Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: France Posts: 478	2ND button joystick on a real Amiga I have rebuild a Logitech pad to work on my A1200 and I have added a 2nd button joystick (pin 9 + ground) but it does not works on all games it works perfect on Turrican 1 ,2 and 3, and on Rtype 1 & 2 but pin 9 + ground doesn't works on games like BCkid,Bubble & squeak,Aladdin and Lionheart and maybe others my question is this: what schematic for the 2nd button joystick is the genuine for all games? what should be added there? a resistor? a diode?

19 November 2009, 10:41	#7
Retro1234 Phone Homer Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: 5150 Posts: 5,773	Ive had problems with both BcKid and Aladdin with a sega pad - these problems have gone away with latest Whd Slaves. Last edited by Retro1234; 19 November 2009 at 10:47.

19 November 2009, 10:50	#9
Fabie Banned Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: France Posts: 478	btw, I think that some games were designed to work with the megadrive or mastersystem pad or maybe any other strange joystick or pad and that games not use the standart 'amiga 2nd button schem however Im sure that they make use of pin 9 thorugh a resistor or through a diode or any other way so....the point of this is.... find a way to make your own 2nd button schem that will work on all games Last edited by Fabie; 19 November 2009 at 11:02.

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19 November 2009, 09:30	#2
s2325 Zone Friend Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Gargore Age: 43 Posts: 17,789	Are you sure these games have second button option?

19 November 2009, 09:56	#3
TCD HOL/FTP busy bee Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Germany Age: 46 Posts: 31,518	Yes, all of them have a 2 button joystick setting in the options.

19 November 2009, 10:14	#4
pmc gone Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: completely gone Posts: 1,596	I know this sounds obvious - and is possibly stupid (too lazy to check the HRM at the moment and find out ) but my guess would be that the games that the second button doesn't work on don't perform the same check in their code for a press of that second button as the games that it does work on... Edit: To clarify, what I mean is: Is there only one standard defined signal that can come from the joyports that should be regarded as "second joytick button has been pressed"

19 November 2009, 10:22	#5
TCD HOL/FTP busy bee Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Germany Age: 46 Posts: 31,518	Hmm, R-Type and Turrican just support the second button (no need to go to the options). I wonder if it's that simple...

19 November 2009, 10:37	#6
Fabie Banned Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: France Posts: 478	PMC, you can't check on the code of that games how the 2nd button joystick works ************ and according to my A1200 manual page F-8: (Mouse/game controller ports) pin 9 is button 2

19 November 2009, 10:41	#8
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,502	Some games forget to initialize POTGO register (Paula io-register) and only work under KS 1.x.. KS 1.x always enables both joystick port direction bits. KS 2.x+ only enables mouse port (right mouse button = 2nd firebutton)

19 November 2009, 10:59	#11
Retro1234 Phone Homer Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: 5150 Posts: 5,773	Aladdin was realy fucked up - your not using WHDload? - Can you use WHDload?

19 November 2009, 17:33	#13
Retro1234 Phone Homer Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: 5150 Posts: 5,773	I guess if your using Aladdin slave 1.4+ then this is not a software issue.

19 November 2009, 19:12	#15
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,502	At least 3.1+ always rewrites POTGO when it reads status of mouse buttons. (I guess this must have something to do with included CD32 pad support etc?) AFAIK KS 1.x does it only once during reset.

19 November 2009, 19:38	#16
Hungry Horace Wipe-Out Enthusiast Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: . Age: 43 Posts: 2,538	maybe some of these game read CD32-Blue button instead of the normal 2nd button check? i cant be sure, but that might cause a few problems with some.

19 November 2009, 20:31	#18
Retro-Nerd Missile Command Champion Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Germany Age: 52 Posts: 12,435	Bubble & Squeak and Lionheart work indeed with a Sega Mega Drive C-button, but my Tecno Plus pad not.

19 November 2009, 20:38	#20
Retro-Nerd Missile Command Champion Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Germany Age: 52 Posts: 12,435	BC Kid doesn't work with the MD pad, but with the Tecno Plus. Not sure about YoJoe, have to test it.

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