A4000 & A1200 problems, starting to lose the will to live here!

[-Acid-]

I've spent a lot on my Amiga's over the years and now i'm at a stage where I am having trouble making it all work. There is a lot of text here but please spare me some of your time to help me out here and make it all work as i'm losing my marbles trying to fix this lot.

A1200 Problems

System: A1200T, Mediator 1200 TX, Apollo 060 clocked to 66mhz, 64mb fast, Lyra 2 keyboard adapter, Indivision 1, DVD, two mechanical hard drives, Voodoo 3, Sound Blaster 128, Realtek NIC, floppy drive, IDE buffered interface, A2000 keyboard.

Before I added the mediator this system was working fine. However since adding the Mediator once Workbench loads up the majority of the time the keyboard will not respond when typing on it, occasionally if I open a shell or a text editor a random character is constantly appearing as if they key in question is being held down, sometimes the caps lock light will come on when pressed and sometimes it won't, Crrl+A+A seems to work everytime to reset the computer. I've tried three known good keyboards (1x2000 & 2xA4000), and i've tried it with WB 3.1 and 3.9 just to eliminate the possibility it's software related.

On the odd occasion it will power up and the keyboard works, i'm attempting to install the mediator software (i've never seen it working yet). When I run PciInfo it only reports one device attached and it does not know what it is. But when I only had the Voodoo 3 installed it reported that card correctly, then when I added the SoundBlaster it reported that card but not the Voodoo 3.

The power supply is upgraded as the original that came with the tower couldn't power the 060, i've attached a picture of the rating sticker to this post. Could this all be down to the power supply being inadequate again? If not what else could be the problem? I can't remove the 060 to test the Mediator as it requires fast ram at least to work so i'm a bit stumped as to what to do next.

A4000 Problems

System: A4000D(T), Cycberstorm II 060/50, 128mb on CS, 16mb on mainboard (recapped last year), Cybervision 64/3D & scan doubler module, X-Surf 100, two mechanical hard drives, DVD, floppy drive, zip drive, IDE splitter, Buster 11

This was all working fine using P96 but randomly I loaded something up and the system froze. When I rebooted the hard drive had SFS errors so I fixed that (I think I added some removeable drive caddies for the hard drives about this time but i'm not sure if it was before or after this problem started). Now I cannot get the graphics card working again, the system sees it and WhichAmiga reports it correctly but when I install P96 and attempt to run the CVision3D monitor file I get problems.

So once I click on the icon it immediately goes into slow down, if I try to move the mouse it stutters around for a couple of seconds until it completely freezes and the system will not respond. The only option is to reset the computer. If I not attempt to run the graphics card driver the rest of the system works normally. None of this is affecting the scan doubler module that is working fine.

I'm not sure if this could be power related (sorry I do not have any pictures of the A4000 PSU ratings at hand), any ideas on this one?

[Daedalus]

The A1200T - what sort of keyboard adaptor are you using? It sounds like something is messing with the CIA lines used for the keyboard, since the reset is handled separately by the MPU. I vaguely remember many years ago reading in CU Amiga (or maybe AF) that the A1200 Amiga keyboard mod sometimes needed legs of the MPU to be lifted to let the new keyboard's MPU get priority over the one on the A1200 motherboard - clock and data lines would make sense but double-check that before doing anything drastic! Perhaps the Mediator is touching the adaptor you have, or is somehow otherwise asserting the clock and data lines for that CIA?

Some sort of short could also explain funky card ID behaviour. Definitely worth making sure whatever adaptor you're using is well insulated and hasn't poked through any plastic to protect it from the Mediator. In my 1200T I know the Mediator is quite tight on my motherboard so I soldered the keyboard lines directly to the MPU instead of using a socket.

PSU is also a possibility, either strange sags in the +5V line or else noise in the supply can cause all sorts of weird behaviour, especially with marginal signals like the keyboard ones (which are likely in contention with the original ones).

As for the A4000, I can only offer more general advice as I don't have experience myself. I would try removing the IDE splitter and other drives, just in case you're getting some sort of data corruption there. It sounds like something is corrupting the drive, your memory, or both. Any overheating on the Cyberstorm? Is there some sort of RAM tester that can be used for checking all the memory? Perhaps some portion of the memory is faulty and only getting used when you try to open a large screen (which would be a sudden, large data transfer). Again, power supply could be an issue but it's worth checking other things first, such as the RAM connections, Buster seated properly? CPU slot and Zorro connectors all clean and undamaged? Maybe remove the motherboard RAM in case something funky's going on there.

[-Acid-]

thanks for the suggestions Daedalus, fitzsteve also suggested a possible short for the A1200 problems. I'm using a Lyra 2 adapter which is socketed and goes straight onto a chip (can't remember which Gary maybe). Anyway I was using a standard one a long time ago but had to replace it to fit the a Mediator I had in the past (which I never got working, gave up on it and sold) as the PCKey adapter used to stick out too much but the Lyra sits flush with the Indivision allowing the needed clearance.

I'll give it a check and soon and report back. Going to look into the A1200 to begin with and see how that goes.

[utri007]

Is your A1200 mobo powered through mediator? I have similar setup with Zorro extender.

I started to get very weird problems, some moths I thought that those were software problems. Some times OS loads, some times not. Boot to shell make some changes and it works some time. I had also some weird keyboard problems, I also have lyra.

My problem was that A1200 mobo doesn't get enough power through Zorro extender. I cleaned connector etc. and it worked some time.

Cure was solder wires to original A1200 power connector and connect them to PSU. Now it has worked some years without any problems.

What I learnt is, bad connections can make really weird problems.

I have used SFS, PFS and FFS. Now all my system partitions are formated to FFS. FFS is not best, could say it is not even good, BUT there is no problem wich is not solvable. SFS corrupted my hard drive, PFS started to have not enough buffers erros and didn't boot to OS or even DOS.

[nogginthenog]

Check the 4000 has the correct 68060 libraries installed.

My A4000 is very similar spec to yours (same cpu, graphics and x-surf) but I run CyberGraphics. Did you change the position of the zorro cards recently?

[-Acid-]

Originally Posted by utri007

Cure was solder wires to original A1200 power connector and connect them to PSU. Now it has worked some years without any problems.

Yes the A1200 is powered through the Mediator. Would it be safe to plug in two PSU's at once? One through the Mediator and one on the original power jack?

[-Acid-]

Originally Posted by nogginthenog

Check the 4000 has the correct 68060 libraries installed.

My A4000 is very similar spec to yours (same cpu, graphics and x-surf) but I run CyberGraphics. Did you change the position of the zorro cards recently?

The correct libraries must be present or it wouldn't boot at all (but I know i'm using the Phase 5 ones for the A4000). I did move the Zorro cards around but only after this problem started in an attempt to see if that was the problem but it had no affect.

[Daedalus]

Originally Posted by -Acid-

Yes the A1200 is powered through the Mediator. Would it be safe to plug in two PSU's at once? One through the Mediator and one on the original power jack?

Not really, but it is safe to connect two different connections from the same PSU. How people often do it for PPC accelerators is to connect a floppy power cable from the PSU to the floppy power connector on the motherboard in order to add an extra little bit of power to the rails on the motherboard. It's simple to try anyway. FWIW, this will only fix the issue if there's already another issue going on, e.g. a bad connection on the Mediator or accelerator port, or bad regulation from the PSU, so I would investigate further if it does solve the issue.

[Kin Hell]

RE the A4000 issue, why not just do a fresh install of the OS & set your graphics up with CybergraphX? A much better solution for your hardware tbh.
Shame you never had a backup of your Boot Partition with it running fine?

I was never happy trying to run P96 on any of my Cyber-kit I've had over the years. The only success I had with P96 on the Amiga, was with Voodoo's & Mediator boards.

Don't try to install CybergraphX with P96 drivers already in place. You'll never get CybergraphX to run correctly.

[-Acid-]

Originally Posted by Kin Hell

Don't try to install CybergraphX with P96 drivers already in place. You'll never get CybergraphX to run correctly.

I'm just sorting out Classic WB 3.9 to how I like it then I will back it up and start trying to get the graphics card working. I've never tried CGFX so maybe now is the right time to try like you suggest.

[Kin Hell]

Originally Posted by -Acid-

I'm just sorting out Classic WB 3.9 to how I like it then I will back it up and start trying to get the graphics card working. I've never tried CGFX so maybe now is the right time to try like you suggest.

Wish you all the best with the install. Let us know how you get on.

[-Acid-]

Well I've been playing with the A1200 for a few days and things seem to be working on the hardware level. I've had the Mediator working with both a Voodoo 3 and a Radeon 9200SE. I've decided to keep the Radeon in the A1200 and I need to set up everything else. The only problem i'm left with is I can't get any resolution above 800x600 to work (monitor handles it i've had 1600x1200 running on it with other gfx cards).

This must be something to do with the p96mode settings but i'm not sure what yet. I've unticked interlaced for all of those screenmodes but still no joy yet. Any pointers would be helpful.

I'm still getting random keyboard problems but not as many, and to be fair i've not noticed any since I got P96 working so maybe it was all related somehow. Now I know how to get the Mediator installed and set up, i'm going to try and get a Classic WB install working with it and P96 as right now it's working on a very basic 3.0 install.

Will be getting onto the A4000 next...

[-Acid-]

On the A1200 I am still getting occasional keyboard problems as described earlier, last night I had the "key being held down" effect with the number 1 and then the number 6 constantly being spat out. there is definitely no short as the Lyra2 sits flat on the board next to my Indi and has at least 1cm clearance to the Mediator. I could buy another one, but I think next time it's open I will try removing it and re-seating it again and see what happens.

On the A4000 front (as I thought when the Zorram started working after I took the bus board out and put it back in) my graphics card is also working again (CV64/3D). I've never seen WB so beautifully crisp now I've gotten Classic WB P96 up and working, what treat on the eyes Still can't get P96 to work with CWB 3.9 so looks like I am going to try with just OS3.9.

But again I cannot get anything above 800x600 to work. Can anyone tell me what I am doing wrong? when I add the screenmodes above that such as 1024x768 in picasso96mode, the screens display perfectly fine when I hit the test button. But back in WB when I select them the screen goes dark and the monitor goes into standby (which is usually does when it doesn't have a video signal). This used to work before as the first time I had this all working it could do 1600x1200 on this monitor (I needed a magnifying glass to make anything out I admit but it did work).

[zipper]

You could make slight modifications to the failing modes - more/less pixel clock, less hor/ver size and alter hor/ver position on screen.

[-Acid-]

Hey people back with an update.

All A4000 problems are worked out and big resolutions sorted on the graphics card too.

However still have those annoying keyboard problems on the A1200. Most times when I boot the keyboard will not work. Any final ideas on what to do about it? with the mediator removed it works fine, it's not touching anything else so there is no short, it's really getting on my nerves. I want to use it as my main A1200 and put the wedge 030 in another place but this is making it unusable.

Current config: Apollo 060/66, Mediator with just a Radeon 9200SE attached, Indi 1 Aga, Lyra 2, DVD drive, 1 CF adapter, 1 SD adapter

[Pat the Cat]

Hmmm... when I plugged real Amiga keyboard into an A1200, I often had problems with them interfering with the onboard keyboard hardware.

I can't remember how I sorted it, possibly involved diodes to block out the onboard stuff with the signals, but I think that's part of your problem. I had 2 A1200s switchable between one keyboard, and it certainly could be temperamental until I started cutting tracks and making links, so that only the external A1000 keyboard was sending signals. However, it may also be a hardware problem with the onboard keyboard controller. Certainly there's an interrupt for Amiga keyboard hardware, in order to reset with CTRL-Amiga-Amiga. So if the onboard controller misbehaves, it can bring the system down, regardless of what the external keyboard is doing, IIRC.

I think your issues with the Mediator may be both hardware and software related. Never played with one, mind you. But it's quite an ambitious upgrade, would take me a lot of time to get working from a fresh install / system disk rebuilt. Much more so than an A4000, I feel.

I would be tempted to do an audit on watts and power supply. That is quite a bit of hardware, might need a custom PSU to reliably power it. Not necessarily expensive, but CBM PSUs have their limits. Your drives alone are draining a lot, probably more 12V than is available. Plus you are easily pushing 200W on the +5V rail alone, with all your bits and bobs connected. Lot of power needed. Lot of heat generated. Plus, when you just rely on PCB tracks to get the power around, bits furthest from the power supply electrically start failing first, as do greedy components. Sometimes you have to run separate power rails to different areas to get reliable functioning of the whole thing.

That PSU was fine when it was new, but it probably can't supply those values anymore, and even if it can, your setup is edging it at best. Seasonic made some awful PSUs, by the way. It has more supply in +5V, but way less +12V capacity than the Winpower one. Drives need +12 for motor spin up, especially DVD drives and old school hard drives with moving parts.

[Kin Hell]

Originally Posted by -Acid-

Hey people back with an update.

All A4000 problems are worked out and big resolutions sorted on the graphics card too.

However still have those annoying keyboard problems on the A1200. Most times when I boot the keyboard will not work. Any final ideas on what to do about it? with the mediator removed it works fine, it's not touching anything else so there is no short, it's really getting on my nerves. I want to use it as my main A1200 and put the wedge 030 in another place but this is making it unusable.

Current config: Apollo 060/66, Mediator with just a Radeon 9200SE attached, Indi 1 Aga, Lyra 2, DVD drive, 1 CF adapter, 1 SD adapter

Great news on the A4K front fella. Well done.

RE your A1200/Mediator issues:

I never saw issues like that with an Eyetech EZKey adapter. Last one I bought was for a client in Italy back in June 2009, but AmigaKit are fresh out.

The one supplied by Elbox in it's tower case, failed to fit with an Indivision in place & the Eyetech was a great solution at the time.

You could always put up a Wanted thread in Marketplace.