Problematic Demos.

[amilo3438]

Greatest Hits (Musicdisk) by Cult -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=4612

A500 most common ... it stops for a while on pic.1 and continue after some disk activity ... hm, why ??? ... isnt an Amiga multitasking ready !?

Now wondering does the same happens on a real thing ?!

[Toni Wilen]

Originally Posted by amilo3438

Greatest Hits (Musicdisk) by Cult -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=4612

A500 most common ... it stops for a while on pic.1 and continue after some disk activity ... hm, why ??? ... isnt an Amiga multitasking ready !?

Now wondering does the same happens on a real thing ?!

100% guaranteed, even without testing, emulation can't cause this kind of side-effect.

Anyway, tested and real A500 does exact same.

[amilo3438]

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

100% guaranteed, even without testing, emulation can't cause this kind of side-effect.

Anyway, tested and real A500 does exact same.

Thanks ... as now are removed all doubt.

[amilo3438]

Boring Filled Vectors (Intro) by Intuition -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=15925

A500 (most common) ... after some cca 25 seconds it starts to behave strange like slowing down !!! ... (Note: If CE=OFF it doesnt happens!)

p.s. It seems the demo has been updated recently on the above link.

EDIT: JFI ... on 2.6.1 it behaves same but on an older 2.0.1 it doesnt work!


Hot New Stuff From the Hottest Group (Intro) by Intuition -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=29216

A500 (most common) ... glitches on upper side ... pic.1! (Note: Also its partly visible if filter option is set to Fullscreen TV.)

[Toni Wilen]

Originally Posted by amilo3438

Boring Filled Vectors (Intro) by Intuition -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=15925

Confirmed, it looks like for some reason system vblank interrupt is left active that wastes some CPU time.

Does not work if ECS Denise (blank screen). Tested on A1000 and A500+ with OCS Denise. (My two other A500s have ECS Denise)

Hot New Stuff From the Hottest Group (Intro) by Intuition -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=29216

A500 confirmed.

[amilo3438]

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

Tested on A1000 and A500+ with OCS Denise.

A500+ OCS ?!

p.s. So, it seems there is now almost no difference between real and emulated Amiga 500. Very good!

[Toni Wilen]

Originally Posted by amilo3438

A500+ OCS ?!

Agnus is of course 2M ECS Agnus. Only Denise is OCS. (Was easiest way to do A500 test)

p.s. So, it seems there is now almost no difference between real and emulated Amiga 500. Very good!

Still not good enough!

[amilo3438]

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

Still not good enough!

Of course, and probably never will ... improvement can only go close but never 100%.

For now I could say it is close 99.99% and 0.01% of this leaving for possible future unknown/undiscovered surprises.

Also, it should be said that the A500 CE emulation is now on a lot of high level than it was a few months ago. Why this did not happen earlier I do not know, but if I could guess a possible reason it might be a WHDLoad ...

a very useful tool indeed, but maybe just because in the last 2-3 years there has been no progress on improvements to the A500 CE emulation ...

because everything in it was working without problems also on fast WinUAE settings.

But however, I was not quite satisfied with such a situation, so it was necessary to do something, and here we are today at a much higher level A500 emulation ...

I have to admit that the trigger for this decision was an interview of 2009.
http://obligement.free.fr/articles_t...wwillen_en.php

[amilo3438]

p.s.
You mentioned in that interview ... quote: "fixing last 1% takes 99% of the time and so on..."
Now I wonder how much time takes for fixing remaining 0.01% ?!


Days Of Thunder (Crack Intro) by Paradox -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=6468

A500 (most common) ... right side of X looks narrow ... pic.1 !!!


JFI ...Ishar 2: Messengers Of Doom (Crack Intro) by Paradox -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=9673

An example of "PAL mode lace" where WinUAE option "Double, fields" works/looks better than "Double, frames"!


Hit the Road (Megademo) by Flash Production -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=2754

A500 (most common) ... it starts to behave strange like slowing down on part shown on pic.2 (using headphones) !!! ... (Note: CE=OFF it doesnt happens!)

EDIT: It seems the slowing down in CE mode starts to happen from WinUAE 2.3.2 (2011-06-02) version !!! (Note: In WinUAE 2.3.1 (2011-02-25) working fine.)

[mark_k]

Originally Posted by amilo3438

An example of "PAL mode lace" where WinUAE option "Double, fields" works/looks better than "Double, frames"!

I'm not sure what the reasoning for the old Double, frames method was, but with that every other field is shown one field too late. In the majority of cases Double, fields should give better results. Though there are some specific cases where (for example) horizontally scrolling text at just the right speed might look better with the old method.

If you can recall any interlaced demos which use vertically scrolling text, I reckon they should always look better in Double, fields mode.

Off-topic for this thread but I just discovered that on Linux/Wine, using triple buffering gives more or less rock-solid interlace emulation with Double, fields+ mode. (I wasn't expecting that to be possible under Wine.)

[Toni Wilen]

Originally Posted by mark_k

I'm not sure what the reasoning for the old Double, frames method was, but with that every other field is shown one field too late. In the majority of cases Double, fields should give better results. Though there are some specific cases where (for example) horizontally scrolling text at just the right speed might look better with the old method.

Probably as simple reason as: get WB and static interlaced screens working in interlace good enough and save CPU power as much as possible, after all this code was made originally in late 1990s.

[amilo3438]

continuation from http://eab.abime.net/showpost.php?p=...&postcount=549

Megademo - Masters At Work (Megademo) by Flash Production -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=4040

A500 (most common) ... strange behaving like not constant rotation speed of "FLASH" logo in WINUAE CE mode -> demo part shown on pic.1 !!!
(p.s. Start the demo from B disk! ... need some longer time to starts happen!) (Note: test in an older WinUAE 2.0.1 with the same config file and it doesnt happen.)

EDIT: Hm, this might be connected to my WinUAE config ... if turn off Legacy VSync then it works fine !!!

EDIT2: Still it produce sometimes very high CPU usage ... so probably it belongs to this category.

EDIT3: Everything is fine here ... my fault, didnt noticed that my laptop was running on battery!!!

[amilo3438]

Just noticed on newer test winuae 2014-01-06 13:31 ... if press PAUSE-BREAK key cant return back into winuae !!!
(WinUAE running already in window mode ... only way to get out is Alt-F4)

[amilo3438]

It would be very interesting to see does the "Hit the Road (Megademo) by Flash Production" -> http://eab.abime.net/showpost.php?p=...&postcount=549 behaves same also on a real Amiga ?! (Note: This problem is possible to detect only using headphones.)

p.s. After testing some a few hundreds crack intros now realizing how the WinUAE CE mode is really very good ... it seems now too difficult to find even some small demo problem.


Alpha & Omega 2 - Downtown (Demo) by Pure Metal Coders -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=171

A500 ECS ... pic.1 happens after the airplane landed on an aircraft carrier !!!

EDIT: It seems ADFs CRC32 are same as those on http://www.arabuusimiehet.com/break/...ils.php?id=148 ... so all 3 disks should be OK or "hand checked and verified to be working".

[amilo3438]

I have decided to ignore this topic from now ... currently see no point to continue searching for other possible demo/intro problems as everything seems to work fine now and probably it will need wasting lots of time to find any new problem.

Therefore once again, many thanks to Toni for fixing most of the reported demo problems.

Cheers


p.s. In attachment is .dat file list of all already tested demos/intros.


Summary
---------
more than >10.500 demos/intros has been tested in WinUAE

of which are 277 reported as problems (or 2.64% of all tested demos)

of which are 182 confirmed to behave same as on a real A500 (or 65.7% of all reported problems)

so thus were left only 95 of possible WinUAE real problems (or 34.3% of all reported problems)

of which 65 demos/intros has already been fixed (or 68.4% of WinUAE real problems)

so thus left only 30 demos/intros to solve/investigate (or only cca 0.29% of all already tested demos/intros)

therfore, according to this the current WinUAE acuraccy regarding demos/intros would be cca 99.71% (or perhaps even better )

p.s.
From these 30 demos/intros left to solve/investigate it looks that only some 10 make a visible problem in WinUAE (like glitches etc.) ...
so according to this the current accuracy of WinUAE regarding demos is much higher ... cca >99.90% !!!

[Toni Wilen]

Originally Posted by amilo3438

p.s.
You mentioned in that interview ... quote: "fixing last 1% takes 99% of the time and so on..."
Now I wonder how much time takes for fixing remaining 0.01% ?!

Forever. There is some chipset features that can be used to create graphics glitches that are not worth the trouble to emulate

Days Of Thunder (Crack Intro) by Paradox -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=6468

A500 (most common) ... right side of X looks narrow ... pic.1 !!!

A500 confirmed.

Hit the Road (Megademo) by Flash Production -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=2754

Does not slow down on my A500. Probably some rarely used CPU instruction again.

Hello everyone,

don't know if it's my graphic drivers or WinUae bug so could you confirm this ? Demo involved : Rink A Dink Redux (party and final version have same glitch)

Tested on latest WinUae Beta with QS config (A500 / 1.3 ROM, OCS, 512 KB Chip + 512 Slow RAM (most common)).

Graphic glitch occurs only in fullscreen mode with the "demon" picture.
In fullscreen there is glitch in the right part of the picture, not in windowed mode (see attachments).

Anyway thanks for all the work done on Winuae.

[amilo3438]

Skeletors First (Demo) by Cult -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=6133

A500 (most common) ... pic.1 (p.s. It seems I missed this earlier somehow.)

EDIT: Probably there is more links on Kestra Amiga Demo Database that didnt work before and seems it works now.

[Toni Wilen]

Originally Posted by BackSpace

Hello everyone,

don't know if it's my graphic drivers or WinUae bug so could you confirm this ? Demo involved : Rink A Dink Redux (party and final version have same glitch)

Tested on latest WinUae Beta with QS config (A500 / 1.3 ROM, OCS, 512 KB Chip + 512 Slow RAM (most common)).

Graphic glitch occurs only in fullscreen mode with the "demon" picture.
In fullscreen there is glitch in the right part of the picture, not in windowed mode (see attachments).

Anyway thanks for all the work done on Winuae.

Because configs are different, config and log files are always needed. (also "last beta" does not really say much..)

EDIT: good test is to save state in windowed mode, boot in fullscreen and load the state, does something change? (and vice versa)

Originally Posted by amilo3438

Skeletors First (Demo) by Cult -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=6133

A500 (most common) ... pic.1 (p.s. It seems I missed this earlier somehow.)

Left edge lines? Yes, it is exactly right.

[amilo3438]

Wanted (Crack Intro) by Vision Factory & Beyonders -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=15913

A500 (most common) ... strange dots/lines -> pic.1


Another Intro (Intro) by Savage -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=19975

A500 (most common) ... one pixel/star seems static -> pic.2


A New Modem Import - Pot of Fun (Intro) by Symbiosis -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=26672

A500 (most common) ... some glitches -> pic.3 (Note: On 0.5 chip ram it looks different !!!)


Curious (40k Intro) by Abyss -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=20768

A500 (most common) ... broken !!! (works fine in 2.7.0)


(FYI ... on the 1st page "Demos with "blitter active" issues" has been updated with some more demos.)

(p.s. Note: I no longer have so much free time as last year, so I'll try to help when/how much I get.)