Winuae: Sound & CPU Problems... + resulting PC Freeze Problem

Zapp_Brannigan · 09 February 2008, 17:56

Hello.

Well, I had some sound problems already with my WinUAE but it got even worser now. And sorry if there is already a thread about this, but I used the search function and I found nothing helpful.

Ok so here it is (I have Winuae version 1.4.2a btw):

I can play all of my Amiga 500 games normally for a couple of minutes, then the Sound & CPU % get suddenly totally high: The CPU gets up to 120% while the sound gets even up to 160% high.
The sound goes then around crackling, "hanging" around behind what is actually happening on the game + the sound is repeating itself.

I can put the sound buffer size to the maximum and the problem stays, altough it seems to get a bit better. And really, whatever sound-setting I put, it doesnt change a thing.

My PC is not even 1 year old and should actually handle this. New PC games like The Witcher and Overlord work here without problems but the WinUAE doesnt mind that fact. So, I dont really know what is causing my problems here.

Hope you guys and gals could help me. Otherwise:

Toni Wilen · 09 February 2008, 18:22

"Standard test" is to run with sound emulation disabled. You can also try ticking "Do not use RGB overlay" in misc-panel.

(note that I don't support old versions)

Zapp_Brannigan · 09 February 2008, 18:37

Dont use RGB overlays, ok then.

But sorry, where and how do I run a "standard test"?

Toni Wilen · 09 February 2008, 19:51

Disable sound in sound panel. (it is "standard test" because it easily shows if the problem is caused by sound or something else)

Zapp_Brannigan · 09 February 2008, 20:30

Smart thinking there.

And I found something interesting out: I played all the time windowed to have a look at the CPU %. Everything went okay, so I put on the sound... still everything was ok. Then I changed the native mode from "windowed" to "fullscreen" and BAM.... Sound and CPU % get up.

(I had ticked "dont use RGB overlay" to play btw.)

EDIT: I also played now without sound but with fullscreen. CPU gets here way up too.

So, I know now when the CPU problems come but I dont know why?

Toni Wilen · 10 February 2008, 15:00

Ok, it only happens in fullscreen modes. VSync enabled or disabled in display-panel? (does both modes have same problem?)

Does the same happen if you boot with A500 quickstart mode and wait few minutes? What about A1200 quickstart mode? (do not insert any disks)

Display card and driver version? Windows version?

_Steve_ · 10 February 2008, 19:54

I wonder if your issue is something similar to what I experience in this thread, whereby when I go to fullscreen, I get very slow screen updates that affect programs like Octamed or Protracker, such that when the pattern changes, the redrawing is so slow that the sound can be stopped or caused to repeat briefly. In a window, this problem does not happen. I also do not use v-sync in fullscreen, but when testing with it enabled, the same problem occurs.

I am using WindowsXP SP2 on an Intel 6700 with 2GB ram and an NVidia 8800GTX using latest 169.21 forceware drivers.

Zapp_Brannigan · 12 February 2008, 12:55

Well I started the Amiga 500 quickstart mode (without any disks), the PC freezed on me when I closed Amiga. (I left the PC there like maybe for 10 minutes - the CPU was up at 89%).

I let the Amiga 1200 quickstart on but only for some less minutes. CPU was up at 100%.

If I enable Vsync, the game Dyna Blaster has the normal CPU % but the Sound % is way up since the beginning.
With other games, in general it seems to me that Vsync enabled does help a bit. But it still goes, now only just a bit later, again wacko.

I Have Windows XP; as for the driver version, etc. I would have still to need to check what I have.

@_Steve_: Seems like we have more or less a similar problem. But my main problem here is the sound while yours seems to be the graphics. I might have a minor slowdown on the graphics side but I didnt notice it. I was all the time busy beeing frustrated at the sound.

Ian · 20 February 2008, 13:03

I get this problem in windowed mode too.

I will do more testing tonight now I know there seems to be an issue, it only seems to happen with match A500 speed selected for me.

CPU usage never goes above 30%, but the sound is around -160% mark, even with a sound buffer of 7 set.

Zapp_Brannigan · 20 February 2008, 13:25

Alright, good luck mate, testing around can be frustrating.

At least for me it is, since I dont know what some of the stuff on WinUAE means.

Ian · 10 March 2008, 11:37

I have definitely narrowed this down to the match A500 speed setting (disabling all other CPU "hogs" like cycle exact blitter and the other compatibility settings makes no difference as you would expect seeing as WinUAE never uses more than 50% in this mode on my PC).

I know Toni says "use sound buffer 4 or more" which does fix it occasionally, but can anyone else test this with a smaller buffer (2 for example) to see if they have this problem.

I use the most compatible A500 quick start setting, with collision detection turned to full and sound 100% emulated. Maybe it's a PC issue, my mobo has crappy on board realtek AC'97 audio.

Toni Wilen · 10 March 2008, 12:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ian

I have definitely narrowed this down to the match A500 speed setting (disabling all other CPU "hogs" like cycle exact blitter and the other compatibility settings makes no difference as you would expect seeing as WinUAE never uses more than 50% in this mode on my PC).

I know Toni says "use sound buffer 4 or more" which does fix it occasionally, but can anyone else test this with a smaller buffer (2 for example) to see if they have this problem.

I use the most compatible A500 quick start setting, with collision detection turned to full and sound 100% emulated. Maybe it's a PC issue, my mobo has crappy on board realtek AC'97 audio.

You mean you don't get sound problems if you use "fastest possible cpu" setting? Most likely reason is some power saving feature kicking in while WinUAE is idle (waiting for next frame)

Ian · 10 March 2008, 12:03

Hmm, possibly, I have vista set to "balanced" mode. I will try "performance" mode tonight and see what happens.

It is fine when I use fastest possible mode.

Zapp_Brannigan · 10 March 2008, 21:08

Alright wait a bit...

Ok so do I understand correctly, that if I put the CPU on 68020 & "fastest possible but maintain chipset timing" (& let the CPU idle at the very left), everything should be then ok? Or need I do more?

Anyways something I noticed: When the CPU and Sound % on my WinUAE get high, my CPU % of my PC gets 40% high.
Ok, so there is a certain connection... but what could that be?

Toni Wilen · 10 March 2008, 21:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ian

Hmm, possibly, I have vista set to "balanced" mode. I will try "performance" mode tonight and see what happens.

It is fine when I use fastest possible mode.

Does any of following command line parameters change anything:

-busywait
-nordtsc
-forcerdtsc

Ian · 10 March 2008, 22:55

It's better with -busywait, slightly better using -nordtsc only "crackles" a fraction of a second each time every minute or so, far worse with -forcerdtsc, pretty much constant crackling.

I enabled performance mode which has the inbuilt AMD cool and quiet stuff (with the throttle set to 100% and it was fine, no crackling at all.

Zapp_Brannigan · 11 March 2008, 13:23

I am sorry but I dont understand what you both are saying.

Am I capable to put my WinUAE running alright on XP or...?

What do I have to do?

Ian · 11 March 2008, 14:00

Do you have a recent AMD processor?

Zapp_Brannigan · 11 March 2008, 14:04

No, I have a Intel (1600 or so) but its Dual Core.

Bought a new PC 1 year ago or so.

Toni Wilen · 11 March 2008, 14:17

List complete PC specs, including display and sound driver versions. + winuaebootlog.txt.

Something is broken, most likely display driver or power management.

09 February 2008, 17:56	#1
Zapp_Brannigan Registered User Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Funky Town Posts: 39	Winuae: Sound & CPU Problems... + resulting PC Freeze Problem Hello. Well, I had some sound problems already with my WinUAE but it got even worser now. And sorry if there is already a thread about this, but I used the search function and I found nothing helpful. Ok so here it is (I have Winuae version 1.4.2a btw): I can play all of my Amiga 500 games normally for a couple of minutes, then the Sound & CPU % get suddenly totally high: The CPU gets up to 120% while the sound gets even up to 160% high. The sound goes then around crackling, "hanging" around behind what is actually happening on the game + the sound is repeating itself. I can put the sound buffer size to the maximum and the problem stays, altough it seems to get a bit better. And really, whatever sound-setting I put, it doesnt change a thing. My PC is not even 1 year old and should actually handle this. New PC games like The Witcher and Overlord work here without problems but the WinUAE doesnt mind that fact. So, I dont really know what is causing my problems here. Hope you guys and gals could help me. Otherwise:

09 February 2008, 20:30	#5
Zapp_Brannigan Registered User Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Funky Town Posts: 39	Smart thinking there. And I found something interesting out: I played all the time windowed to have a look at the CPU %. Everything went okay, so I put on the sound... still everything was ok. Then I changed the native mode from "windowed" to "fullscreen" and BAM.... Sound and CPU % get up. (I had ticked "dont use RGB overlay" to play btw.) EDIT: I also played now without sound but with fullscreen. CPU gets here way up too. So, I know now when the CPU problems come but I dont know why? Last edited by Zapp_Brannigan; 09 February 2008 at 20:39.

12 February 2008, 12:55	#8
Zapp_Brannigan Registered User Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Funky Town Posts: 39	Well I started the Amiga 500 quickstart mode (without any disks), the PC freezed on me when I closed Amiga. (I left the PC there like maybe for 10 minutes - the CPU was up at 89%). I let the Amiga 1200 quickstart on but only for some less minutes. CPU was up at 100%. If I enable Vsync, the game Dyna Blaster has the normal CPU % but the Sound % is way up since the beginning. With other games, in general it seems to me that Vsync enabled does help a bit. But it still goes, now only just a bit later, again wacko. I Have Windows XP; as for the driver version, etc. I would have still to need to check what I have. @_Steve_: Seems like we have more or less a similar problem. But my main problem here is the sound while yours seems to be the graphics. I might have a minor slowdown on the graphics side but I didnt notice it. I was all the time busy beeing frustrated at the sound. Last edited by Zapp_Brannigan; 12 February 2008 at 13:13.

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09 February 2008, 18:22	#2
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,516	"Standard test" is to run with sound emulation disabled. You can also try ticking "Do not use RGB overlay" in misc-panel. (note that I don't support old versions)

09 February 2008, 18:37	#3
Zapp_Brannigan Registered User Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Funky Town Posts: 39	Dont use RGB overlays, ok then. But sorry, where and how do I run a "standard test"?

09 February 2008, 19:51	#4
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,516	Disable sound in sound panel. (it is "standard test" because it easily shows if the problem is caused by sound or something else)

10 February 2008, 15:00	#6
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,516	Ok, it only happens in fullscreen modes. VSync enabled or disabled in display-panel? (does both modes have same problem?) Does the same happen if you boot with A500 quickstart mode and wait few minutes? What about A1200 quickstart mode? (do not insert any disks) Display card and driver version? Windows version?

10 February 2008, 19:54	#7
_Steve_ Registered User Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: UK Posts: 44	I wonder if your issue is something similar to what I experience in this thread, whereby when I go to fullscreen, I get very slow screen updates that affect programs like Octamed or Protracker, such that when the pattern changes, the redrawing is so slow that the sound can be stopped or caused to repeat briefly. In a window, this problem does not happen. I also do not use v-sync in fullscreen, but when testing with it enabled, the same problem occurs. I am using WindowsXP SP2 on an Intel 6700 with 2GB ram and an NVidia 8800GTX using latest 169.21 forceware drivers.

20 February 2008, 13:03	#9
Ian Global Moderator Join Date: May 2001 Location: Derby, UK Age: 46 Posts: 2,287	I get this problem in windowed mode too. I will do more testing tonight now I know there seems to be an issue, it only seems to happen with match A500 speed selected for me. CPU usage never goes above 30%, but the sound is around -160% mark, even with a sound buffer of 7 set.

20 February 2008, 13:25	#10
Zapp_Brannigan Registered User Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Funky Town Posts: 39	Alright, good luck mate, testing around can be frustrating. At least for me it is, since I dont know what some of the stuff on WinUAE means.

10 March 2008, 11:37	#11
Ian Global Moderator Join Date: May 2001 Location: Derby, UK Age: 46 Posts: 2,287	I have definitely narrowed this down to the match A500 speed setting (disabling all other CPU "hogs" like cycle exact blitter and the other compatibility settings makes no difference as you would expect seeing as WinUAE never uses more than 50% in this mode on my PC). I know Toni says "use sound buffer 4 or more" which does fix it occasionally, but can anyone else test this with a smaller buffer (2 for example) to see if they have this problem. I use the most compatible A500 quick start setting, with collision detection turned to full and sound 100% emulated. Maybe it's a PC issue, my mobo has crappy on board realtek AC'97 audio.

10 March 2008, 12:03	#13
Ian Global Moderator Join Date: May 2001 Location: Derby, UK Age: 46 Posts: 2,287	Hmm, possibly, I have vista set to "balanced" mode. I will try "performance" mode tonight and see what happens. It is fine when I use fastest possible mode.

10 March 2008, 21:08	#14
Zapp_Brannigan Registered User Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Funky Town Posts: 39	Alright wait a bit... Ok so do I understand correctly, that if I put the CPU on 68020 & "fastest possible but maintain chipset timing" (& let the CPU idle at the very left), everything should be then ok? Or need I do more? Anyways something I noticed: When the CPU and Sound % on my WinUAE get high, my CPU % of my PC gets 40% high. Ok, so there is a certain connection... but what could that be?

10 March 2008, 22:55	#16
Ian Global Moderator Join Date: May 2001 Location: Derby, UK Age: 46 Posts: 2,287	It's better with -busywait, slightly better using -nordtsc only "crackles" a fraction of a second each time every minute or so, far worse with -forcerdtsc, pretty much constant crackling. I enabled performance mode which has the inbuilt AMD cool and quiet stuff (with the throttle set to 100% and it was fine, no crackling at all.

11 March 2008, 13:23	#17
Zapp_Brannigan Registered User Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Funky Town Posts: 39	I am sorry but I dont understand what you both are saying. Am I capable to put my WinUAE running alright on XP or...? What do I have to do?

11 March 2008, 14:00	#18
Ian Global Moderator Join Date: May 2001 Location: Derby, UK Age: 46 Posts: 2,287	Do you have a recent AMD processor?

11 March 2008, 14:04	#19
Zapp_Brannigan Registered User Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Funky Town Posts: 39	No, I have a Intel (1600 or so) but its Dual Core. Bought a new PC 1 year ago or so.

11 March 2008, 14:17	#20
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,516	List complete PC specs, including display and sound driver versions. + winuaebootlog.txt. Something is broken, most likely display driver or power management.

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