Amiga 1200 project...just starting out

[NovaCoder]

Hiya,

Although I've never had an Amiga, I feel a strange urge to buy one for the first time and play some retro-games. I thought it might also be fun to have a go at upgrading it and stick a newer operating system on it.

I haven't actually brought myself an old 1200 yet but I have got the following kit already:

• 4-DEVICE BUFFERED IDE AMIGA 1200 ADAPTER
• 2 GIG CF CARD
• IDE TO CF CARD ADAPTER
• TEAC CD224E CD DRIVE
• OS 3.5

I want to retain the standard case to get the authentic look rather than sticking it in a PC case

Questions:

For the best possible picture, should I use a TV with an RGB to SCART cable or will it be better to find an old PC Multisync monitor and go for an RGB-to-VGA connector?

If I accelerate the sucker will it still play the original games ok (ie are they speed selectable)? Which are the best ones to get and how much RAM is recommended...the more the better?

Any other mods are required to build a fast stable system play all 1200/CD32 games and maybe some programming + internet access if practical?

How's the standard power supply going to stand up with a CD/CF Card/Accelerator?

Assume I know nothing and you'll be pretty close to the mark

Thanks
Nova

[DDNI]

Buy a MiniMig and enjoy a New project that will bring NEW business to NEW Amiga projects.
You will pay way over the odds in the current Classic hardware auction frenzy.

[DrF]

MiniMigs are for sale now?
Or is this one of those we buy certain bits and end up puttig together things?

[DDNI]

They are available as kits. Also a guy on Amiga.Org is selling the PCB fully assembled - in very limited numbers though.

[DrF]

Sounds interesting. Now if Individual Computers could hurry up and get us a A1200 clone...

[alexh]

Why would anyone want a CD drive when they can have wireless ethernet + big hard drive?

[P-J]

Originally Posted by DDNI

Buy a MiniMig and enjoy a New project that will bring NEW business to NEW Amiga projects.
You will pay way over the odds in the current Classic hardware auction frenzy.

Could you provide details of the seller? I doubt most people here would be able to build it.

[Zetr0]

@NovaCoder

Hello there, Welcome to the EAB. I am sure you will like it here.

It is interesting how you have found Amiga, especially this time in the game so to say, but for me personally its the most exciting.

A good 1200 is definately the way to go forward, theres more hardware available for one. Alas, I am sure you have seen the prices on ebay escalate over the recent months, its a shame but you can get a good deal now and then.

so what if any would be the best hardware to run games / coding / apps etc... well theres a lot of contention on this one, but hanging out on these and other boards (like a homeless hobo *see post count lol*) the general opinion is the following.

• A1200
  • 68030 CPU Accelerator
  • 32MB of RAM
  • 4GB Hard Disk or CF+ adapter
  • PCMCIA CF adapter (for transfering files from PC)
  • WHDLoad *
  • OS3.1 / 3.5
  • Video - RGB Scart *

The above would probly fetch arround the £100 mark in todays ebay prices, but you never know you might get a good deal...

firstly i have marked "*" some areas that need a little more explanation should that you not know of them (being the new-found amigan you are).

WHDLoad

In a nut shell this is what Amiga has been waiting for! essentially it emulates a floppy disk image thats installed onto a hard disk hences NO DISKS! whoot.

It also can soft-kick for backwards compatibilty, such like the OLD A500 used Kickstart 1.3 (small set of libraries think of it like BIOS) A lot of old games would only work on this particular version of the Amiga BIOS.

in a word, an amiga today without WHDLoad... is well..... an amiga without a hard disk! LOL

for more info

www.whdload.de (well worth registering!)

KG's WHDLoad Game Packs

Video Connection

This is a hot topic here of late, there are many MANY methods to get a decent signal from you amiga to the Monitor / TV so let me list a few here...

I am not to sure how prevailent RGB scart in Oz is, so i will just lay-it out for you...

If all you want to do is play games, then Composite Video would be perfectly fine, admitedly a little washed but with a lot of motion, i doubt it would be overly noticed... the best connection is through RGB.

SVGA MONITOR / TFT ?

The Amiga video only outputs at 15Khz wich is not enough to drive modern TFT's or CRT's there are a few ways arround this..

CRT TFT Tuner
by far the cheapest is buying a CRT / TFT tvt tuner box from fleabay for arround £35.

This will de-interlace screens as well as scan-double them for VGA output. I have one of these and its brillaint.. nice crisp solid screen at super-hires-interlaced!!! not a smidge of flicker sclaed in 1024x768.... fatastic! and its native as far as the miggy is concerned!

heres what i am on about CRT / TFT Tuner Device

Connection to these devices at the moment is composite BUT currently both Narmi (another member of these fair boards) and I are building RGB to SVideo units and since the above can take NTSC as well as PAL signalls it makes the SVideo dongle cheaper too.

see this thread for more info on SVideo Amiga

Other Methods for VGA Connection

Of course there are more expensive methods, you could by for your amiga an internal Scan Doubler / Flicker Fixer. these come up from time to time and usually fetch a VERY high price of late... the last one on ebay sold for over £120!!!!! so err.... might be wise to avoide that me thinks.... lol

You can also get an XRGB Scaler box, I am not to sure if these untis de-interlace a signal.. but these babys are pretty much the dog's dangly bits when it comes to HOME AV equipment ... but they have a VERY nice price too... about the same as the internal SD/FF device... *(ouchie)*

[Charlie]

Hi, welcome
Video: Suprisingly tricky - there is some debate. SCART-enabled TV would be the easiest way to good picture quality. Some TFT TV's will take VGA from an Amiga too ( there are threads here on EAB about the details ). Some may say a TFT's output is 'too crisp' given what to A1200 was designed for...
The bottom line is that most(all?) modern monitors won't scan down to an Amiga's output requiring some creative planning.

Accelerator: Yes, why not? A 68030 or better + RAM + HDD will make your miggy 'nicer'. This also allows fully functional use of WHDLoad. This wonderful software allows Amiga floppy games to be HD-installed even if never intended to be. It will also handle any compatibility issues that crop up as a result of a non-standard CPU. Benefit: No more fiddling with your floppies - unless you like that kind of thing!

Any other mods: Lots can be done! The more you add to an A1200 the more unstabe it is likely to get - esp with some 'known problematic' boards: 1d4 is a good example. Having said that may such boards behave perfectly well! Internet will probably be best done via a 16bit PCMCIA network card attached to a router. Some careful investigation will be needed here. Tips: A1200's have a 'reset problem' with such cards which is more annoying than serous - both software + hardware fixes are available. PCMCIA + some accelerators may clash. If you want both be careful what you buy - can't think of any specifics with '030 & above cards.

Hope this helps - best to have a good search of the EAB regarding specifics & see what you think. Much of the above can be done in a few ways depending on personal preference.
Not all CF cards work with miggies - I hope yours is ok - there's another thread about that too.

Regards.

[cane]

@Zetr0:
You have the same CRT / TFT tvt tuner box as the one in your link?
I've been thinking lately to buy one, but I'd like to hear if it's good or not.

[Zetr0]

@Charlie

'Morning m8y.... your on early today....

I bet you waiting in for you ebay items or as we like to consider it now... historical computational purchases

@cane

Indeedy thts the one I have... ITS FANTASTIC! better than a SD/FF anyday!!!

I think there might be a way to mod-them internall to accept a direct RGB signal, instead of going SVideo or Composite.. when i get some pennies / pocket money from the wifie i will buy another and see what modding i can do me thinks

AND the big AND is, i recognoiter this could be made A1200 internal!!!

[Zetr0]

I will say becarefull though.... make sure you get one that outputs atleast 1024 x 768....

the one i have will do 1280x1024 at 60hz and lower screens at 75hz

if this is sounding a bit crazy with mulitple screen resoultions let me see if i de-confuse it...

the BOX outputs a screen resolution lets say 1024x768x32bit your amiga outputs 640x256x4 (Hires-PAL) this will be scalled to 1024x768x32..

if your amiga outputs 640*512x8 (Hires-PAL-Interlaced 256 colours) the box de-interlaces the signal.. scales the picture and then lumps it to the screen at 1024x768...

if your amiga outputs 1280*512x8 (Supre Hires Pal Interlaced 256 colours) the box de-interlaces the signal, scales DOWN the picture and then pumps it to the screen at 1024x768x32

and so on.... and so on.... its great... the one i have here is using composite atm and its looks great... even for composite! I do look forward to putting SVideo through this beastie. (after I have finnished decorating my daughters bedroom and i get my office / workshop back!!)

[alexh]

Originally Posted by P-J

Could you provide details of the seller? I doubt most people here would be able to build it.

No one is really selling them, they are just playing around at the moment. Getting the parts and the PCB is easy, getting one assembled is hard.

[Charlie]

Hi Zetr0,
Once again it's proven you type faster than me!
'got to get in there early, not early enough it seems!

To all:
I just got one of those boxes Zert0 is on about - bloody brilliant!

Cheap as chips, does an excellent job, arrived @ my house two days after winning the auction.

It's got SA-RiscPC, CD32, & A1200 all plugged in @ the same time ( with sound ) & excellent picture quality! Defiantly something to get!
Thanks Zetr0

If I had a VGA adapter I'd be tempted to see if it can cope with a miggy's scan rate but doing ok with composite.


Oh & I've got this lead-thingy that allows the CD32 to be used as a CD drive for the A1200 - cool!

[Rebel-CD32]

G'day NovaCoder, it's good to see we've got yet another new Amiga user joining us. I agree with the others that the A1200 is the best option for games, and with an 030 and extra RAM it'll be great.

I saw a very nice looking A1200 on eBay in Australia today, looks nice and white still. If you manage to get the IDE-CF adapter to work (I haven't got mine to work with three CF cards I've tested yet), it'll use next to no power at all, and the standard A1200 power supply will be heaps, even with some expansions and peripherals. Even with a hard drive, accelerator and PCMCIA-CF adapter, my A1200 runs fine with the standard power supply. A bigger (A500) type is really only needed if you're adding three external floppies and extra internal hard drives. I think the appeal of the A1200 is its compact, power efficient design anyway.

WHLoad is awesome, I have a 1GB CF card full of games, nicely sorted into directories, and any time I want to install another one I just stick it in the PC and download something to it.

I haven't used a PCMCIA network adapter yet, but it'll be my next purchase. I used my A1200 online for many years and much preferred it over a PC, although these days with all the bloated websites out there packed with CSS, Flash, Javascript, Quicktime, and other shitty hacks that don't even work on the big alternative web browsers, you might not find the web too compatible with current Amiga browsers. It'll be fun to try though. For everything else, like IRC, E-Mail, Telnet, FTP, even MSN, the Amiga does an excellent job. You can still use a modem with the serial port, but if your PC is running it'll probably be better to use a PCMCIA network card.

I'm not sure what kind of CDROM drive you've got or how you'll be connecting or installing it, but I've seen people put laptop CDROM drives in their A1200 cases with the tray opening from the left hand side at the rear. An A1200 with its own CDROM is MUCH better, MUCH more preferable and makes a hell of a lot more sense when playing CD32 games than using a cancer-causing wireless network card connecting to a PC with a big hard drive. So stick with your CDROM.

If you need any local help, you might want to check out the Melbourne Amiga User Group. Their website is here - http://go.to/maug . I'm sure they'd be glad to get you sorted out.

Good luck with everything, and remember to try out some of the awesome software as well as the games. The Amiga is the best if you're a creative, imaginative person.

[Rebel-CD32]

I forgot to mention before, as far as a display is concerned, you can always go for a PAL monitor, like the Commodore 1084S or one of the many clones. These will give you the crispest picture you'll get from a CRT screen, but they're only 14". Using the composite output with a normal TV is fine for games though, I have my A1200 plugged into my 69cm TV at the moment, although the picture is much nicer coming from my CD32 through S-video.

[NovaCoder]

Wow, tons of great advice and ideas to digest...thanx guys!

Yep I've had my eye on that Oz based 1200...watch this space

Why is it better to run OS 3.1/3.5 over 3.9 on an A1200, is 3.9 buggy or just system hungry?

If I did want to plug a CDROM drive directly into the Amiga.....apart from cutting the case and putting a laptop IDE CDROM inside, what are the other options? I have seen the occasional external CDROM that connects using a PCMCIA socket but these seem to be quite rare on eBay. I guess you could also install a segway USB ($$$) and use an external USB driven CDROM (if the OS could recognized it?).

If you fit PCMCIA CF adapter, does the OS just treat it as another drive? Can you copy a CD image (eg using a CD32 disc) onto the memory card using a PC then run the game from the card on the Amiga as if it were a 'real' CDROM? I assume you need to be running an Amiga emulator on the PC to read a genuine CD32 disc in the first place?

Zetr0...your tv tuner box solution will be even better if you can mod it to accept a signal from the 1200's RGB port (I'd buy one off you!).

Thanks again

[Rebel-CD32]

I don't know anyone who prefers OS3.5 over 3.9, I've never used either of them, but the general opinion is that 3.9 is everything 3.5 should have been.

There are a few options for CDROM drives on an A1200. You could get one of those PCMCIA ones if you're lucky, but most people just use IDE or SCSI. You can run an IDE cable out the back of your case coming from the internal IDE port, you could get a Squirrel SCSI adapter for the PCMCIA port (which has CD32 emulation and boots from the CDs the same as a CD32 would), you could get an internal SCSI adapter which conects to an accelerator card (many A1200 030+ cards offer this extra) or you could go the USB option.

Personally, I use a Squirrel SCSI interface with a PC Mini tower which has a PSU, SCSI CDROM and SCSI Hard Drive in it.

You can copy all the files from a CD32 disc to a CF card, but not the CDDA audio, so the game may run but won't have music (if the game used CD music). There are WHDLoad installers for most CD32 games, which is a better option than a direct copy, but again they still don't have CD audio. You'll need a real CDROM drive for that. Then you have to work out an audio-mixing method to hear the internal audio and CD music at the same time.

[Zetr0]

@Rebel-CD32

LOL I must be the only one whom preferes 3.5 over 3.9, its faster, although a little system hungry it NO-WHERE near the almost bloatware of 3.9... but if you have a power miggy, what else is there for it to do lol.

I have always prefered the quickness of 3.1 / (3.5 is quick but not as) I do lke a good 3.1 classic workbench but that could be the retr0 in me

[Mick_AKA]

Originally Posted by Zetr0

LOL I must be the only one whom preferes 3.5

You're certainly not! 3.5 FTMFW!