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Old 20 April 2018, 09:17   #1
Foebane
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Unhappy Questions related to WHDLoad, modifying code and original files...

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Originally Posted by StingRay View Post
Which is why I simply recoded the scroller for the WHDLoad patch.
I hope no-one from the Demoscene or former games developers mind you (or others) changing their code like this for WHDLoad. Have you ever had any of them complaining about changes you've made, even if they were to make the demo or game more compatible?

In any case, this is why I prefer emulation (for every possible config) for Amiga demos, and the original disk images too. I like the code to be "virgin", so to speak. I don't care so much about the games because, well, I don't care much for Amiga games. Actually, I never did.
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Old 20 April 2018, 09:55   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foebane View Post
I hope no-one from the Demoscene or former games developers mind you (or others) changing their code like this for WHDLoad. Have you ever had any of them complaining about changes you've made, even if they were to make the demo or game more compatible?
Code is modified on the fly and only in memory so there is no problem at all. Besides, I can't think of any sane reason why any demo or game coder should have a problem with his/her code to be fixed/patched to work on all Amigas. And often demo coders even ask me to debug their code!



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Originally Posted by Foebane View Post
I hope no-one from the Demoscene or former
In any case, this is why I prefer emulation (for every possible config) for Amiga demos, and the original disk images too. I like the code to be "virgin", so to speak. I don't care so much about the games because, well, I don't care much for Amiga games. Actually, I never did.
We had this discussion several times now, if you prefer "virgin" code then just use the original disks. Others will happily run the patched versions!
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Old 20 April 2018, 10:10   #3
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Code is modified on the fly and only in memory so there is no problem at all.
I've seen the contents of WHDLoad archives and I see these "Disk" files a lot of the time. So you're saying that these disk files are the actual ORIGINAL ADFs of the game floppies or whatever? And you simply patch the relevant code modifications in memory at runtime? If so, where are these patches, in the slave? If WHDLoad is designed to contain the original floppies, etc and just modify them with the relevant patches, then that's brilliant. But I assumed (I shouldn't) that WHDLoad patched the files permanently so the original code was lost.

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We had this discussion several times now, if you prefer "virgin" code then just use the original disks. Others will happily run the patched versions!
I don't know about "several times", but I know I mentioned virgin code at least once before.
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Old 20 April 2018, 10:30   #4
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That's why WHDLoad was born.
Take and preserve the original, patch and modify on the fly (by the slave).
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Old 20 April 2018, 10:45   #5
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Originally Posted by ross View Post
That's why WHDLoad was born.
Take and preserve the original, patch and modify on the fly (by the slave).
What about games/demos that don't have the disk images in the WHDLoad folders? All the files and folders that are there instead, are they extracted from the original ADFs?
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Old 20 April 2018, 10:49   #6
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What about games/demos that don't have the disk images in the WHDLoad folders? All the files and folders that are there instead, are they extracted from the original ADFs?
Yes
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Old 20 April 2018, 11:12   #7
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Thanks, ross. What about high score tables? I've seen Wepl and others stick their names into them, but are the original unaltered HST files there too and are just patched?
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Old 20 April 2018, 11:23   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foebane View Post
Thanks, ross. What about high score tables? I've seen Wepl and others stick their names into them, but are the original unaltered HST files there too and are just patched?
Errm, how about you stop spreading such false information for a change? High score tables are extracted like any other file and not modified at all! Besides, it might help to check the WHDLoad documentation, ALL of your questions asked here are answered there!

Last edited by StingRay; 20 April 2018 at 11:34. Reason: typo
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Old 20 April 2018, 11:40   #9
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Errm, how about you stop spreading such false information for a change? High score tables are extracted like any other file and not modified at all! Besides, it might help to check the WHDLoad documentation, ALL of your questions asked here are answered there!
False information? This screenshot says otherwise.

I think you misunderstood me: What I meant by my previous post is that the original high-score table was there, but patched with Wepl and the other names at runtime, as you said earlier this morning. This game is E-Motion and I had it back in the day, and those names are certainly different from what I remember.

I will read the documentation anyway, as its about time I stopped relying on assumptions.
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Old 20 April 2018, 12:10   #10
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@Foebane, I've had to move all the above posts out of the Ode to Ramon 1 by The Digital Force - Unreadable scroller thread.

Please don't derail threads with unrelated questions...

Just start a new thread
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Old 20 April 2018, 12:34   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foebane View Post
This screenshot says otherwise.
[..] the original high-score table was there, but patched with Wepl and the other names at runtime, as you said earlier this morning. This game is E-Motion and I had it back in the day, and those names are certainly different from what I remember.

I will read the documentation anyway, as its about time I stopped relying on assumptions.
Take this as an exception (a Codetapper "bonus").
Anyway high-score is not runtime patched, is loaded as a simple file (E-Motions.hights) from game folder.
You can delete it and the original high-score will come back out.

And yes, all your doubt is deeply covered in WHDLoad documentation

Last edited by ross; 20 April 2018 at 12:40. Reason: typo
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Old 20 April 2018, 12:40   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foebane View Post
I hope no-one from the Demoscene or former games developers mind you (or others) changing their code like this for WHDLoad. Have you ever had any of them complaining about changes you've made, even if they were to make the demo or game more compatible?

In any case, this is why I prefer emulation (for every possible config) for Amiga demos, and the original disk images too. I like the code to be "virgin", so to speak. I don't care so much about the games because, well, I don't care much for Amiga games. Actually, I never did.
I just can't figure you out, is it a gift being so obtuse? You find MUCH to complain about.

Why would any demo coder object to their badly written code that they wrote in 1989 being improved upon?

Most of those demo coders likely got rid of their Amigas years ago, but sometimes come back for the nostalgia for their old productions.

What would they rather see? Their demo crashing and not working, or a version where their demo runs as they remember it?

In their defence, they wrote their demos for A500 with code that worked for A500 with no expectation that it needed to work on anything other than A500.

As for games developers having an issue, any issues they had about people pissing around with their games was more likely 20 years ago, most are pretty amazed and happy that there is any interest left in their games, and anything that extends the interest in that game is a win for them.

I don't think you realise just how important WHDLoad is, I don't think you realise or appreciate how much its extended the life of real Amiga owners, because without it, without the ability to play so many games from hard drive, many owners would have sold up and moved on.

You've never met a guy on here called Marzattacks/Methodgit, but you sure do remind me of him.
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Old 20 April 2018, 19:23   #13
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@Foebane, I've had to move all the above posts out of the Ode to Ramon 1 by The Digital Force - Unreadable scroller thread.

Please don't derail threads with unrelated questions...

Just start a new thread
Sorry, was only meant to be a single post, but it grew.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ross View Post
Take this as an exception (a Codetapper "bonus").
Anyway high-score is not runtime patched, is loaded as a simple file (E-Motions.hights) from game folder.
You can delete it and the original high-score will come back out.
Confirmed, the original table came back.

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Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
I just can't figure you out, is it a gift being so obtuse? You find MUCH to complain about.
Sorry, I am a moany bastard.

Quote:
I don't think you realise just how important WHDLoad is, I don't think you realise or appreciate how much its extended the life of real Amiga owners, because without it, without the ability to play so many games from hard drive, many owners would have sold up and moved on.

You've never met a guy on here called Marzattacks/Methodgit, but you sure do remind me of him.
You make very good points. I can wax lyrical about WinUAE all I want for multiple Amiga models, but many Amigans will only settle for mostly using real hardware, most will only have one or two machines and WHDLoad is invaluable for that. I must remember that.

What happened to Marzattacks/Methodgit?
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Old 23 April 2018, 09:26   #14
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Well?
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Old 23 April 2018, 12:27   #15
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Why does this matter? it's totally off topic...

Anyway, MethodGit is still around.
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Old 23 April 2018, 16:23   #16
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What happened to Marzattacks/Methodgit?
Slowly but surely he got beaten into not being that obtuse :P
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Old 27 April 2018, 05:06   #17
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You must not understand and know how WHDload works. It’s merely a front end to make it run on more modern Amiga hardware or make it WB friendly. There really isn’t any modifications except to fix any critical bugs, which I’m sure the original programmers would welcome.
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Old 25 May 2018, 17:19   #18
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Thanks for reminding me of MethodGit. It's always a good laugh to read through his posts.
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