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Old 01 January 2021, 20:20   #121
Gilbert
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I've never played on an ST but People often say that many Atari ST games are full screen while the Amiga versions have that annoying space at the bottom. That really bugs me with Amiga games, so I can understand ST guys liking their machine in that case
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Old 01 January 2021, 20:23   #122
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I've never played on an ST but People often say that many Atari ST games are full screen while the Amiga versions have that annoying space at the bottom. That really bugs me with Amiga games, so I can understand ST guys liking their machine in that case
Now I know you're trolling. Give it up FFS.

Everyone.... this guy is 100% trolling... DO NOT PAY THE TOLL TROLL

[ Show youtube player ]


There is an epic thread over at Atari Forum regarding the ST and the border removal techniques they had to use to achieve something that the Amiga could do out of the box.

I had an ST, I hated the thick border around every game, it's why I still appreciate to this day the ST guys who were able to do over scan demos because they were far from easy.

[ Show youtube player ]

Overscan discussion is about from page 18

https://www.atari-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=24855

Last edited by mcgeezer; 01 January 2021 at 20:52.
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Old 01 January 2021, 20:44   #123
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I've never played on an ST but People often say that many Atari ST games are full screen while the Amiga versions have that annoying space at the bottom. That really bugs me with Amiga games, so I can understand ST guys liking their machine in that case
320x200 is full screen is it?

That will be news to 320x256 and overscan on Amiga that literally were the entire screen with no borders.
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Old 01 January 2021, 22:09   #124
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I've never played on an ST but People often say that many Atari ST games are full screen while the Amiga versions have that annoying space at the bottom. That really bugs me with Amiga games, so I can understand ST guys liking their machine in that case
SERIOUSLY???

No, honestly: Seriously???

I guess the other guy is right about Gilbert trolling, certainly reads like it.
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Old 01 January 2021, 22:35   #125
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Er.. I am not trolling. I said I have never played on an ST. I listened to Arcade Perfect podcast (where they compare all versions of a particular game) and they said it on there at least 3 times now for different games for the Atari ST version. Listen for yourself. Feel free to call me a liar *rolls eyes* and them. The Amiga community used to be friendly. You guys are spoiling it.

Most of my Amiga games were not full screen, Team 17 were proud they made their games full screen when so many weren't

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Now I know you're trolling. Give it up FFS.

Everyone.... this guy is 100% trolling... DO NOT PAY THE TOLL TROLL
Please never reply to a comment I make again.

Last edited by Gilbert; 01 January 2021 at 22:44.
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Old 01 January 2021, 22:41   #126
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Er.. I am not trolling.
OK then: do you know WHY 320x200 Amiga games have a big black border on the bottom?
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Old 01 January 2021, 22:41   #127
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SERIOUSLY???

No, honestly: Seriously???

I guess the other guy is right about Gilbert trolling, certainly reads like it.
It’s true though, at least from a practical standpoint if you have an adjustable screen. I can plug a 520ST into a Phillips CM8833 and adjust the screen and pretty much all the games and TOS will fill the screen and be centred without having to mess about with it again.

If I do that on an Amiga, games will randomly be centred to one side or other depending on the whims of the developers, and have either big gaps at the bottom/top of the screen or have bits of the screen cropped. It’s the single most annoying thing to me about Amiga gaming.
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Old 01 January 2021, 22:43   #128
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It’s true though, at least from a practical standpoint if you have an adjustable screen. I can plug a 520ST into a Phillips CM8833 and adjust the screen and pretty much all the games and TOS will fill the screen and be centred without having to mess about with it again.

If I do that on an Amiga, games will randomly be centred to one side or other depending on the whims of the developers, and have either big gaps at the bottom/top of the screen or have bits of the screen cropped. It’s the single most annoying thing to me about Amiga gaming.
Its mainly because limited as it was, the Amiga had a market in NTSC regions for a while.

If you had an ECS Amiga, kick it into 60Hz and you get a game screen thats virtually full screen.

But its certainly not the case on the Atari ST where many "full screen" games had a tiny play area and a score panel that was nearly as big!
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Old 01 January 2021, 22:48   #129
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Er.. I am not trolling. I listened to Arcade Perfect podcast (where they compare all versions of a particular game) and they said it on there at least 3 times now for different games for the Atari ST version. Listen for yourself. Feel free to call me a liar *rolls eyes* and them. The Amiga community used to be friendly. You guys are spoiling it.

Most of my Amiga games were not full screen, Team 17 were proud they made their games full screen when so many weren't



Please never reply to a comment I make again.
The Amiga community is plenty friendly, but you've been fed a load of waffle.

Why were lots of Amiga games 320x200 with a big empty space at the bottom?

Because that was the max resolution of the Atari ST in low resolution, its unfortunately a handicap from the plethora of ST ports the Amiga suffered.

Also its a legacy issue to include NTSC machines, but if you had an ECS Amiga, you could invariably switch to 60hz and you'd have full screen on some of these games.

You would think that someone calling themselves "Arcade Perfect Podcast" would get their information correctly, many Atari ST games had score panels nearly as large as the play area.

Go compare Pacmania on the ST which is 1/4 of the screen, the Amiga is full overscan.

Once the ST was no longer a consideration, programmers routinely made their games larger screened, but certainly the lie you've been told that the ST was regularly full screen gaming is utter nonsense.
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Old 01 January 2021, 22:53   #130
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@Galahad

Exactly.

@Gilbert

If this "Arcade Perfect Podcast" has been feeding their viewers incorrect information, then THEY'RE the trolls. Sorry I called you one.
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Old 01 January 2021, 23:02   #131
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Please never reply to a comment I make again.
I'll reply to whatever and whoever I want as I have the same rights as you on this forum.

If you write crap then you can expect exactly what you put into your posts from me.
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Old 01 January 2021, 23:03   #132
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@Galahad

Exactly.

@Gilbert

If this "Arcade Perfect Podcast" has been feeding their viewers incorrect information, then THEY'RE the trolls. Sorry I called you one.
Thanks man, that's ok

PAL consoles games that haven't been optimised for PAL regions - have small borders at top and bottom of screen (which isn't great in the first place) but Amiga puts it all in one place at bottom of screen which looks bad in comparison. Would be better to centre it. That's why I don't like it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
The Amiga community is plenty friendly, but you've been fed a load of waffle.

Why were lots of Amiga games 320x200 with a big empty space at the bottom?

Because that was the max resolution of the Atari ST in low resolution, its unfortunately a handicap from the plethora of ST ports the Amiga suffered.

Also its a legacy issue to include NTSC machines, but if you had an ECS Amiga, you could invariably switch to 60hz and you'd have full screen on some of these games.

You would think that someone calling themselves "Arcade Perfect Podcast" would get their information correctly, many Atari ST games had score panels nearly as large as the play area.

Go compare Pacmania on the ST which is 1/4 of the screen, the Amiga is full overscan.

Once the ST was no longer a consideration, programmers routinely made their games larger screened, but certainly the lie you've been told that the ST was regularly full screen gaming is utter nonsense.
That makes sense about the 200 vertical size. I remember trying to put games into NTSC with a boot menu. I don't think it stayed in NTSC for every game.

They just said it for a few games. I can't remember which ones. I wonder if one was Rainbow Islands? The Australian guy said it - he has a real ST. But not sure if he has an Amiga - but I think he probably does.

I do remember a letter to The One magazine (i used to read as a teenager) from an ST owner saying the Amiga version of Rainbow Islands was "squashed" in comparison to the ST one - but maybe yes it's a monitor issue.
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Old 01 January 2021, 23:05   #133
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I'll reply to whatever and whoever I want as I have the same rights as you on this forum.

If you write crap then you can expect exactly what you put into your posts from me.
I'm asking you not to.
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Old 01 January 2021, 23:09   #134
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Thanks man, that's ok

PAL consoles games that haven't been optimised for PAL regions - have small borders at top and bottom of screen (which isn't great in the first place) but Amiga puts it all in one place at bottom of screen which looks bad in comparison. Would be better to centre it. That's why I don't like it.



That makes sense about the 200 vertical size. I remember trying to put games into NTSC with a boot menu. I don't think it stayed in NTSC for every game.

They just said it for a few games. I can't remember which ones. I wonder if one was Rainbow Islands? The Australian guy said it - he has a real ST. But not sure if he has an Amiga - but I think he probably does.

I do remember a letter to The One magazine (i used to read as a teenager) from an ST owner saying the Amiga version of Rainbow Islands was "squashed" in comparison to the ST one - but maybe yes it's a monitor issue.
If the programmer/software company didn't stipulate forcing PAL or NTSC then on lots of games, they could be put into 60hz no problem.

However, the likes of The Bitmap Brothers, Psygnosis and a few others put in NTSC checks in their PAL games because they would invariably release a specific NTSC version in those countries that needed it, and they didn't want people importing the UK version which would obviously negate the point of the NTSC version.

Lots of other games, the programmers didn't care and didn't do a check, so could be bumped to 60hz and would stay that way until you reset the Amiga.

Irritating really as the sales market for Amiga stuff in places like America was negligible, but then you have to wonder was it really so bad when developers were going to extra effort to do a specific NTSC version?
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Old 01 January 2021, 23:13   #135
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I'm asking you not to.
I know you are, and I'm declining.

You have form for writing utter nonsense in your threads/posts to the point where you blatantly just get people's backs up.

I'm not a moderator and you can happily make your feelings felt to them about me as you see fit. If they tell me to stop posting replies to your nonsense then I will out of respect to the other members of this forum.

It's pretty much this... anything you write, the opposite is true.
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Old 01 January 2021, 23:54   #136
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Gilbert has indeed no right to tell you not to reply to his posts. On the other hand, you might not need to answer to every post he makes. Only those you feel are the most egregious maybe?

Anyway, it would be nice to have the thread back on tracks...
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Old 02 January 2021, 00:26   #137
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Gilbert has indeed no right to tell you not to reply to his posts. On the other hand, you might not need to answer to every post he makes. Only those you feel are the most egregious maybe?

Anyway, it would be nice to have the thread back on tracks...
Excuse me? I don't reply to every post he makes, this is insinuating that I'm on a search and destroy mission on the guy when I'm absolutely not.

I reply to his nonsense because quite frankly all of it is outrageous and some of it even offensive to people who know their Amiga history.

More than happy to get back on topic so lets crack on.
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Old 02 January 2021, 13:27   #138
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Sorry, I did not mean to insinuate anything. I only based that part on the most recent posts where each of you replied to each other about... replying to each other.

You (and Gilbert) can discuss more with me via PM if you want, so that we can keep the thread clean(er).
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Old 02 January 2021, 15:30   #139
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I have a vague memory of lemmings on the st having backgrounds where the miggy version didn't. Is my memory bad ?
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Old 02 January 2021, 15:37   #140
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I have a vague memory of lemmings on the st having backgrounds where the miggy version didn't. Is my memory bad ?
Yes. it is bad.
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