Modules impossible to rip

[chip]

I sometimes try to rip modules from the prods i see (usually demos)

For this task i use a tool called ExoticRipper and i try directly to extract the module from the file

If this fails, i try to make a dump of the memory and then i use the tool above against the memory dump

In other words, i try both disk rip and memory rip

But there are cases where both of these methods fail and no module is extracted ..... why ?

[Predseda]

Maybe it is just not a module and the other technology is used for music?

[chip]

Yes, you are right Predseda

There are cases where the music is generated in some way

So, i'm talking of the cases where the module is actually present but it's impossible to rip

[StingRay]

Unknown/custom replayer, protected code/data etc. pp. There can be many reasons. But nothing is "impossible" to rip!

[chip]

I see, these are probably cases for guys with Assembly skills

[StingRay]

That's the easiest approach in such case, replayer code is usually very easy to find. And once the replayer code has been located ripping the module is trivial.

Anyway, any example demos where you couldn't rip the modules from?

[chip]

No, StingRay, at the moment i don't have any example

I was much more interested in understanding the technical reason, but as i can see, it's a little difficult to go deep in these details

[meynaf]

Originally Posted by StingRay

Anyway, any example demos where you couldn't rip the modules from?

There are a few demos from which the modules aren't exactly modules and are therefore more or less impossible to rip. For an example, try Incision by Push Entertainment.

[chip]

There's also the case in which the music is simply a sample who is played, so no module at all

[Axxy]

Going back to his original question, Atomic Touch by Dice from Upfront' Plastic Passion would be a good example.. Obviously, not impossible as it's been ripped, but fails both disk & memory rip... I think back in the day, Asle or Peter Kunath ripped it for me...

[chip]

So, the question is HOW to make the rip when both disk and memory rip fails ?

It's probably something for skilled guys i guess

[meynaf]

That depends what the music is !

If it really uses some known format, then the work software such as Exotic Ripper does, must be done "by hand".
Else, it becomes necessary to extract the replay code along with the data...

[mai]

if i remember correctly, some rippers even cant recognize Usual Protracker format, if string "M.K." is missing!

[Ami]

Originally Posted by StingRay

Anyway, any example demos where you couldn't rip the modules from?

Maybe this? - Borst by Ephidrena

[StingRay]

Originally Posted by meynaf

There are a few demos from which the modules aren't exactly modules and are therefore more or less impossible to rip. For an example, try Incision by Push Entertainment.

Incision uses Exploder's sound engine which means samples are precalculated and the soundtrack is rendered to a big .wav sample and then played back. Losts of "new" (post 2000) demos use streamed music.

Originally Posted by Ami

Maybe this? - Borst by Ephidrena

Well, I could simply ask Loaderror for the tune! Anyway, same here as for Incision, it is not a module but prerendered samples which are played back by Loaderror's sound engine.

Originally Posted by Axxy

Going back to his original question, Atomic Touch by Dice from Upfront' Plastic Passion would be a good example.. Obviously, not impossible as it's been ripped, but fails both disk & memory rip... I think back in the day, Asle or Peter Kunath ripped it for me...

Sounds interesting enough, I may have a look.

[StingRay]

And I had a look, reason you couldn't rip the module from Plastic Passion is simply that it has been "protected", pattern data is stored separately and the replayer has been adapted to read the external pattern data. Coding a converter to create a valid Protracker module would be trivial.

[chip]

Thanks for the replies StingRay

[Axxy]

Originally Posted by StingRay

And I had a look, reason you couldn't rip the module from Plastic Passion is simply that it has been "protected", pattern data is stored separately and the replayer has been adapted to read the external pattern data. Coding a converter to create a valid Protracker module would be trivial.

Kind of rings a bell, think that's what Asle was talking about after he sent it to me. I wonder if other productions used the same technique?

[chip]

Old thread i know

But this is something that still make me too curious

This is a practical example of what i said in the original first post

Here

http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=1518

there's a module which "should" be a Mark II sound module

Absolutely no way (for me) to rip it from file or from the memory

Just for curiosity, there's someone that can tell me why this module is "impossible" to rip ?

[wazza]

The reason is as explained above - it's not a module but a different (mark ii) format.